It doesn't terrify them it just makes for small pots. Many limit players like to play their hands through the river, as in, they don't like to fold. Bigger pots gives them odds to keep drawing.

If they don't get on Bravo and do it right, they will end up like Strat with one pathetic 1/2 table each night.

Maybe for some people, but I’ve seen players say they hate playing short because they feel like they are paying the blinds all the time and they feel they can’t play as nitty. They are obviously out of their comfort zone. They prefer a table with more players so the blinds don’t come around as often.

Rooms with $60 buy-ins can have games with really awful players and still not be worth playing in. Buy in for $300, look around and see no stack much bigger than $200, a couple of players with around $100 and four players with around $20-$50.

There is very little foot traffic around Sahara and not many people walk into the place so I’m skeptical the room would do much better than Stratosphere. Even the Wynn to a lesser extent has problems getting players with one reason being the location isn’t great. Sahara is much farther away from almost everything else.

I think when there are conventions at the main convention center on Paradise, a lot of people stay at Sahara or Westgate and I see them walking up and down Paradise. Plus at least one of the Airlines has a deal with Sahara and everyone stays there on the overnights. They probably don't mess with any gambling or poker but you never know.

It's true, it's expensive for them to sit there and fold waiting for QQ+. At 1-2 the blinds are $9-$12 per hour with a full table, and the more empty seats the more it goes up. Plus the pots tend to be smaller short-handed so when they finally get Aces they'll only win $20-$30. Nits might as well go to a movie instead of playing poker if the table isn't full.

It would be great if Sahara (or another room who wants more business) created a niche for themselves by doing things nobody else is doing. Maybe start a survey here or on Twitter asking what people want that isn't already widely available. Some ideas off the top of my head:

- Have Macau-style rules like no phones or other electronic devices allowed. This might attract more of the Asian tourists who are used to stricter rules to help prevent cheating. It would also make the games a lot more fun and less nitty. AND provide an excuse for someone who doesn't want to be on a phone leash (Honey, I was playing poker, they don't allow phones!). A lot of people want stricter rules like this but they aren't available here.

- Different poker variations (more limit Omaha, stud, pineapple, short deck, dealer's choice, 5-card draw, etc.), maybe with a set schedule so at least one day a week you know you can find that game in Vegas. Or have low-limit mixed games every day. (The mixed game at Wynn is a good start but if you don't get on the table when it opens you aren't getting a seat anytime soon.)

- Mandatory bomb pots, could even be done instead of blinds, like once every ten hands everyone puts in $3 for a bomb pot

- $1 Antes instead of blinds to create more action

- Play classical music or no music, or have set days of the week where you play certain genres and advertise the schedule. (One day has to be Frank Sinatra/Vegas classics!)

- Play a wide variety of TV channels (with closed captions on), not just sports

- Have the poker room completely enclosed with a good air ventilation system or positive air pressure pushing smoke away

- Free bottled water available at the podium without having to order from the waitress (limit two per person per day, more can be requested from waitress) (if you also give free bananas I'm there )

- Pay time instead of rake

- Pay dealers a better wage and advertise that tipping dealers is not expected, or maybe even not allowed

- Have different rules such as people are allowed to take money OFF the table if they win a big pot, as long as they keep at least the minimum buy-in on the table

- Have a ladies' night or tournament once a month. All are welcome to play but on that night ladies can feel more comfortable knowing there will be lots of other women there.

- Have a casino and hospitality industry employee night with a freeroll tournament (show badge for free entry) where the top five or ten percent win $100

- Have a free poker lesson night with play chips for 30 minutes once a week (Saturday at 6pm?)

Emphasis is NOT on making it profitable for pros, emphasis is on making it fun for the 95%-99% of people who lose at poker and consider it a hobby (especially low-stakes, almost no one is winning there).

WTF

Why not?

If they do the same thing everyone else does they'll fail to thrive because there's too much competition and that area is too sketchy for a lot of tourists to walk past.

If Pig4bill were right about conventioneers then Westgate would be hopping.

Very well stated, when blinds are viewed as a cost of just sitting thee. Adjust slightly for the number of times a short-handed table of nits chops blinds per hour, and other such factors .... but the blinds viewed as "seat rent", has some basis v. rake, which is more effectively a charge for playing a hand.

God's waiting room charges blinds, not rake. To some, playing blinds is simply playing a time charge.

We are getting a lot of OTB (on the button) games here in Texas. Really seems to be the best of both worlds. Pushes the action and nits don't have to put in any "dead" money out of position.

No one has asked the important question. Will there be a poker room rate?

Some of these seem like they might be decent ideas. I wonder if a room could distinguish itself with a consistent old-school Vegas vibe. This would include playing Rat Pack music, spreading Stud and Lowball draw with a $3 max rake, and allowing smoking.

Vibe could be part of the differentiation - in addition to game and rules specific ones. Doesn't have to be "old school". Could be something else like country or mafia style. Think of the movie/tv show "Westworld" where guests get to be immersed into an experience. Or themes/vibes could actually change every few weeks or so. Disco, futuristic, Hawaiian, country, 80s, early WSOP, etc.

But the foundation and essence of the differentiation must be games and rules specific. The vibes/theme would just be background.

A good question that the cardroom should ask:

"How can we create an environment that would best maximize the initial trial and consistent long term patronage of locals/regulars? What does such an environment consist of ?"

Having the capability to consistently bring in tourists and live ones may be a part of the achievement of the objective of maximizing initial trials and consistent long term patronage of locals. In other words, the cardroom could actually define their prime business as: Bringing in live meat for the locals, regulars, and pros to constantly devour.

I do think the availability of old-school games in my scenario would be more important than the music. But I think the most important differentiation would be making it a smoking room. This would be a feature that would be very attractive to a defined minority of the poker community that no other room would offer.

Holy crap!!!!!!!!! We have a winner!!!!!!!

I won't play there but boy oh boy a lot of people from all limits would.

FYI, 15% of people smoke. I've seen Foxen, Selbst, and Scotty Nguyen smoke. That's the celebrity end.

Sahara could actually cover all limits with a smoking room.

Sure, allow Vaping, Weed, Cigars. The dealers will love it. lol

They'd have to hire dealers who are heavy smokers and let them smoke while dealing. If the action is good I'd probably play but not often. Would be interesting if they let you 420 too lol.

Every casino in Vegas allows smoking at most of their table games, so clearly enough dealers must tolerate it. I don’t see how it would be different for poker. I’m pretty sure it wouldn’t be be legal to allow weed though.

I am not sure how it actually happened many years ago that slowly poker rooms around the country started going non smoking. I remember at the time thinking that it could never happen because there were so many chain smoking degens at the tables, but it did.

Many years ago I dealt poker, luckily it was only about a year during the still smoking phase, and it was horrible. Once I saw that room go non I knew it could happen anywhere and everywhere.

Also remember a guy that worked as slot attendant/pay outs in a closed room full of slot degens for a few years and went to doctor and he had lung cancer and never smoked. That was before fancy ventilation systems became the norm.

AFAIK there isn't a single example of a smaller room being successful with niche offerings unless you count low stakes mixed running at a scheduled weekly time.

The issue is that if anything out of the ordinary is going to succeed it will likely succeed at one of the larger rooms with a larger player bases.

Some examples are Palace Station is dead with maybe one table of 2-4 limit but Boulder Station and one other Station casino (iirc maybe Santa Fe Station?) have kept more tables going even though they are MUCH further from the strip by offering limit Omaha. Orleans also offers limit OE but that's off strip too. So Sahara could be the only room on the strip offering something different than NLHE (except Aria PLO which requires a big bankroll).

The fancy ventilation systems make you not smell the smoke but you are still exposed to the toxins in the air and the biomarkers of secondhand smoke poisons will still show up in your blood.

At any given time there are probably no more than 20 people in all of Vegas that would like such a thing. Or even know what it is when they see it. The chances that more than 3 of them wanting to play poker at the same time are slim.

I just called Sahara....They still can't give a date for the opening of the room....'End of January' is the best they can do.....