fractional games suck... even for home games

didn't O'sheas have a .5/1? what I loved about the oshea set up was that it was exposed to LV blvd. I liked that just like i used to love MGM's old room next to the main walkway

There is a room now, don't know if or when it closed. They only play 2/4 limit with half kill there.

Not really. I’ve been in plenty of limit games that couldn’t get going because limit players hate playing short so much. Anything less than 7 players terrifies them.

Venetian tried something like this when they expanded the poker room a few years ago and had a lot more business than Sahara will ever have. People just didn’t want to play.

Sad to hear the Strat poker room closed. That's where I played my first ever poker session with real money. I'll miss it.

Regarding .5/1 I think it would be great. It offers newcomers a chance to learn with less money to lose, especially if the max buy in is $100. I would've appreciated a table like that when I first started. We need new people to join the game and feel comfortable enough to keep playing.

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MGM tried this and then went away from it. Not sure why. Will they collect enough rake from it?

LINQ tried $1-$1 NL but closed down the room shortly after it opened.

Excalibur has a 1-2 NL game with a $60 minimum and often has several stacks with $100 or less. It can definitely feel smaller than the typical 1-2 game in Vegas.

Maybe you should try starting something bigger than 2/4

Try starting a 10/20, 20/40, 40/80, etc. in Vegas at any casino with a friend besides Bellagio. You’re not going to fill up the table.

I mean it's good to have new people coming in. But also drawing scared money fish away from 1/2 and 1/3 into a basically unbeatable game cause of the rake is not good. Also those new people coming in aren't gonna feel comfortable enough to move up to "real" stakes cause they'll probably lose to the rake/other people.

Some will just be happy to collect comps, chase promotions and chat with other nits and won’t really care too much about long term results. For them the smaller the game the better.

If they were smart they would start off with something like, play 15 hours in a week and get $50 in chips. Something easy for even a tourist to complete. That will get people in the room.

I have no problem with new people playing .5/1. But for the poker economy if fish from 1/2 and 1/3 start playing that instead that's a horrible thing.

+1
I won my first daily poker tournament there. ( I think it was $55+$5 ) I hope they will add more tables as the daily was always big hit there.

New players are called fish due to their inexperience. What I'm really looking forward to is for new players to join the game and get hooked. Once they gain experience what happens mostly is that they develop bad habits and become donkeys. Some of them may move up, some may stay, but I mostly believe that a .5/1 will be beneficial to help newcomers get their foot in the door. Again, not all will become donkeys or make the transition to 1/2 and higher. But lowering the barrier of entry can help.

For the record I prefer to play against donkeys than fish. From my personal experience, if a fish joins and has a bad time (like getting stacked multiple times or worse, gets berated by someone tapping the glass) they usually leave and you never see them again. I've seen it a couple of times. Heck, I've berated some way back when I started (not anymore, I learned my lesson). A donkey on the other hand is stubborn. He needs a really bad experience to quit for good. A donkey can get stacked 5 times in a session and if they still have money and want to play you'll see them again. They keep repeating the same exploitable mistakes without adjusting like a stubborn donkey, hence the nickname. From what I've seen, fish are more willing to adjust and learn than donkeys. But once they develop bad habits and think their game is perfect is hard for them to readjust.

I know I would've never played poker if the lowest stake offered was 2/5. The 1/2 games gave me a chance and there's people out there who may not be able to afford 1/2 now but a lower stake may get them in the game. I wouldn't play the .5/1 now that I know better. But back when I started and the game intimidated me, I know I would have. That's just my personal take on the matter. Sorry for the wall of text. It's interesting to see different opinions on this since I was expecting general support for lower stakes.

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What people are you referring to, that can't afford 1/2nl games? Tourists are on vacation and come with pocket fulls of money to spend on entertainment, whether it be poker, shows, etc. allotting $500 or so for some 1/2nl on vacation is not much and it may last them the entire time.

Donkey tourist know they lose a lot and they bring a lot more money.

Some people visit on a limited budget just to get it off their bucket list. Bringing money for poker was not on their schedule, just $200 or $300 for slots, $5 blackjack, videopoker, etc. A lower stake may encourage them to sit down and play for at least a buy in. Their plan may have been to visit Vegas once, but if they get hooked they may become regulars not just by visiting Vegas more but also back home when they return.

Besides, this new room has 7 tables. Even if all of them are .5/1 it's not like all 1/2 tables will get empty because now everyone wants to play exclusively there. Look at the 1/2 tables. They don't empty the 1/3 tables. I just view it as an opportunity to get new players interested in the game. Even if you don't end up playing against all of them, you and some of us may end up playing against some of them. Be it in Vegas, your local card room, or another poker room somewhere else. I just think this may help increase the player pool.

Edit: Meant to say that the 1/2 tables don't empty the 1/3 tables. Had it the other way around.

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How about .50/1 with 400 minimum buy-in with no maximum?

Anytime someone has less than 150, he has to re-buy for at 100 more or be forced to quit.

This would never run. Recreational players who want to play very low stakes have no interest in playing that deep.

If Sahara did offer a .5/1 game with a normal buy-in (e.g. $50-$200), they would probably have an audience for it. And the demand for 1/2 and 1/3 across LV is deep enough that it wouldn’t really effect those games at other card room. But it would completely cannibalize any 1/2 or 1/3 that Sahara themselves would want to run, and it would probably end up being the only game they spread.

Yes, I have played in rooms that consistently run 2 out of 3 between 1/1, 1/2 and 1/3 and its a disaster. A room should only run 1 of those. If they choose 1/1 then you may as well not even open the room. I am sure they didn't spend all the time and effort to get this going and plan to have 1/1nl.

I haven't, hence my suggestion. I don't intend for them to spread just .5/1, I would also love to see SE offered. But for all we know they may have already decided what to spread and the stakes.

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The target audience would be small bankroll regs and pros who are confident that they are the best deepstack players on the face of the earth. Sahara can advertise is as:

"Guaranteed deepstack .5/1 no limit holdem for skillful players"

yes they have a remodeled (nice) poker room. unfortunately, the bolded is all I've ever seen running there during the day. I can't imagine it's better at night but would be interested to hear different.

Bravo shows 1 game 3/6 limit half kill and 2 games of 2/4 limit half kill.
They mix it up on the weekends. lol

I see they are doing similar to what I mentioned. 20 hours a week for $100.

$100 (or $60 in some places) is a very low barrier for entry. If a fish could not afford that, they aren't gonna be good for the game anyways.

I love the ones that start with $100 and then keep plowing in to their pockets so it's tough to generalize.

Yes! I love them too. If you ask them to buy in for $300 at once they reject it claiming it's a lot, yet they have no problem plowing through $600 one hundred dollars at a time during the session.

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