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Old 09-09-2020, 12:26 AM   #1
dhubermex
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Las Vegas Strip Violence Sparks Security, Room Rate Increase

https://www.reviewjournal.com/busine...rease-2113930/ (Sep 8, 2020)

"Several fights over the weekend along Las Vegas’ tourist corridor have caused at least one casino operator to increase both security measures and room rates in an effort to quell the violence..."

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Old 09-09-2020, 01:02 AM   #2
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Re: Las Vegas Strip Violence Sparks Security, Room Rate Increase

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Old 09-09-2020, 02:17 AM   #3
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Re: Las Vegas Strip Violence Sparks Security, Room Rate Increase

Fights, other violence and an increase in petty crime around the strip and downtown has nothing to do with room rates.

The record downturn in the economy, recently followed by tens of thousands of layoffs in Las Vegas, to be followed by tens of thousands more have created a simmering powder keg in the valley.

The 18,000 employees laid-off by MGM alone accounts for upwards of $1,000,000,000, that's one billion with a "B", in salaries taken out of the valley economy per year.

Barring a sudden turn around in the country's economy and covid19 miraculously disappearing, Las Vegas is on the verge of something never seen in this country. Each ten thousand out of work amounts to five hundred million dollars leaving the greater Las Vegas economy.

I wish everyone there the best.
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Old 09-09-2020, 03:55 AM   #4
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Re: Las Vegas Strip Violence Sparks Security, Room Rate Increase

Wynn is sure the people that started the fight were staying there? Otherwise it just sounds like an excuse to raise rates.
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Old 09-09-2020, 08:12 AM   #5
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Re: Las Vegas Strip Violence Sparks Security, Room Rate Increase

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Originally Posted by pig4bill View Post
Wynn is sure the people that started the fight were staying there? Otherwise it just sounds like an excuse to raise rates.

Wynn would never.

I actually thought from the title they where adding a resort like security fee.
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Old 09-09-2020, 08:13 AM   #6
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Re: Las Vegas Strip Violence Sparks Security, Room Rate Increase

^^^ Dburg brings up an interesting point, very nice perspective. Las Vegas Strip Violence Sparks Security, Room Rate Increase
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Old 09-09-2020, 11:59 AM   #7
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Re: Las Vegas Strip Violence Sparks Security, Room Rate Increase

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Originally Posted by pig4bill View Post
Wynn is sure the people that started the fight were staying there? Otherwise it just sounds like an excuse to raise rates.
I believe they (Wynn) put out a statement saying none of the people in that video were guests.

I agree it's not the cheap rates, it's all of So Cal being closed. People from So Cal are just flocking to the LV to get away. Once Newsom opens up Cali, you'll see the So Cal people stay home more. At least that's my opinion.
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Old 09-09-2020, 12:47 PM   #8
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Re: Las Vegas Strip Violence Sparks Security, Room Rate Increase

I saw there was a post earlier opining that raising room rates would bring visitors down to zero, but it seems to be gone now.

It did make an interesting case and shows how people's perspective can be vastly different. Not better or worse, just different. As a frequent visitor to Vegas (I just booked trip number three post-COVID reopen), and someone who is lucky enough not to have to pay for things at the Wynn, raising room rates DEFINITELY makes me more likely to return. I realize this is a somewhat selfish and entitled opinion, but it's the truth nonetheless. I certainly have noticed anecdotally that some of the people walking around the Wynn since the reopen are far more typical of "riff raff", for lack of a better way of putting it.

It's the little things- they're loud. They're rude. They're obnoxious. They walk around the casino without a shirt on (until they're instructed to put a shirt on). Importantly, they seem to be less willing to mask. Is everyone below a certain net worth like this? Of course not. My family grew up poor and my parents didn't make their money until I was in college. So this is not an indictment on poor people per se, but an observation on SOME of the people I've seen at the Wynn post-reopen who were not as much of a presence before.

Logic dictates that room rates, expense and environment has something to do with this. My July TR where I took my kids for the day to Circus Circus, I noticed no plexiglass and loose enforcement of masks at the craps table. That doesn't happen at the Wynn. And we know Circus Circus and the Wynn are like night and day. Room rates, environment, clientele and "feel" are all related.

To me, the more interesting question is, "if I was paying out of pocket at the Wynn, what increase would I tolerate"? Don't know exactly, but I can say if I can afford it I'm always paying more for a nicer place and NEVER paying for Circus Circus. I wouldn't stay there if they paid me.
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Old 09-09-2020, 02:04 PM   #9
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Re: Las Vegas Strip Violence Sparks Security, Room Rate Increase

Color me shocked.
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Old 09-09-2020, 08:36 PM   #10
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Re: Las Vegas Strip Violence Sparks Security, Room Rate Increase

I'm curious how many of you guys have been in the casino and witnessed a brawl/violence first-hand? Is this kinda thing common on the strip? I would imagine they're generally less common at the higher end properties than the Circus Circuses of the world, but are they still that common?

I also wonder how violence rates on the Strip compare to off-strip locals casinos. Just as an anecdotal data point, I've gone to Vegas pretty regularly (4-6X a year) for the better part of the past decade, but I've stayed almost exclusively at Boyd/Stations locals casinos (e.g. Sam's Town, Boulder Station, etc.)

In that time, I've literally not seen a single fight, much less a full on brawl. Hell, I can count on one hand the number of times I've even seen security escorting anyone out. You would think the locals casinos would attract more the rough methhead sort of crowd, but I've never had any issues or ever felt like I was in danger or was in some sort of chaotic situation.
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Old 09-09-2020, 09:38 PM   #11
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Re: Las Vegas Strip Violence Sparks Security, Room Rate Increase

Right wing paper gonna right wing fear monger
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Old 09-09-2020, 10:24 PM   #12
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Re: Las Vegas Strip Violence Sparks Security, Room Rate Increase

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Originally Posted by Sooga View Post
I'm curious how many of you guys have been in the casino and witnessed a brawl/violence first-hand? Is this kinda thing common on the strip? I would imagine they're generally less common at the higher end properties than the Circus Circuses of the world, but are they still that common?

I also wonder how violence rates on the Strip compare to off-strip locals casinos. Just as an anecdotal data point, I've gone to Vegas pretty regularly (4-6X a year) for the better part of the past decade, but I've stayed almost exclusively at Boyd/Stations locals casinos (e.g. Sam's Town, Boulder Station, etc.)

In that time, I've literally not seen a single fight, much less a full on brawl. Hell, I can count on one hand the number of times I've even seen security escorting anyone out. You would think the locals casinos would attract more the rough methhead sort of crowd, but I've never had any issues or ever felt like I was in danger or was in some sort of chaotic situation.
I've seen the aftermath, just as the cops were slapping cuffs on. But I've never witnessed anyone swinging. I tend to ignore that kind of ruckus though.
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Old 09-09-2020, 10:37 PM   #13
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Re: Las Vegas Strip Violence Sparks Security, Room Rate Increase

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sooga View Post
I'm curious how many of you guys have been in the casino and witnessed a brawl/violence first-hand? Is this kinda thing common on the strip? I would imagine they're generally less common at the higher end properties than the Circus Circuses of the world, but are they still that common?

I also wonder how violence rates on the Strip compare to off-strip locals casinos. Just as an anecdotal data point, I've gone to Vegas pretty regularly (4-6X a year) for the better part of the past decade, but I've stayed almost exclusively at Boyd/Stations locals casinos (e.g. Sam's Town, Boulder Station, etc.)

In that time, I've literally not seen a single fight, much less a full on brawl. Hell, I can count on one hand the number of times I've even seen security escorting anyone out. You would think the locals casinos would attract more the rough methhead sort of crowd, but I've never had any issues or ever felt like I was in danger or was in some sort of chaotic situation.
I've seen some minor ones in the card room I usually was going to. Yelling, some shoving/etc. Only once did I see it escalate into physical violence and security was there so quick it was over within seconds. In fact, to credit of security, I've never seen someone stand up at a table and start yelling/making threats and not see some security on scene within seconds. But pretty rare. Casinos are pretty mum about their security protocol and obviously much of it is to protect the casino/money but protecting the safety of the games running also plays into that. For one the disruptions cause games to stop and thus rake/money to stop. And further along if people feel unsafe they may not come back. I assume, at least in my local card room they take security seriously based on their response times and professionalism.

I think maybe, esp if poker games/rooms are sectioned off in separate rooms/building you get less of the clientele likely to start yelling or fights. After all in most rooms it;s a minimum of $80-$100 just to sit in a poker game; table games and slots far cheaper. And not judging based on wealth level but I imagine if you're walking in to play poker and dropping more than a few bucks to play you're less interested in risking forfeiting that money or letting fighting blow your cash. Maybe.

Not in Vegas but hope everyone out there is staying safe.

Last edited by JeeeroyLenkins; 09-09-2020 at 10:44 PM.
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Old 09-09-2020, 10:47 PM   #14
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Re: Las Vegas Strip Violence Sparks Security, Room Rate Increase

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sooga View Post
I'm curious how many of you guys have been in the casino and witnessed a brawl/violence first-hand? Is this kinda thing common on the strip? I would imagine they're generally less common at the higher end properties than the Circus Circuses of the world, but are they still that common?
I have no (well, little) data to back this up, but I suspect violence is probably WORSE at strip/higher end hotels. I think about the few acts of violence of the top of my head that I remember and it's always at a strip hotel-

- the shooting at some boxing match at MGM maybe 10 yrs ago?
- shooting at (Drai's?), shooter was tackled by a regular person that time
- seen several fights at the Bellagio
- the guys who fled the Bellagio, got into a gunfight with some other wanna be gangsters, killed a cabbie and his fare (7 yrs ago?)
- seen a fight at the Wynn
- this most recent fight at Encore, etc

Purely anecdotally, my guess is you get these guys that think they're "hard", want to show how badass they are, get pissed when someone "disses" them, etc and viola, instant violence. That kind of insecure jackass is going to want to be flashy at a higher end casino, not Circus Circus. You're not a gangsta if you roll at Circus Circus.

None of this changes my opinion that overall riff raff percentage has to be higher at lower end joints. But violence? Yeah, I'd be really curious to know the actual figures.
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Old 09-10-2020, 12:36 AM   #15
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Re: Las Vegas Strip Violence Sparks Security, Room Rate Increase

MGM was 2015 I think. Floyd vs. Manny. Plus the big Tupac fight at MGM after a boxing match which led him to get shot by Ellis Island.

NBA all-star weekend was a disaster here.

FWIW I've been in Vegas for 15 years and I've seen 0 fights downtown and a bunch on the strip. I spend more time downtown too, especially on the weekends where fights are more likely to occur.

Best fight I saw was also at MGM. Three girls came out of Hakkasan arguing and then they slammed some girls head into a slot machine multiple times. Then a bunch of guys showed up and it became a huge brawl.

Also during the NHL finals a couple years back there were fights after the game all over the strip.

IMO Vegas has really shut out the mid-tier gamblers due to reduced comps + resort fees (think the vegasmessageboard.com type people) and that's a big part of this issue. The people who will drop a couple thousand, eat some food, and come back a couple times a year. Most of them just go to locals casinos now because they get more out of their money.

The people at the strip now aren't really gambling. They're here to just drink and go to clubs. But they're not the spend 10k on bottle service club patrons. So what do they really expect. Drunk people are gonna fight.

Last edited by DefNotRsigley; 09-10-2020 at 12:42 AM.
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Old 09-10-2020, 01:16 AM   #16
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Re: Las Vegas Strip Violence Sparks Security, Room Rate Increase

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Originally Posted by Da_Nit View Post
^^^ Dburg brings up an interesting point, very nice perspective. Las Vegas Strip Violence Sparks Security, Room Rate Increase
Thanks for the shout, Da_Nit!

Follow up (this is gonna seem harsh). The next six months to one year are going to be super important to what Las Vegas is going to look like 2-3 years from now.

As I said, for every ten thousand casino/hotel workers who lose their jobs, there is, conservatively, five hundred million dollars taken out of the greater Las Vegas economy. That's 500M$ not spent in local's restaurants, bars, grocery stores, 7-11's, hospitals, rent, bills, etc.

Now, there is a short term gap between things being bad and things tipping over the edge into really ****ing bad. That gap is filled by unemployment. Although it isn't nearly as much as what people were making, it is something. Yet, unemployment runs out, people are evicted, lose homes, condos, leave the state.

The housing crisis was only ten years ago, and because of banking, tax and government policy, which did not put the brakes on wild over leveraged speculation, there's a nuclear warhead buried in the foundation of our economy. All-time record levels of debt in every sector of the economy: housing, student loans, federal deficit, small business, etc.

Lighting the fuse on that nuclear warhead with the covid19 crisis so closely after the housing crisis, baring a miracle, will see regions like Las Vegas, which rely almost exclusively on the service industries, in this case: gamboling, eating, shows, partying, could see Las Vegas become the next Detroit (told you it was gonna get harsh).

Desperate people do desperate things and the physical and psychological toll from the cumulative effect of roads and sidewalks not getting repaired, businesses being boarded-up, not enough to eat, drug use increasing, isn't an addition problem, it's a multiplication problem.

I hope I'm wrong. I hope things turn around. But other **** happening around the country sure ain't helping: fires forcing evacuations on the west coast. The recent hurricane which tore-up 1/4-1/3 of Louisiana only add to the economic issues.

Throw on top of all this the fact that every region of this country now has multiple casinos/hotels. Hell, just in Ohio, where I currently sit typing this book, there are four major casinos and a whole host of racinos which were not here 10 years ago.

I really like Las Vegas. I like downtown. I like Redrock and Mt. Charleston. I want things to turn around. I want to be able to lose what little money I have at a poker table without having to wear a mask and peer through plexiglass.

You may think I'm being dramatic with the Detroit reference, but housing crisis to covid19 crisis to debt crisis all in a 10-12 year span is gonna cause misery in this country like has never been seen before.
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Old 09-10-2020, 02:33 AM   #17
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Las Vegas Strip Violence Sparks Security, Room Rate Increase

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sooga View Post
I'm curious how many of you guys have been in the casino and witnessed a brawl/violence first-hand? Is this kinda thing common on the strip? I would imagine they're generally less common at the higher end properties than the Circus Circuses of the world, but are they still that common?

I also wonder how violence rates on the Strip compare to off-strip locals casinos. Just as an anecdotal data point, I've gone to Vegas pretty regularly (4-6X a year) for the better part of the past decade, but I've stayed almost exclusively at Boyd/Stations locals casinos (e.g. Sam's Town, Boulder Station, etc.)

In that time, I've literally not seen a single fight, much less a full on brawl. Hell, I can count on one hand the number of times I've even seen security escorting anyone out. You would think the locals casinos would attract more the rough methhead sort of crowd, but I've never had any issues or ever felt like I was in danger or was in some sort of chaotic situation.

Iím like you on my Vegas travel and of the opinion that this is much more likely to happen on the strip than elsewhere. Iím also the guy that argues East Fremont and local casinos in NLV feel more safe than walking the strip.
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Old 09-10-2020, 02:37 AM   #18
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Re: Las Vegas Strip Violence Sparks Security, Room Rate Increase

Quote:
Originally Posted by leon View Post
I have no (well, little) data to back this up, but I suspect violence is probably WORSE at strip/higher end hotels. I think about the few acts of violence of the top of my head that I remember and it's always at a strip hotel-

- the shooting at some boxing match at MGM maybe 10 yrs ago?
- shooting at (Drai's?), shooter was tackled by a regular person that time
- seen several fights at the Bellagio
- the guys who fled the Bellagio, got into a gunfight with some other wanna be gangsters, killed a cabbie and his fare (7 yrs ago?)
- seen a fight at the Wynn
- this most recent fight at Encore, etc

Purely anecdotally, my guess is you get these guys that think they're "hard", want to show how badass they are, get pissed when someone "disses" them, etc and viola, instant violence. That kind of insecure jackass is going to want to be flashy at a higher end casino, not Circus Circus. You're not a gangsta if you roll at Circus Circus.

None of this changes my opinion that overall riff raff percentage has to be higher at lower end joints. But violence? Yeah, I'd be really curious to know the actual figures.

Only off strip shootings I can think of was someone posting about one at the Silver Nugget in NLV. Believe that was an employee shooting another employee in the parking lot and SN is a dump even by the standards of NLV.
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Old 09-10-2020, 06:02 PM   #19
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Re: Las Vegas Strip Violence Sparks Security, Room Rate Increase

was playing those full pay VP machines at Cromwell by the front, and a crowd was forming to get into Drais before it opened for the night. A couple of girls got into one of the most entertaining knock-down drag-out hair-pulling shirt-ripping titty hanging out fights ive ever seen.
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Old 09-10-2020, 07:26 PM   #20
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Re: Las Vegas Strip Violence Sparks Security, Room Rate Increase

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Originally Posted by JeeeroyLenkins View Post
I've seen some minor ones in the card room I usually was going to. Yelling, some shoving/etc. Only once did I see it escalate into physical violence and security was there so quick it was over within seconds. In fact, to credit of security, I've never seen someone stand up at a table and start yelling/making threats and not see some security on scene within seconds. But pretty rare. Casinos are pretty mum about their security protocol and obviously much of it is to protect the casino/money but protecting the safety of the games running also plays into that. For one the disruptions cause games to stop and thus rake/money to stop. And further along if people feel unsafe they may not come back. I assume, at least in my local card room they take security seriously based on their response times and professionalism.
I have seen that in a California cardroom. A roided out rager yelling at some poor bastid about something. Basically everyone was just hoping he would calm down because nobody in the room was big enough to stop him if he started in on anyone. Both security guys were greying 5'6" asian dudes, and neither one of them looked like Jackie Chan.
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Old 09-11-2020, 09:31 AM   #21
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Re: Las Vegas Strip Violence Sparks Security, Room Rate Increase

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Originally Posted by macktyson View Post
I believe they (Wynn) put out a statement saying none of the people in that video were guests.

I agree it's not the cheap rates, it's all of So Cal being closed. People from So Cal are just flocking to the LV to get away. Once Newsom opens up Cali, you'll see the So Cal people stay home more. At least that's my opinion.
Most responsible so cal people are sheltering at home.... but that said that does only accounts for the majority of them. (51%+). So you do still have a significant amount of individuals out there doing whatever the heck they want to do.
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Old 09-11-2020, 09:35 AM   #22
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Re: Las Vegas Strip Violence Sparks Security, Room Rate Increase

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Originally Posted by pig4bill View Post
I have seen that in a California cardroom. A roided out rager yelling at some poor bastid about something. Basically everyone was just hoping he would calm down because nobody in the room was big enough to stop him if he started in on anyone. Both security guys were greying 5'6" asian dudes, and neither one of them looked like Jackie Chan.
I've seen some crazy suplex slam of a roudy player at a LA casino before. one player slammed another onto the table breaking it in half. Security was standing around with popcorn in hand, but eventually detained both while the on-duty cops arrived.
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Old 09-11-2020, 09:46 AM   #23
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Re: Las Vegas Strip Violence Sparks Security, Room Rate Increase

$29/day (+ tax) resort security fee coming in.
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Old 09-11-2020, 10:38 AM   #24
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Re: Las Vegas Strip Violence Sparks Security, Room Rate Increase

Quote:
Originally Posted by leon View Post
I have no (well, little) data to back this up, but I suspect violence is probably WORSE at strip/higher end hotels. I think about the few acts of violence of the top of my head that I remember and it's always at a strip hotel-

- the shooting at some boxing match at MGM maybe 10 yrs ago?
- shooting at (Drai's?), shooter was tackled by a regular person that time
- seen several fights at the Bellagio
- the guys who fled the Bellagio, got into a gunfight with some other wanna be gangsters, killed a cabbie and his fare (7 yrs ago?)
- seen a fight at the Wynn
- this most recent fight at Encore, etc

Purely anecdotally, my guess is you get these guys that think they're "hard", want to show how badass they are, get pissed when someone "disses" them, etc and viola, instant violence. That kind of insecure jackass is going to want to be flashy at a higher end casino, not Circus Circus. You're not a gangsta if you roll at Circus Circus.

None of this changes my opinion that overall riff raff percentage has to be higher at lower end joints. But violence? Yeah, I'd be really curious to know the actual figures.
Quote:
Originally Posted by DefNotRsigley View Post
MGM was 2015 I think. Floyd vs. Manny. Plus the big Tupac fight at MGM after a boxing match which led him to get shot by Ellis Island.

NBA all-star weekend was a disaster here.

FWIW I've been in Vegas for 15 years and I've seen 0 fights downtown and a bunch on the strip. I spend more time downtown too, especially on the weekends where fights are more likely to occur.

Best fight I saw was also at MGM. Three girls came out of Hakkasan arguing and then they slammed some girls head into a slot machine multiple times. Then a bunch of guys showed up and it became a huge brawl.

Also during the NHL finals a couple years back there were fights after the game all over the strip.

IMO Vegas has really shut out the mid-tier gamblers due to reduced comps + resort fees (think the vegasmessageboard.com type people) and that's a big part of this issue. The people who will drop a couple thousand, eat some food, and come back a couple times a year. Most of them just go to locals casinos now because they get more out of their money.

The people at the strip now aren't really gambling. They're here to just drink and go to clubs. But they're not the spend 10k on bottle service club patrons. So what do they really expect. Drunk people are gonna fight.
There were brawls the night of the Conor McGregor fight 2 years ago. I happened to be on Freemont that night and was glad I wasn't on the strip.
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Old 09-11-2020, 11:09 AM   #25
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Re: Las Vegas Strip Violence Sparks Security, Room Rate Increase

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Originally Posted by Lattimer View Post
There were brawls the night of the Conor McGregor fight 2 years ago. I happened to be on Freemont that night and was glad I wasn't on the strip.
There's just an element of humanity I will never understand. I come to Vegas to chill, have fun and maybe win some money. Some people are just looking for an excuse to posture.

There are some really frail, pathetic egos walking around out there.
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