Lets start getting some numbers. It's been long enough

When you say "decent win", are we talking around $500? $1000? Just wanted to see if you can throw a value to that term, would make it easier for the reader to understand how your progressing financially in a profession where $/hr can change on a day to day basis.

Good luck with the grind!

Check the low content thread. OP has numerous times reiterated that he will not post detailed results in this thread.

Thread is great without specific numbers. Thanks for sharing Cush.

I've been posting my 2/5 results in the low content thread for a prop bet as McMelchior pointed out. Last update was yesterday in this thread.

I will keep updating that until its over but its just 2/5nl. Thats what I play most of the time anyway so that should give you an idea.

If I play a full session, a decent win is around 100bb. Somewhere near 200bb becomes big. Anything much lower I consider small.

this

Thanks, and your welcome.

What about $5/10 for someone trying to do 35-40 hours?

I'm not qualified to answer that question really as I only have ~125 hours of 5/10.

Here are some of my thoughts on the subject, take them with a grain of salt.

The reason I don't have many hours is because most of the time I don't feel 5/10 is worth playing over 2/5. I hear top notch players still make ~100/hr but at my current skill level if I had to play only 5/10 I could probably do something between 70 and 80. So even though my longterm 2/5 hourly is gonna be between 50 and 60, its at a fraction of the variance of 5/10 so when I say 5/10 isn't worth playing over 2/5 I don't mean the hourly is lower, I mean when you weigh w/r and variance, it makes more sense to me to play 2/5.

Yeah I figured that the $5/10 reg on reg violence makes $2/5 a better choice often.

Congrats on everything and continued positive attitude and good skill at the tables.

Question:

So to further boost win rate while keeping variance in line, would playing in an even deeper 2-5 be preferable to 5-10?

Ie) a 1,500 capped 2-5 like Wynn or Ocean's

In theory yea, though I've heard Wynn 2/5 is much tougher than V so its not necessarily a given that w/r will go up. I haven't actually played at the Wynn though so can't be 100% sure.

You should give it a go. Pretty good game at the right times.

A friend of my (2-5 reg who has been doing this for almost 10 years) who used to play elsewhere but switched to Wynn about 6 months ago told me that in his experience, compared to other 2-5 games, the skill set of players at the Wynn is more polarized.

Basically, because it's a deeper game, it attracts better regs and mistakes are also more costly. However, you are also more likely to get the random rich guy who dumps off 4k playing 2-5.

The Wynn IS INDEED more skill laden than the V(even the Aira is tougher than the V for the most part)

This is brought on by the deepness of the BI structure wil(as you mentioned), your W/R will not go up by simply playing deeper with your style of play. At this point wil, I don't understand why you would want to increase your variance by moving to a tougher game? The only major return on that investment would be that better competition breeds better skills... but you are initially going to pay for that skill increase in terms of variance and lower rates of return.

Bottom line, if you are struggling with normal or short BI structures, increasing BI size will not help you.

Update yo!

I meant to post something this morning but forgot. Since my last update I've only played one session at 2/5 in which I lost but don't remember much else. Had a family emergency that I flew back to Wisconsin for, just got back yesterday.

I am going back to Wisconsin again for about 10 days right before the WSOP so I've only got about a 10 day stretch here before that so I will be hitting it hard starting today. I'm hoping to see the pre-WSOP buildup make for some good 5/10 lineups.

Ah, sorry to hear. gl this week, and i'm interested in buying a small piece of your ME action if you're still considering playing it.

I hope that everything is allright on the home front. Please accept my best wishes for a good outcome both at home and on the felt. Glad to see that you are back.

Great thread. Good luck in Wisconsin.

Yea as soon as I nail down a plan I'll set up a thread for any action I decide to sell and will link here.

Thanks!

Thanks, won't be much pokering in WI but I'll take the luck anyways!

Hey guys, I've been jumping around a little bit this week more than usual in an effort to find a good 5/10 game more often. Wednesday I still played at the V 2/5 and lost a decent chunk. It just seemed like nothing was working. I got check-raised a lot, got 3 bet pre a bunch and just had to fold. I'm not going to repeat it for every session, but this has been the theme all week. Its been a struggle to book a winner and when I do its small. I'm having to bet/fold value hands with much higher frequency than normal. Obviously its just variance and I just keep running into it, but the last couple sessions it has definitely affected my play.

Thursday I ended up at the Bellagio where they had 5 5/10 games going for most of the night. My game was good for most of that time, lots of people limp/folding or limp/calling and playing fit or fold on the flop. I ended up booking a small loser but was very happy with my play.

Friday I went to Red Rock for a local 5/10 that rotates between a few different casinos and is at Red Rock on Fridays. It took a while to get on the 5/10 so I played 2/5 for a while and had a fairly uneventful session except for my last hand where I ran a big bluff against an old nit by representing the flush draw while I was actually on a straight draw. He tanked forever but did end up folding. At 5/10 things got pretty frustrating as I got a couple bad runnouts and then went for 3 streets with an overpair in a spot where the river was a little too thin. This seems to be another mistake I'm making lately. Thin value-betting is important, but I've been taking it too far and going for thin value in spots where I'm not getting called by worse often enough.

Right at the end of my session I dished out the biggest suckout I have every given out by far. UTG raised to 35, 2 calls, I call with AJ, sb folds and bb calls. Flop comes AK8. Preflop raiser checks, next guy bets 50 and another guy calls, I call, bb calls and now the preflop raiser check-raises to 450. The two guys fold and its on me. I felt like if he had hit the flop he'd have bet with 4 other people in the pot so I thought there was a very high chance he was making a move to just squeeze everyone out since the bet was so small (50 into 175). I'm thinking worse case scenario I'm up against a flush draw, possibly with a broadway gutshot. So I shove for just over 1200 total and he thinks for a few seconds and calls. Board runs out T-Q giving me broadway and I scoop. I never actually saw my opponents hand but the way he reacted suggested to me that my read was wrong and I got lucky. He would later tell me he had AK, giving me a whopping 2.15% equity in the pot. I'll take it. I picked up not much longer after, realizing I was not playing well and was fortunate to be back above even.

Yesterday it was back to V 2/5 since I have just not been on my game lately and didn't want to sit at 5/10 where I can make bigger mistakes. Had another fairly frustrating session in which I made a couple mistakes. Already stuck, I ended up bet/folding second set on the turn when my opponent shoved when one of the worst cards possible hit the turn. I had QQ, flop was AQ8, turn was the J. I was getting 2.6:1 to call and assuming he always has the flush I need 3.4:1. I ended up folding but think its really close and after talking to Rob I'm pretty sure its closer to a call just because he could have AJ sometimes. Whatever I do I can't really make a big mistake so I'm fine with the fold. Unfortunately this spot was kinda the last straw and I started doing something I rarely do, visibly steam at the table. I was less than 2 hours into my session though so I didn't want to just leave. I ended up fighting through it and was able to finish a full session playing reasonably well. It was actually quite entertaining because several rec players were discussing books and training material and it was pure comedy to listen to as the things being said were just absurd. One woman told a guy who was fairly drunk that if he was serious about improving his game he should go to a WPT Boot Camp, and I about fell out of my chair laughing since IMO those things are just scams put on by celebrity poker players where they charge 1500-3K for a weekend of teaching strategy ranging from extremely basic to flat out wrong. Anyway it was a good time and I ended up breaking even.

I'm sort of taking off today in that I won't be going to a casino to play but when I was home last week I won a free entry into a $215 tournament on carbon poker that I'm gonna play and then maybe will play a little bit on Ultimate Poker, the new site that just opened up in Nevada. I also plan to do some studying/review because I have not been playing my best and I need to get back on track.

Stay strong. Micro manage yourself a bit, and what I mean by that is just concentration on your immediate 6-8 hour session. Play A game for every second of the next 6-8 hours.

I think your read on the AJ clubs hand was probably right. It screamed of him having a flush draw with broadway draw or 8.

Best wishes and continued good skill at the tables.

Cushlash--

Great thread. You're unusually honest. You seem like the sort to succeed at poker, but you also surely don't need me to tell you that.

I disagree that the Asian guy with AA in that three-handed pot is going to fold everything else because he tanked with AA. Even mediocre players who are tight before the flop have often figured out how to think about overpairs after the flop and have a sense of when QQ is the same strength as AA.

I also think that A987 with three spades is a pretty easy fold when it's 45 more back to you in that PLO pot--but that's the sort of thing I'd like to double-check with someone who knows more about PLO.

All my best,

--Nate

Donks can definitely overvalue AQ/AJ/88 in that spot.

The suited A and K out there definitely drop the number of flush draw combos significantly. Donks are usually looking to just call there especially multiway getting a great price on their draw.

I have been thinking a ton about this hand. Villain was a donk but not all donks are created equal and just because someone is a fish, doesn't automatically make this a call. I feel like if he is the kind of player that would shove turn with AJ despite there being a 3 flush, then he would have raised the flop with AQ or 88. Its just not a common thing to see people flat the flop with big hands on wet boards and then all of a sudden decide to ship it when the scariest card in the deck hits. Fish protect their made hands at the expense of getting value.

He also snap called my flop bet with 3 people behind him yet to act on my cbet and with 88 or AQ he would have at least thought about raising since the board was wet and he would have to worry about the rest of the field having a flush draw.

I also forgot to mention how he shoved the turn. He looked at the dealer and put up his index finger in the universal give-me-a-second gesture, re-checked his cards and then waved his hand over his chips in a forward motion while looking at the dealer and announcing "all-in". All these are massive indicators of a strong hand. Now he could just think AJ is the nuts, but given how he called the flop and putting together the whole hand it doesn't seem all that likely.

EDIT: Also, thanks for the love from moonship and Nate. I really appreciate it.

No need to worry about it any longer, excellent fold.

And thread for that matter.
All the best to you.