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25/50 HU vs Yossarian: MinCR'd on turn 25/50 HU vs Yossarian: MinCR'd on turn

03-28-2008 , 03:26 AM
This hand was played by a friend, he wanted my opinion, and then for me to post it here.

25/50 HU vs Yossarian: Effective stacks 5300. They haven't played alot of hands together, Yoss likely views him as somewhat nitty, ( guessing, as he is). Friend has A 2

Friend makes it 150, Yoss calls.

FLOP (pot $300) K 9 2

Yoss c/c's 200.

TURN (pot $700) 2

Yoss min CR's 500 to 1000.

All comments appreciated. My thoughts below.

Spoiler:
First, vs a variance donk like Yoss, I actually prefer a check on the turn a good % of the time, as from what little I know about him, he is fully capable of CR'ing a full range of hands here, from air to pair+FD, trips, and FH. If we check, we hate a spade of course, but he will bet many rivers and we can call most easily. While the turn MAY still be a fairly standard CR call, depending on the CR size, Yoss will also hammer many rivers, and I think that makes it -EV. Vs the minCR in particular, I have seen more than a few hands where he minraises big hands, then pounds after. If this is the case, the immediate odds of 4.4-1 are just enough if we put him dead on a flush, ( 3 9's, 3 K's, 3 A's, 1 deuce). But the problem with that is:


A: If we DO hit, is he going to bet a flush into a 2 pair board? I don't know quite how crazy he is, but I'm thinking maybe not THAT crazy. Also, our hit can hit him harder if he has A 9x or Kx, ( which I think is unlikely with minCR)
B: We could actually be drawing near dead. Yoss seems to bag big hands preflop much more than most, so KK and 99 cannot be ruled out, and A 2x would suck balls too.

In summation, betting turn puts us in a crappy spot vs an unpredictable player, and makes for a very hard decision on the river unless an ace or 2 hits.

Check turn, fold to minraise. For a nit like my friend, building big pots with guys like Yoss with marginal hands is a bad idea. Nits are better off rope-a-doping these types.
03-28-2008 , 03:34 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Daliman
This hand was played by a friend, he wanted my opinion, and then for me to post it here.

25/50 HU vs Yossarian: Effective stacks 5300. They haven't played alot of hands together, Yoss likely views him as somewhat nitty, ( guessing, as he is). Friend has A 2

Friend makes it 150, Yoss calls.

FLOP (pot $300) K 9 2

Yoss c/c's 200.

TURN (pot $700) 2

Yoss min CR's 500 to 1000.

All comments appreciated. My thoughts below.

Spoiler:
First, vs a variance donk like Yoss, I actually prefer a check on the turn a good % of the time, as from what little I know about him, he is fully capable of CR'ing a full range of hands here, from air to pair+FD, trips, and FH. If we check, we hate a spade of course, but he will bet many rivers and we can call most easily. While the turn MAY still be a fairly standard CR call, depending on the CR size, Yoss will also hammer many rivers, and I think that makes it -EV. Vs the minCR in particular, I have seen more than a few hands where he minraises big hands, then pounds after. If this is the case, the immediate odds of 4.4-1 are just enough if we put him dead on a flush, ( 3 9's, 3 K's, 3 A's, 1 deuce). But the problem with that is:


A: If we DO hit, is he going to bet a flush into a 2 pair board? I don't know quite how crazy he is, but I'm thinking maybe not THAT crazy. Also, our hit can hit him harder if he has A 9x or Kx, ( which I think is unlikely with minCR)
B: We could actually be drawing near dead. Yoss seems to bag big hands preflop much more than most, so KK and 99 cannot be ruled out, and A 2x would suck balls too.

In summation, betting turn puts us in a crappy spot vs an unpredictable player, and makes for a very hard decision on the river unless an ace or 2 hits.

Check turn, fold to minraise. For a nit like my friend, building big pots with guys like Yoss with marginal hands is a bad idea. Nits are better off rope-a-doping these types.
lol
03-28-2008 , 03:34 AM
get to showdown as cheap as possible mode. With zero history I'm probably not looking to fold.

Kirk
03-28-2008 , 03:38 AM
what's your betting range on the turn if you check A2?
03-28-2008 , 03:45 AM
i think both checking turn and folding to the minraise are lol bad
03-28-2008 , 03:52 AM
Is checking the turn a huge level?
03-28-2008 , 03:55 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stinger88
what's your betting range on the turn if you check A2?
Vs him? FH, flush, K, 9, A x, most pairs, some air.
03-28-2008 , 03:59 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Daliman
Vs him? FH, flush, K, 9, A x, most pairs, some air.
you bet a 9 but check a 2? really?
03-28-2008 , 04:17 AM
Just check the a2 down in case he goes for a river c/r as well. All you have is trips Ace kicker against an unpredictable player who is extremely spewey as well.
03-28-2008 , 04:31 AM
Actual analysis of the hand would be appreciated, I know how fun it is to slap me around though.
03-28-2008 , 04:35 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stinger88
you bet a 9 but check a 2? really?
vs nonstandard players, I make a lot of nonstandard plays.
03-28-2008 , 04:37 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by KingDan
i think both checking turn and folding to the minraise are lol bad
So call CR, then call or bet any blank or improved river?
03-28-2008 , 04:39 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Daliman
Actual analysis of the hand would be appreciated, I know how fun it is to slap me around though.
Daliman you posted this in HSNL when it's a not-interesting, 100BB deep hand v a weak opponent. And you suffixed the hand with a frankly terrible analysis. I wrote this reply out before, then went back and edited it to make it as kind as possible since you might be a nice human being. You will get a better response in MSNL or SSNL, sorry.
03-28-2008 , 04:48 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by PartyGirlUK
Daliman you posted this in HSNL when it's a not-interesting, 100BB deep hand v a weak opponent. And you suffixed the hand with a frankly terrible analysis. I wrote this reply out before, then went back and edited it to make it as kind as possible since you might be a nice human being. You will get a better response in MSNL or SSNL, sorry.
I appreciate your restraint, but Yossarian is a player who has been giving some very good HU players a lot of problems over the past couple weeks, and while he may be a bad player, I don't know that "weak" is how he should be described. I guess for the people who don't want to fold here, I am wondering what kind of range they put Yoss on, and are they stacking off vs a blank river? I'd like to think this hand goes deeper than "You have trips, he is bad, don't fold", but maybe it doesn't.

I have played yoss a bit, and watched him a bit more than that, and it really seems like his minraises are usually big hands, please, someone with more experience vs him, correct me if I am wrong.
03-28-2008 , 06:34 AM
I think this hand is pretty obvious, obviously.
03-28-2008 , 06:35 AM
I've railed a few Yoss matches cuz I've thought abou tgettin in on the fun but I still do not know how he plays exactly. Here I would call the turn min silly cr and then call anyt non spade river. I know obvious advice but doesn't he make wild overbets with the nuts/bluffs?? Who mn raises a turn on this board???????
03-28-2008 , 08:07 AM
Dali,
Checking turn with A2 is lol bad and you probably realize that. He never folds a pair or a spade or a high spade. The turn is obviously a bet once he min c/rs i can't decide whether 4bet or call is the best. Prob call but if yossarian is rly bad and spewy 4bet get it in.
03-28-2008 , 08:45 AM
so basically you don't want to bet trips because he's going to check raise you with nothing so frequently
03-28-2008 , 08:48 AM
excellent thread, quality thread, a+ thread
03-28-2008 , 10:19 AM
Sry just realized this quote which is literally makign me lol.

For a nit like my friend, building big pots with guys like Yoss with marginal hands is a bad idea. Nits are better off rope-a-doping these types.

You don't have a marginal hand you have a very strong hand especially because Yoss c/r two pair and fds a lot on the flop. Also if for some reason you misclicked or had a brain aneurysm and checked back the turn you have to raise any non spade non king non nine river.
03-28-2008 , 10:26 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Parlay Slow
so basically you don't want to bet trips because he's going to check raise you with nothing so frequently
yeah thats what i got out of it.
03-28-2008 , 11:55 AM
Haha, your "friend".
03-28-2008 , 12:07 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Daliman
My thoughts below.

First, vs a variance donk like Yoss, I actually prefer a check on the turn a good % of the time, as from what little I know about him, he is fully capable of CR'ing a full range of hands here
lol

Quote:
B: We could actually be drawing near dead. Yoss seems to bag big hands preflop much more than most, so KK and 99 cannot be ruled out, and A 2x would suck balls too.
lol


Quote:
In summation, betting turn puts us in a crappy spot vs an unpredictable player, and makes for a very hard decision on the river unless an ace or 2 hits.
lol

Quote:
Check turn, fold to minraise.
LOLOLOLOOL
03-28-2008 , 12:13 PM
http://www.pokerhand.org/?2311172
http://www.pokerhand.org/?2333058


another good one was when:

he min raised pre, I called 74o.

Flop: 862 1 diamond, I check-called half pot.
Turn: 5d, I check-raised him from $1000 to $3300, and he shoved allin for $26k total effective with KK.
River: OMG I have yossarian drawing dead!!! ship $54k


Cliff Notes: Daliman, I like you, but I can't believe you're actually using logic against an illogical player who doesn't even think.
03-28-2008 , 12:13 PM
i just remembered a time when i was flaming daliman for another one of his random countless ****ty posts and cts came in to defend daliman and said that daliman was better than me at poker

ahahahahahahhaa

      
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