This!
I wanted to yell this into the iPad while listening to the podcast today. "Yes, you might be within the rules, but not everything that is within the rules is fine!"

There's a reason that people were yelling at the TDs last year for not doing something during the tanking happening at the final 2-3 tables (even though it's within the rules and it tilts the other players). It's just bad for the game. And it's inconsistent for TC to have such a beef with tankers, but find this guy ok, when a bunch of professionals found him to be acting out of line.

Where's the boundary in table talk between introducing a Hevad Khan (sp?) rule and something that is good for the game? I think there is a difference and from what I got from the people that were actually there (not from the edited coverage of the ME), he crossed the line into the "bad for the game" territory.

I mean Khan screaming BULLDOZER and WK telling someone he'll show if they do 4 times in a hand aren't really analogous.

He's not disrespectful of his opponents (at least that I've seen), so that immediately puts him ahead of many of the idiots who piss people off at the table.

This episode was before this week when we saw WK tank folding napkins, which T and I both find reprehensible.

He may not disrespect their person (he's not making personal insults, right?), but he is clearly disrespectful of their right to think through and consider their own action.

His behavior is an etiquette rules violation and should not be defended nor tolerated.

The solution seems really obvious -- talk all you want (without insults) while action is on you -- respectfully keep your mouth shut while action is on an opponent. (not including benign chit chat among table mates, obv).

Interesting. Indeed, this is the biggest difference between what (say) Negreanu does and what Kassouf was doing.

Yeah, and Hevad Khan would yell after the hand was over... IOW, he was not interfering with opponents right to consider their own action.

So, by my interpretation of the etiquette rules -- the "9 high like a boss" comment was completely fine. The constant barrage of verbal noise and manipulation while the player was trying to think about what to do with her QQ was not.

Rather than calling clock on the woman, someone should have told Kassouf to STHU -- and, it should probably be a dealer that does that as it can put players in really awkward spots.

Some fair number of people ITT and in the nine-high-like-a-boss thread have posted their view that Kassouf is "good for poker." Could someone explain exacty why his relentlessly repetitive blather is good for the game? I get that he's not a complete ******* -- people that know him say he's respectful and capable of listening, both of which are good qualities -- but good Lord, he's intolerable. Reminds me of the Monty Python travel agent guy, except not nearly as funny.

They mean he's entertaining on television -- they think he can create more viewers, and thus, more noobs interested in the game.

Because we all know they new players want nothing more thank be endlessly baited while trying to learn the game.

People tune in to see people that they react to emotionally, whether or not that reaction is positive or negative. Pro wrestling has heels and faces. Whereas a guy like Keating is a poker face, maybe Kassouf is our equivalent of a heel. Even if Kassouf is a heel, people will tune in to root against him. That means they'll tune in. And that's what poker's popularity was based on: people tuning in on TV to see people they found interesting, or likeable, or annoying.

High level play and all-in pre flips will only draw so many viewers. Past that you need characters. Positive or negative, he's a character.

People probably will tune in more to see Kassouf, but that doesn't mean they will actually drive down to their nearest casino and buy in to a $1/$2 game there, or go deposit $100 on some online poker site.

People also loved to tune in to Breaking Bad on T.V. But did the popularity of that show lead to an increase in middle age high school chemistry teachers become drug dealers and building wealthy meth empires?

Just because people tune into something on T.V. doesn't mean they will be any more or less apt to start doing the thing featured themselves.

Kassouf may well bring the butts to the living room couch, but I see no reason to be convinced that means he'll bring any extra butts to the chairs around the poker tables.

It worked for me. Ask me how.

Adam and Terrence,

How could you stand to interview that guy? Seriously, he blathers on and on and repeats himself viciously in response to every single question, and in some cases he never even answers the question. For example, Terrence, you asked him what his specific strategies were to get opponents to call or fold. He took two minutes of idiotic repetition to say "it depends."

I note also that his example of blather working was getting a call by 2p when he rivered trips. Not necessarily an eye opening event.

Better ratings for poker TV = more likely to be more poker on TV. So even if you're right, surely an indirect benefit if it leads to more poker on TV that _does_ attract players.

In the last 5 years of WSOP coverage, can you name anyone who has "brought extra butts to the chairs around the poker tables"?

Yeah, that's the point I'm arguing. All this good for the game talk, it's not really a thing. No one appearing in the WSOP coverage for a few weeks over September and October is going to really change the number of people playing poker by any even slightly significant amount.

I am so disillusioned that Adam and Terrance find this behavior not only acceptable but desirable. This is totally unacceptable and they haven't provided a single reasonable interpretation that would allow this. IT WAS TAUNTING! 100%

What if 50% of players did this. There would absolutely be no mass participation tournaments. Poker for the non-professional public would essentially die.

What if players got into fistfights at the WSOP table? Short term viewers would tune in to see the carnage but television would quickly get tired of fistfights. Same with these verbal attacks. A few extra people will tune in to see the attacks but they will quickly tire of the annoyance and again, we would see the end of mass participation poker.

Adam and Terrance apparently enjoy seeing other people be abused. As long as it isn't you two you see no harm. Well, when people are verbally attacked they are damaged and most of us have empathy for those under attack.

This guy is a verbal abuser and those that enable him should re-examine their positions.

Why not wave your hands in front of a player when they are trying to make a decision? Is there a rule that says you cant wave your hands? To say that you can do anything if there is no rule against it is nonsense. The WSOP is a brand and if someone takes actions that hurt the brand they must defend it.

This guy is not going to grow poker. He isn't exciting. This makes poker undesirable. That's enough of a reason to reject it.

Clearly I can't speak for them but what I have note having listened to the show for a number of years is the disdain they have for tournament poker. While poker may have brought them success and a career. I hear them constantly complain about the glacial pace and mind numbing nature of tournaments. Unfortunately, tournament poker and specifically the WSOP take up a decent amount of time during the period of May through November so anything that adds a bit of spice to the mix is likely a plus.

Like when Kassouf was waving his hands about, "You and me, if you don't fold, we're going outside and finish this, **** You!"

Just watched two more episodes. Good god, Kassouf is absolutely awful. His relentless repetition is intensely annoying. Terrence, should someone be permitted to pull out a set of cymbals and bang them in your ear while you're thinking? That's all his crap is. "You fold and show I'll show." "Just keeping it friendly." "I have the best hand 100 per cent." SHUT UP YOU MORON.

Not only is he not good for the game, he's stone-cold awful for the game. What human being would actually want to be anywhere near this guy? Table conversation is fine, and often fun. But this isn't that. "I'm gambling with the nuts" while holding a Snickers bar? What is clever or funny about that? It's a joke not even a third-grader would make.

Kassouf is great for televised poker and I think I'd enjoy playing with him at least once, but I'm a bit of a masochist...

Completely understand people who say they wouldn't want to play with him. Can't we get him to join the GPL? Put him in the cube with some guy and it would be fun to watch

From last night's broadcast, Kassouf was talking in many cases in which were, to me, clearly unacceptable. Most frequently, he was talking preflop before he even looked at his cards. Not only does this slow the game down on every single hand, but it is against the rules because at that point it is not a heads-up pot.

Additionally, he was calling out cards and just blathering nonstop when his opponent was all in and drawing to one out (the KK vs. JJ hand where they both flopped sets). This has no strategic value whatsoever and is just taunting an opponent right before he is knocked out of the tournament. How can anyone be defending this guy?

No. Talking about the hand with action left is absolutely against the rules and a massive breach of etiquette, even in a heads-up pot, in tournament play. The fact that even 90% of people on this board don't get this principle is a good demonstration of why it happens and why TDs need to continue to smack the sh*t out of people who do it. The sheer amount of unintentional collusion you get in most live tournaments these days just ruins the game.

I get why it's sometimes justified and tolerated as "good for the game" because most casuals like the chatter. But it's *not* a poker play. Unintentional chitchat is fine, but if he's trying to influence action as part of his strategy, that's absolutely not a legitimate strategy. When non-participating players can have their equity impacted by someone's talk while they're all outside of the pot, that is not "just poker". Keep your table talk strats to cash games.

I think if a woman makes the Nov 9, let alone wins the ME, it would definitely penetrate the female market and drive some numbers. I'm not saying Moneymaker effect, but "slighly significant", sure.

In fairness, most people who were "defending" Kassouf had only seen up to part four of the coverage, and I imagine a few people ONLY saw the nine-high vs. Matuson hand. He definitely looks worse and worse as the tournament wears on.