So I have been working on my swing hard over the past couple weeks.

Here is about 1 month ago.
https://youtu.be/B1PZZzn4e3Q

Now I've done some work. But I now have some an issue I can't seem to stop. Before transition I lean towards the target (see face on view).

New swing
https://youtu.be/gY03jfTvaYk

Has anyone fixed this before? How did you do it?

Is it even bad enough to worry about?

I have other things I'm trying to fix but this one I just can't figure out how to fix it.

You have almost zero hip rotation, all you do is bump and slide them back which your body keeps you in balance by shifting your upper body towards the target. Focus on rotating around your spine to start with your hips and shoulders. I am sure someone can give you a few drills that might help

Is lack of hip rotation in the backswing a bad thing given I still get a full shoulder turn?

The lack of hip rotation in my backswing allows me to create more angle between hips and shoulders and since I still get the club to parallel (before my left arm breaks down) I didn't think there was a need to rotate my hips?

If you see the first video I had a huge hip turn, aided by straightening out my left leg. Which led to the massive overseeing.

yes lack of hip rotation is bad even with a full shoulder turn.

My thoughts would be somewhere in between what you and nt are saying. But I think it will sort itself out if you continue to work on not overswinging because you still are even though it's not as bad as the first video.

Your backswing is too long and way too steep, you want your hands at the top of your backswing to be several inches "left" (from the point of view of the down the line camera). You might try to feel immediately on the takeaway that your hands go toward your right butt pocket.

Best way to feel a way shorter backswing is to just hit little half shots where you try to keep your arms straight the entire time and just let your wrists hinge but don't let your elbows bend.

You are also falling back on your swing....that will cause miss hits and loss of distance.

Oh yeah that was something I forgot last night. You are so stuck at the top that you literally have to stand up straight to get the club back to the ball without hitting it fat. Draw a line down your spine at setup and at impact and you will see. You have to shorten the arm swing and keep your arms more in front of your turning chest so you can stay in your posture.

Yes. Your hips move laterally in your back swing when you need them to turn. In other words, your right(as you see it away from the target, in the video we see it moving left...) hip moves to your right, but it needs to turn back behind you. It should not move to your right at all. By not turning your hips enough you aren't giving yourself enough room to drop your hands and arms into the slot and it is creating an over the top move. You need more hip turn and less shoulder turn IMO.

I would also stand more upright and shorten that backswing. You lose so much distance and control by going that far back. No one ever believes me when I tell them that though. I say "would you rather hit your 7 iron 160-165 EVERY time or hit it 175 some of the time and 155 the other times?"

Thank you all for the help. I took some swings inside today (raining) with a rod on my right hip as a reminder not to hit the rod.

I clearly saw more hip TURN and also eliminated the tilt. It also seemed to eliminate the leaning backwards which was mentioned earlier. I dont quite understand the correlation, but I won't complain. Lastly it seemed to let me to come more from the inside like you said suit.

If I can get outside this week I'll take another video and post it to hopefully move on to my next issue lol.

Also I worked on taking a 1/2 swing and I was stopping at parallel for probably the first time in 15+ years.

Good. What you'll notice with this is that you'll make much more consistently better contact with the center of the face. GL

You really should never be "consciously" turning your hips in the back swing. Your shoulders should initiate the back swing and eventually drag the hips along.

Most people can get ~45* of shoulder turn with the hips hardly moving. The rest of the shoulder turn pulls the hips along.

Biggest problem to me is no spine tilt at address. Your spine needs to be leaning away from the target a little bit at address and then you rotate around your spine on the backswing maintaining the leaning away spine throughout the back swing.

Next thing to work on would be to get your shoulders to turn a little flatter. Your right shoulder looks to go too high and your left sinks too low causing you to lean your spine towards the target at the top of your backswing.

i respectfully disagree with this statement. Although from a video it may seem that the shoulders are initiating the backswing, mine actually begins with my core muscles engaging and working from the ground up. it may not be noticeable from a video because the movements are mostly internal and not exaggerated externally.

think of a boxer throwing a punch or discus thrower. as a boxer, you wouldn't throw a punch by just moving your shoulder back w/o any lower body engagement first. there would be no power behind it. there is an internal coiling action going on with my lower body that may not be visable with video. its like im screwing my feet clockwise into the ground.

the video may show my one piece takeaway as the initial movement, but its only a direct result my core leading the way. I feel that many high handicap amateurs misinterpret the one piece takeaway and just lift with their shoulders. once at the top, since their core muscle were not engaged, everything starts to move simultaneously causing all sorts of issues.

If you lead the backswing with your core it promotes the downswing with the core as well, creating a proper sequence.(lag) again the only visual cue might be a slight hip bump or a slight squat n turn like movement. very minute. its not like you wanna be moving your legs all over the place.

anyway i found this to be a game changer for me and i do okay with this method. disclaimer is i am no teaching pro and this is just my personal opinion derived from multiple sources and thousands or balls being hit. so it can be taken with a grain of salt. after playing golf for more than half my life ive come to learn there is more than one way to skin a cat. main goal is to just have fun.

also how can you tell his spine tilt away from the target on a dtl view. did he post fo vids?

Your core muscles are not really primary "movers". They help stabilize and transfer energy. Starting your backswing from the ground up is not good. The very first move in the golf swing should be your trailing shoulder(right should for righties and vice versa for lefties) rotating backwards around your spine.

Not sure how this is relevant to start of the back swing. Would apply to the downswing in golf and I agree that the lower body is engaged and driving the energy.


I would say that most high handicapers suffer from lack of good shoulder rotation mostly brought on by being taught a plethora of bad ways to start the golf swing. One piece takeaway starts with the shoulders, the hands and arms basically come along for the ride initially. Most people swing their arms laterally in the golf swing entirely too much and lack good shoulder rotation.

Again since the core is not a mover it doesn't initiate the downswing either. Your leading hip should pull towards the target to begin the downswing.

It sounds to me like you are probably making a pretty decent golf swing with the way you describe things, just what you "feel" is happening isn't exactly how the body works.
the 2nd half of videos have FO swings.

some notable instructors would disagree with you on the bold part.

perhaps my terminology is incorrect as i am not a licensed trainer by any means. maybe its not the core or core muscles but what i meant in simple terms is my lower body dictates my upper body and not the other way around.

when you throw a punch, you dont start it by just moving your shoulders and arms back. that would result in a weak arm punch. you plant your back foot and load up on it first. same as a pitcher. you don't move your arm back first or you would end up with a "girly" throw. you plant your back foot and load up first. both are rotary movements that encourage power and speed much like golf.


a one piece takeaway is also desired in my approach. its just that the lower body is initiating it.

put it this way. i can easily start my backswing with a one piece takeaway by moving my upper body completely independently of my lower body(which can remain absolutely stagnant). this is NOT what i want. to go from a static lower body in the backswing to a dynamic one in the downswing will require excellent timing and rhythm and more than likely lead to issues with breakdown of form.

again i dont wanna get tied up with the term "core." i probably am misusing it. but by using the muscles that make up the area of the core in both the backswing and downswing, we are encouraging the big muscle groups to dictate the whole swing, and i believe this helps promote fluid action from start to finish.

i agree what we feel and what we see(especially video) can be drastically different to say the least. however in this case i feel video may not tell the whole story. the "movement" with my lower body that i describe is mainly internal and is difficult if not impossible to see from a grainy video. it would most likely look as if my first movement was a one piece take away with my upper body, but i know the initial movement that got my swing going was a coiling with my lower body into the ground for proper loading.

ah, duh.

http://lessons.powermanifestogolf.co...kinetic-chain/

this guy seems to disagree with you. but he's 5'10" 170 lbs and only hits it 400yds

Long drive isn't exactly golf. He hits it 9 miles and over half of them are probably 100 yards offline (which is just fine for his purpose)

when did i say he was a good golfer? point is that he is relatively small in stature but hits it a mile, so he obviously knows a thing or two about power. my back and forth in this thread was about building the swing from the ground up.

the "analytics guy" nxt... was keen on pointing out how starting the swing from the ground up was not good. this 2 time long drive champ begs to differ.

but thanks for pointing out long drive contests are not the same as playing a round of golf. so enlightened.

OP, good topic......

i finally went for lessons again after being stuck in mid-80's (and don't have time/money/inclination to work it out by playing 3-5 times a week

although my swing doesn't look that much like yours (mine may be worse), i was diagnosed with exactly the same thing and that's all we've worked on... edit: alot of the stuff in your swing looks like mine, some is very different though

my teacher basically has me pulling the back hip back on backswing, front hip back on downswing.

i've been working on ingraining this alot myself. i've found that maybe the focus being on the opposite hips works better..... push forward hip out on downswing, back hip out on downswing. maybe just a feel for swinging out club and training.

you need to fix your posture ASAP....

one frustrating thing about golf is when you go see a teaching... alot of the stuff you thought you were doing you weren't doing at all. sometimes opposite. and some of the "good stuff" you may be doing you are either overdoing it or doing it wrong. like hitting down on ball. pros hit slightly down on ball with hands ahead of the ball. i slam the club into the ground behind the ball.

standing closer to the ball i think is going to fix alot............ even though i would have thought the opposite was my fix........

also, my teaching pro is so adamant at ball forward.. whereas us duffers don't make good contact, we move the ball back further, steeper swing even harder to make good contact.

didn't realize there were 2 videos... before/after.

the after looks much much better.......... posture is 10x better..

still no hip turn in your backswing..... an old teaching pro of mine said keep club handle pointed at belly button as you take it back.

it's funny how every lesson i've taken in last 20 years is mostly the same: too steep... different reasons/fixes though.

my golf pro - and brandle chamblee who just wrote a book on this, think the whole idea of X factor has been way overdone........... i would also presume stack/tilt and/or staying very still over the ball has been overdone too