i could not agree more. very well said

it bugs me that the dominant golf retailer here in canada (golftown) doesn't sell used golf clubs. sells them in bulk to a big USA online (texas?) outfit.

i don't think anything would help the game than access to good used equipment... and for retailers, i'd probably go by every week just to check the used bins for recently added stock. right now i never go to big golf retailer as it's just this year's drivers for $450 and last year's for $250. but i'd rather do last year's used for $100 or 5 years ago used for $40....

and it is just so stupid the idea that you just raise dues to cover anything. can't imagine a worse idea.

Eegatz. Bel-Air is super stiff with somethings. Obviously pants only. And their cell-phone policy is extreme. Even texting verboten. But it is great to have a drink on their patio. Great view.

I think Lakeside is pretty liberal. A lot of drinking and gambling though. Good little course.

I don't know the OC courses as well. Shady used to be super expensive I think. Like $250k to join. And Tiger Woods has/had a membership there.

I f&cking hate the Trump course. But everyone does. Most overpriced worthless golf course ever.

i'm a bit confused............are you looking to quit Pelican? or, be a member at 2 courses?....... i'm thinking all those courses are fairly close to one another, but i might be wrong.

interesting that intiation fees have come way down but monthly dues haven't........ even courses in canada that are almost free to join (say $2000 initiation) still have the hefty $350/month (and all 12 months even though play is only 6-8 months depending on where you live... i guess a few west coast clubs are 12 months but you have to like "slop")

This does not make you seem like a sophisticated golfer.

nitBO

I guess it goes club by club. My club has a full membership and joining has been a great decision. Almost everyone has been super nice, I have a standing invitation to play with any of the regular men's games. I've made friends with a lot of local power brokers. I've also met a lot of fantastic golfers and have learned a lot by playing with them and talking to them. There are a few stick in the muds but everyone basically laughs them off. It is a younger course so not a lot of old money, maybe that helps

This is why I joined a club; I go out 2-3 weekday nights a week to play as many holes as I can. Love it, and I would never do that if I wasn't a member of a club. Another perk is (generally) better and more expansive practice facilities. My current club has a grass driving range (not many of those around at public clubs) with free balls, multiple chipping and putting greens, and a 100-yard short game area with multiple greens to hit to.

I first joined a club a year ago. Club was way cheap to join, and way cheap monthly dues. Course, while in great shape, was pretty boring, and while the membership was very golf oriented, it was also OLD. I'm 33, and other than two members who played regularly around my age, the "young folk" were the early 20s kids of older members.

I just joined a new club, and while it's actually more expensive and stuffier than my first club, the membership is way younger on average. It's kind of the "entry level" nice club in town, so it has quite a few young professionals. I have played quite a few rounds with random people, and more than half have been with people around my age. I don't mind playing with older folks, but it's nice to play with people a little more relatable.

Negative comments I have are being required to tuck my shirt in while playing and practicing (but a lot of people wouldn't have a problem with that), and a quarterly food minimum that doesn't include booze. I'm sure I'll have other complaints, but right now I love the course, have really enjoyed the people I've played with, and appreciate a staff that treats you like you're a paying member of a stuffy-ass country club (which you are). Oh, I also discovered that they'll generally match other retailer's prices on golf gear.

God, this reminds me of my Caddyshack experience I had a few weeks ago. Guy (turns out he was a guest) pulls up to the range blasting some ****ing Goo Goo dolls or some other ****ty old band, smoking a big ass cigar (which I don't mind generally), and TOTALLY decked out in Washington Husky gear, from head to toe, top of bag to bottom. Even had a mini flag. The fact that I'm a Husky fan makes it worse. People looked at him and his wife said "they're probably just not used to your music," and he just said "they'll have to deal with it."

Pelican is not a country club. Hotel/resort course. Good views but not very memorable. Used to be 36 holes but I think they developed inland 18.

Best courses in Los Angeles are all country clubs. I think you can pay like $500 to play Riviera though.

Yea, that's why I put member in quotes. Pelican has gold and platinum memberships, with annual fees for unlimited golf. But it's public. The group of members are a pretty good group.
There are still two courses, north and south. Both good courses but way overpriced at $305.

To each their own.
IMO Golf in general needs to loosen up if it's going to stop the decline. Why would anyone care what shoes I wear so long as I'm not damaging the course?

I've played Riviera several times. $550 plus pro fee and caddie tip.
Last time we were there the "pro" was a washed up teacher from dad miller. He was a mess. He gambled with us and played off of scratch. I beat him outright playing off a 9 at the time.
When we went to the clubhouse to settle he took out two $20s and handed it over. He had actually lost about $400 but we didn't say anything.

Just read LACC will likely host US open in 2023, after historically declining to host the event in years past.

Honestly, I don't care much about the shoes, just think it makes a golfer look like a yahoo. At a public course no big deal, at a private course it reflects poorly on the club.

The boombox however is a different story, it's interfering with others which is not cool.

How you are describing yourself would be typical for a public course, and that's fine. Nothing at all wrong with public tracks. But at most country clubs one is required to conduct themselves a bit differently. And chances are you are not the one to lead private courses into this loosen up mode which you are proposing.

BO

Man that's crazy - I have never heard of leave costs for clubs. That's brutal.

+1 to the idea that there are a lot of archaic-types running and making the decisions for clubs. It's a real shame.

I remember a few years ago when my club was looking for ways to inject new bodies in the membership. I suggested coming up with some type of discounted membership offer for teachers, police officers, firemen, etc. They said no.

My friend joined under the same offer as me - $1500/yr. After he hit age 40 though, his dues were to be bumped up to $3500. A price he couldn't justify. He told them that the only way he could stay on as a member is if he could get the same $1500 rate. The club said no.

Seems silly to turn down any revenue in the situations they are in.

Today there is a wide range of golf shoes. I think people that show up in golf shoes that look like New Balance running shoes looks like a yahoo. I wear these sometimes: http://topvogue.net/wp-content/uploa...ip-flops-7.jpg
The fact that you think people look like yahoos for the footwear they wear is the start of the issue. Shoes that you don't like do no "reflect poorly" on a club.

I have had a jam box with me for probably five years. In five years I have played over 700 rounds of golf. I have never once been asked to turn down my music or turn it off. You seem to have this weird vision of me rolling around a golf course with speakers tacked to the top of the cart. Thats obviously not the case.
In the past five years I can't count the times I have played with someone for the first time, and the next time I see them they have a jam box while playing.
Music in your group can be great.
Obviously it could be an issue if someone is inconsiderate, but thats what marshals are for.

I might join Belair today just so I can disrupt the place!

I heard this recently too. Dubious. Traffic will be a nightmare at Wilshire Blvd.

LACC previously did not want any high-profile tournaments because they didn't want their membership practices looked at. Was and still is very WASPy. But it has changed enough over the last decade where I think they are more comfortable being examined.

Just because no one confronts you doesn't mean it doesn't bother them. But if they don't say anything, it must be okay right?

Do you wear a collared shirt? Why not just wear a tank top? Yes, I'm going all slippery slope on this one.


[/traditionalist]

It's not about someone approaching me, I make sure to keep it at a level where only my group can hear it. I play lots of courses that are spread out so normally no one could hear anyway.
There are several courses that have ditched a dress code for "just don't show up as a slob". I'm all for that, some people look much better in a t-shirt than some slobs in a collared shirt.

Some of my club's rules:

-Shorts can't be more than 4.5 inches above the kneecap
-No cargo shorts
-No backwards caps allowed.
-Collared shirts (must be tucked in)
-No hats allowed in dining area/bar for men (women allowed)

Dress code isn't important imo. It's how you conduct yourself.

My public course has a bunch of people (even members) with jamboxes and you can hear them even when it's not loud. Quiet music doesn't bother me or negatively affect my opinion of them. Some people blare it though and it makes them seem like huge tools and are obviously ass holes.

And then there's the people who spit sunflower seed shells wherever they walk. I will kill someone if I see them do it on the green. At least a few times a week I'll see shells within 10 feet of the hole.

I'm torn between a lot of the attitudes of "purity" and more relaxed golf at clubs tbh. I see the merits in both. Some of the more enjoyable golf I play has been with guys who bust out the music and set a nice, relaxed atmosphere that takes the pressure off and actually makes me end up shooting a better score. However, I also sometimes find that I play better with the guys who are highly procedural as I am consistently focused on every shot and take nothing for granted. Obviously, the format of the tournaments that I play in clearly has some bearing on how acceptable either attitude will be, but it is at least interesting to see both sides defended here.

I think country clubs will need to find acceptable compromises for both styles of play in order to prosper. It would be really interesting to me to see some Bezos/Jobs style entrepreneurs take a swing at the country club gig and try to do something completely outside the box, perhaps even rebranding the term "country club" altogether into something that makes more sense for the up and coming "millenial" generation that will define the future of establishments like these. While I respect the traditions that many of the older folks at clubs want to preserve, I'm firmly in the camp that there needs to be a paradigm shift in the entire way golf is presented to younger generations for the sake of preserving the game as a whole.

This is exactly how I feel as well.

If people are playing at a good pace, behaving like adults, taking care of the course, then the rest doesn't really matter. Why do I care if a guy has cargo shorts in the group in front of me?

Rzit, I know you said you live in Newport. I'm in Mission Viejo, have you ever played Aroyo Trabuco??? (my club) The call it semi-private, but def have played with, seen/heard people jamboxing it. Might of even been you one time... doesnt bother me, but I also play with a guy often you screams at the top of his lungs after every shot.

They take care of the members well, good mix of players, nice bar/resturaunt and marshalls are always eagle eyeing any asians that find there way on to the course to keep up pace.

You mentioned looking at BCCC, or Shady or NBCC, def not on that level, and if you can afford to swing at one of those clubs go for it, but I think you will find Aroyo a nice relaxed change of pace if you are willing to make the small trek from Newport

Do you know why?

Because someone invariably pushes the envelope and takes advantage.

Just like cell phone use. If people limited use and talked quietly, it wouldn't be an issue at my place. But of course some people did and then they had to ban use.

Why not just ban talking loudly on your phone?

Caddyshack was so far ahead of its time.



He even had a phone.