Poker Stars $200+$15 No Limit Hold'em Tournament - t100/t200 Blinds - 9 players - View hand 1871191
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SB: t12410 62.05 BBs
BB: t9966 49.83 BBs
UTG: t8400 42 BBs
UTG+1: t5613 28.07 BBs
Hero (UTG+2): t11750 58.75 BBs
MP1: t16037 80.19 BBs
MP2: t8960 44.80 BBs
CO: t11865 59.33 BBs
BTN: t4999 25.00 BBs

Pre Flop: (t300) Hero is UTG+2 with 4 4
2 folds, Hero raises to t400, 2 folds, CO calls t400, BTN calls t400, 1 fold, BB calls t200

Flop: (t1700) T 6 7 (4 players)
BB checks, Hero checks, CO checks, BTN checks

Turn: (t1700) 4 (4 players)
BB bets t1190, Hero calls t1190, CO folds, BTN folds

River: (t4080) 5 (2 players)
BB bets t2500, Hero ?

villain is pretty much unknown 24/16/6 167hands

don't see him leading to weak a range on turn (into 3 villains), and somehow I feel he's not going to bet the part we have beat on the river (except of missed flushdraws maybe).

on the other hand I too do look semi-strong flatting his turnbet after a flop cbehind (actually it seems pretty hard to put me on a range...)

help me out, will ya?

Not sure about pre, but as played I probably call.

Raise turn. As played, I guess call river.
V most likely has a 7 or T with good kicker or 2 pair. You're beat by an 8 sometimes, but it would pretty much have to be T8 or 78.

pre is fine man jeez, certainly fine enough that theres 0 reason to mention it even if you'd rather fold it (personally I think open folding is horrendous but its irrelevant really)


Agree with a turn raise, that card induces very few raises from the guys behind, u have any 2 pair blockers and the flop type makes it hard for anyone to be checking behind value hands otf when the pf raiser checks, the guy betting the turn is the only one who has an undefined range and all 3 of your ranges for getting to the turn are weak with the other 2 dolts being much weaker as you can still have some tricky induces, but it seems unlikely that you wouldnt cbet on a very wet board 4 way with value hands. BB would presumably always(or near always) lead value on the turn, its a board that will hit a bb peel range, and 4 way on a board that someone will be able to call a bet vast majority of the time he's less incentivized to bet air, so its a very clear raise for value, bettor doesnt have a big enough bluff range to get alot of value from stuff that folds to a turn raise but bets again on the river, and the 2 guys behind have an extremely small raising range on the turn.

However, I also disagree that he cant have alot of 8s that get to the river. 88 for example would be a great turn bet by villain, the ranges are so definedly weak that hes up against better than one pair very rarely, couple things get there on the turn but even way more draws. When you bet the turn you get value from draws and pairs and some combos of both, but you can also set up a river bet on scare cards, river c/c on blanks hu. This goes for any 8 he may have too as its a 1 card double gutty that could easily be bet vs weak ranges.


As for the river, you have pretty much a textbook bluffcatcher, you beat nothing that bets for value but almost everything that is bluffing or turning itself into a bluff, i probably call expecting to see a fair amount of 2 pairs or Tx turned into bluffs along with some whiffed flush draws, but i do think he'll have an 8 a good amount of the time, just not more than 70% or w/e

Even if hands are good for villain to bet because the range of 3 people behind are all weak, a lot of villains just aren't capable of bluffing into 3 people multi-way, people generally play pretty honest and just check. Especially with hands with 88 which in his mind have a tonne of showdown value.

Also, don't think it makes sense if villain is thinking on the level where he will turn two pair into a bluff to actually do it, as he should realise pretty much the only better hand he (may) get to fold is 44 exactly, which he might think we raise a lot of the time.

I'm not disagreeing with the fact you say to call btw. (Nor am I specifically advocating a call either)

Agree with your earlier comments about how everyone else has weak ranges, how its reasonable for him to bet 88 and other 8x on the turn etc
I also would advocate a turn raise.

However, I think he could be betting worse for value here on the river some of the time. It's not a ton of combos, but hands like 76s or 65s, that led the turn may continue to bet for value. It may be better for them to c/c than to bet, but I don't think we can know which a semi-random would do. I think if he bets with 2 pair, its not with the intention of turning it into a bluff, as its pretty hard for you to have a better hand that folds (44 seems like one of the only hands that could fit that category) and even that hand I would call with.


Edit: Just read post above mine, only read Kleath's before that. Says some of say things I was saying