Yea when you do Bird Dogs the way they should be done with all the focus on keeping your back as still as possible, you will feel they are much harder and they'll hit your core better. fwiw, I taped myself doing them and that is how I found all the flaws in my form.

Yeah I feel like my bird dogs are really good. My side planks are prob a little off, I'll prob tape myself and have a look to see.

yeah, recording yourself is good. Bird dogs are easier to get wrong than you think.

I was told today that I could do OHP as long as I'm standing and my stance is staggered. How much truth is there to this?

Don't underestimate the additive effects of being a newborn father, ie poor sleeping and eating habits, constantly bending over and picking up and carrying a baby, oftentimes with compromised posture. And if you think it is bad now, wait till he is 1.5+ and 25+ pounds and wants to be held for long periods of time or is running down the hall bumping into **** and you are constantly chasing him down and trying to stop him from hurting himself.

I have a 2.5 year old and a bad lower back, and although I have always lifted with suspect form I was able to get away with it until my son was born, and I think this definitely put things over the edge.

Because you wont get dat back arch.....

Unless i missed it you never posted your pre back injury routine?

Nah I haven't yet, never really thought about it too terribly much, but I'm more than happy to. I mixed it up a ton, so this will just be what I was doing the month before my injury. I never really had specific days that were dedicated to specific body parts etc since having a kid makes it really tough to follow a super strict schedule.

My tentative diet prior to injury was as follows:

Meal 1: Protein shake with 2% milk. (mutant mass was what I was using the month or so before injury). I used two scoops. Taken as soon as I get up.

Meal 2: Two servings of grits, 6 egg whites, a splash of shredded cheese to add some flavor. Also added some pepper. This was my preworkout meal, taken about an hour to an hour and a half before training.

Meal 3: Protein shake. This was obviously my post workout meal, taken as soon as possible after training. Mutant mass. Would take 2 scoops on upper body days. Would take 3 or 4 scoops on leg days since I was trying to get my legs as big as possible.

Meal 4: Dinner. This changed a little bit based on how I was feeling. Typical dinner was: grilled chicken breast / rice / veggies OR Sammie-O turkey burgers / rice / veggies OR lean beef / rice / veggies. I was still letting myself eat out and stuff like that because I was still bulking. I just made sure I ate a smart "bodybuilding" meal.

Meal 5: Protein shake (mutant mass) with 2% milk. Typically did no more than two scoops for this meal. Took it right before bed.



As far as training goes this is what it looked like before my injury:

Chest / Triceps

Incline Bench press: 1x15-20 reps with 135 for warmup (focused on ROM and squeezing upper chest every rep to get blood into the muscle group).

4x10-12 reps for working sets. Typically started out with 155 lbs for 12 really good reps and worked my way up to 205 lbs for 10 reps as my last set.

Incline dumbell flies

4x10-12 reps. Typically stuck with 50 lb dumbbells here, sometimes lighter based on how I was feeling. Full ROM and squeezing upper chest each time.

Hammer strength bench press

3x10-12 reps. Typically started with 2 45lb plates on each side and worked my way up based on how I felt.

pec deck flies

7x10-12 reps. Didn't go too terribly heavy here, just focused on squeezing chest together super hard.

Dips

3x10-12 reps. Typically didn't do weighted dips. Just got as deep as possible and tried to focus on using my chest to do the work.

Pushdowns with rope attachment

3x10-12 reps

Close grip bench press

3 sets 10-12 reps. Was typically pretty fatigued at this point, so I never really went super heavy here. Typically did anywhere from 135-155lb for good reps. Some days when I felt super good I did 185lb.

Skull Crushers

7x10-12 reps. Typically used 25 lb plates on the curl bar for these last few sets.


BACK / BICEPS

Lat Pull downs

1 warm up set for 15-20 reps

4x10-12 reps. Typically did 160lbs for my first set and my final set was 200-220lbs.

Lateral rows

4x10-12 reps. Typically started out with 140lbs and worked my way up to anywhere from 180 to 200lbs.

T Bar rows

4x10-12 reps. Usually started with two 45lb plates and worked my way up to no more than 4 plates. Sometimes I stuck with 3 plates here. I never loved doing these SUPER heavy, I always felt a better contraction when I went lighter here.

Straight arm pulldowns with rope

7x10-12 reps. Stayed light here and focused on squeezing lower lats.

I would SOMETIMES do a low bar row with the cable machine instead here depending on how I felt.

Seated dumb bell curls

3x10-12 reps. Typically started with 35 lb dumb bells and adjusted based on how I felt.

Straight bar curls

3x10-12 reps. Stayed pretty light here, tried to get the bar as high as possible and squeeze hard at top.

Preacher curl

3x10-12 reps. Full ROM etc.


Legs

I was doing Arnold's leg routine for the last few weeks before my injury. Never really went super heavy on these days because Arnold's routine is pretty intense volume wise. Tons of reps so it gets pretty brutal towards the end.

Squats

1 warmup set of 15-20 reps
6x8-12 reps. Typically started with 185lb focused on getting super low and squeezing quads and gluts at top. Worked my way up to 245 lb for 8-10 reps. Never went super heavy on squats, focused more on contraction and ROM.

Leg Press

6x8-12 reps. Started out with 3 plates on each side and worked my way up to 5 plates on each side.

Leg Extensions

6x12-15 reps

Lying leg curls

6x10-12 reps

Barbell lunges

5x15 reps on each leg

Core / Calves / Shoulders

Seated military press

4x10 reps. Started with 135lb and would move up to 155 or so by the end.

Lateral dumb bell raises

4x15-20 reps. Typically used 20 lb dumb bells and would move up to 25's on some days.

Upright rows

4x10-12 reps

Front raises

3x10 reps on each arm. Was typically using 30-35lb dumb bells for this.

Shrugs

7x15-20 reps. This is an movement I never went crazy heavy on. Typically stayed with 135 for early sets and moved my way up to 185 later on. I focused really hard on squeezing the hell out of my traps for this. Would sometimes super set this with later raises to get a better pump.

Standing calf raises

10x10. Used smith machine for this. Typically did 225lb.

Seated calf raises

8x15 reps.

One legged calf raises using dumb bell in one hand

5x15 reps on each side. Used 15-20 lb dumb bell.

Power wheel rollouts

3x10 reps

Landmine rotations

3x10 reps on each side

Crunches using rope attachment

3x15-20 reps


Again, I mixed it up a ton, but that was the routine I was using just before my injury.

Did some more core work today. Thinking about trying to get back into light workouts next Monday depending on how I feel. Is a little bit of tenderness to be expected on the first few workouts at the site of the injury? Obviously I'm going to be modifying all my movements.

My understanding is that you ought to avoid anything that makes your injury feel worse when you have a disc issue.

Yeah I was kind of told the same thing. I've also been told that a little tenderness is to be expected in the area when I get done working out the first few times. Obviously I'm modifying my workouts the first few weeks (i.e. No over head press, no back loaded squats, no twisting motions etc). I'm just kind of scared that I'm going to come back too soon. I feel mostly better, but if I'm on my feet long periods of time it starts to feel "tender" and sensitive, not necessarily pain. I guess what I'm wondering is what are the red flags I should look for when I do start lifting again that tells me I need to stop. Is a small amount of pain in the early going normal as long as I'm continuing to do my rehab movements? Or should I be 150% pain free?

Then you probably are. Dont rush this.

The red flags are pain that's caused by the disc issue.

Do only what your medical providers are telling you is ok, and dont do anything that aggravates the symptoms of the disc issue imo.

When I was rehabbing, I ran every questionable movement I did past my chiropractor before I did anything I thought might be questionable, and I told him at the next visit about the stuff I did that I was sure was ok. I stopped doing anything that aggravated the symptoms.

Slight tangent: Anyone would be lucky to find a provider as useful as my chiropractor for rehabbing an injury like this. He's a former Olympic wrestler and he works with several professional teams, individual professional athletes and college athletes. He has a unique perspective on how to treat athletes. If you can find a PT, MD or chiropractor with this kind of background, that would be optimal.

If you arent sure about something, dont do it until your symptoms are gone.

Yeah, not a bodybuilder myself (or even remotely close to it for that matter), but I gotta say Cha is spot on here. No sense in rushing things with questionable movements that might just sideline you even further.

Keep up the good work. Slow and steady wins the race.

Yeah I'm actually speaking to three separate chiros I know and whose opinions I respect.

This week has been the first week I've noticed significant improvement in my ROM with bending over and pain. I still feel tender from time to time, but no real pain. I was planning on trying to come back next week, but I'll prob wait till the week after.

My inversion table is supposed to be delivered next Monday. I'm hoping a combination of that, my treatments with my chiro, and stretching/core work can help me get back ASAP because I'm dying a little bit inside everyday. Lol

I would defer to what Cha said above.

My experience is that there is always pain with disc injury. In a way, even if there is improvement, the injury is always there and the question is are you doing anything that can aggravate the injury and cause what I would call an acute reaction.

I think for most it's positional and aggravated when you are not in a good position.

I can DL pretty heavy with no issues whatsoever. After, my lower back will be sore, tired etc. But there won't be any acute pain. On the other hand I was bundling up brush for the city pick up and my back was screaming after about five minutes. I really had to suck it up just to get through the 20 minutes of being bent over and reaching over to bundle sticks and twigs that weighed less than 15lbs each.

So, again defer to Cha and your medical providers. But, that's my personal experience.

Yeah I guess that's what my confusion is based off of. At this point, it's been ~7 weeks since I've done any training. My pain is mostly gone, but comes and goes MILDLY as the day goes on since I'm on my feet etc. I'm to the point where it's like "well, this is as good as my pain is gonna get, I should just go about training with modifications" OR is it "wait until the pain is 100% gone and no less, THEN start training". All of my chiros tend to take the position that I need to start training again since it's been so long and my pain is so mild, but stay away from DL, OHP, back loaded squats, and leg press.

I havent had DL related pain in my low back since I can remember. I get low back pain if I do something that results in my back being flexed for more than a minute or so. Stuff with basically no weight like scooping cat litter, sitting on the floor assembling an Ikea desk, etc. Little stuff life that bothers it because my back is in a bad position when I do it. I'm sure if I let my low back round too much during a heavy DL, there would be some awful results, but my core is so strong, and I focus on not losing core tightness & not letting my back round when I DL, so my limiting factors are other muscle groups.

cliffs - form and posture matter very much. Dont round your back.

Never leg press again imo. It causes sheer force on your lower back.

Follow the chiros' advice on those others. Back squats were the last thing I started training hard after my injury. I did air squats to a high box, then goblet squats to a high box, the front squats to a high box. I slowly increased the weight and the depth over a long period of time. I didnt back squat with any significant weight to parallel for a very long time. I was only doing very light weights with those until after a year after my injury. I still am careful about going too deep because I dont want to allow my back to round.

I eased into DLs by doing trap bar DLs off high blocks, the gradually lowered the blocks over time, then eased into sumo DLs off high blocks, then gradually lowered them over time. I pulled my first conventional DL ~11 months after my injury. It was a very long, slow process and I talked to my chiro about everything I was doing as I went.

Ok cool sounds good.

When you stated light training again, did you still have some minor pain in your lower back? Or was there some residual soreness in that area after you trained the first few times?

Also, what is your thoughts about belts?

Fwiw your instructions are almost 100% similar to what my chiros have said.

No & no - at least not in the lower back, related to the injury. But I had stiffness & soreness all over from being a cripple for 5 weeks though. My shoulders, neck and upper back were a mess from kyphosis.

Dont use a belt. Belts are performance aids. They dont protect you at all. Many people who mistakenly think a belt protects their back get injured more easily wearing a belt than without one.

McGill says save belts for your championships. fwiw, I train with a belt a lot because it allows me to move more weight than I can without one. I only do this because I am very confident in my form with a belt.

You should only put a belt on when you are pain free, have very solid form, and are trying to move as much weight as possible.

Saw chrio today. Basically was told that since I've progressed well the past week and a half that I need to start doing light workouts. Was told I'd never be 100% pain free unless I started strengthening my body again.

Did chest / triceps. Felt pretty good throughout the workout. No pain. Did feel some tenderness later on in the workout, but was told that's pretty normal. Came home and put an ice pack on my back to make sure that if I did have a flare up it would be minimal. But few hours later, no pain. So I'm pretty encouraged by this.

Anywho, here's the routine.


Cat Camels 15 reps

Incline Bench Press - 135x15, 135x12, 135x12, 135x8

Incline DB Flies - 30 lb dumb bells 4x10

Body weight dips - 3x10

Fly machine - 115x3x10

Rope push downs - 45x3x10

Behind the head cable extensions - 20x3x10e

Skull crushers - 40 lb straight bar 3x10

Cat camel 2x15

Plank - 3x30 seconds

Bridges - 3x20

Bird dogs - 3x10

Also did stretches as posted earlier ITT.

Stayed super light today. That was the plan going in, but I don't think that even if I was 100% healthy that I would've been able to do much more today. My first set of 15 reps on incline felt great. But I started having to fight muscle failure pretty quickly after that. Didn't feel a great pump today and didn't feel great contractions in any of my movements, mostly because my arms and chest were pretty numb after my first few exercises. Pretty humbling, but hey I guess that's what 7 weeks of sitting around doing basically nothing will do.

Planning on doing back / bi's tomorrow. Weighed myself today and was at 208.7 and bodyfat reading said 18.5%. Will re-weigh myself tomorrow in the AM to get a more accurate reading... since I've already eaten 3 times today and lifted.

Willing to post pics of myself now and progress pics of anyone is interested. Not sure if I'm gonna do the competition I was planning on doing this November, I'll have to see how I feel in a couple months.

Also, inversion table arrived today. It's in 100 different pieces and looks somewhat complicated to arrange. Doesn't help that I'm mechanically ******ed.

Back and biceps today. Prob just gonna do a ton of pull ups, lateral pull downs etc. I might try standing cable rows as opposed to seated cable rows to prevent my back from going into flexion. Also will be doing those pretty light.

Today lower back feels somewhat tender, but still no pain. Iced on and off yesterday after I got done training clients.

Took weight today as soon as I woke up.... 205.4. It's a sloppy 205.4 IMO

Will post routine I did and bodyfat reading after I workout. (Obv going to take the bodyfat reading before I workout, but won't be able to post it until I get home)

Took bodyfat before workout today, 18.5%.

So as of today I'm 205 18.5% bodyfat. Hoping to get back to 220 18% BF in a month or two. Not too worried about cutting right now, will do that later on once I get a lot of my strength back.


Back and Bi's routine today

Body weight pull ups - 2x10
Lat pull downs - 4x10-12 reps 120lbs
Body weight rows with TRX bands - 4x10
Lat pull downs with T bar - 4x10 120 lbs
Lateral row machine - 3x10 super light
Hammer strength preacher curls - 4x10 with 1 45 lb plate
Hammer strength seated DB curls - 4x10 with 30 lb dumb bells

Cat camels - 2x15
Bridges - 3x10
Planks - 3x30s

Stretches posted earlier ITT

Meals today so far:

Preworkout - 2 servings grits, 5 egg whites, light Mexican style cheese

Postworkout meal - 2.5 scoops mutant mass, 2% milk

Snack - Granola and almonds

Dinner will be - 1 lb grilled chicken, 2 cups of rice

Before bed - 2 scoops mutant mass, 2% milk