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Old 08-18-2010, 12:46 AM   #101
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Re: cha59's log

8/17

a bit longer between workouts than I wanted, due to car shopping (bought a new MDX yesterday ) and various family activities, but the small layoff might have actually been a good thing. PR for squat & the heavier RDLs felt good

squat
315*3, 335*3, 345*3, 355*3 (+10 PR) - thats also one additonal set

RDL
345*5, 365*5, 385*5 (+10)

DB step ups
70*5, 80*5, 90*5 (+5, but one less rep per set)

pull throughs
170*10, 200*12, 200*12
These are not difficult to perform the exercise, but I did get somewhat tired after them today.

lat EQI - 12 lbs 75s
flye EQI - 12lbs 65s

KB swings
44*8*3, 62*8*3, 70*8*4

spent, no MB slams today - the extra squat set and the extra weight on basically everything felt good during the workout, but I got worn out at the end.
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Old 08-21-2010, 11:36 PM   #102
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Re: cha59's log

8/21

DL
135*10, 225*8, 315*5, 365*2, 405*2 (warm ups)
425*1, 445*1, 455*1 (pr +5), 465*1 (PR +15!)
These felt good. I didn't wear a belt. I was considering a belt if I was going to try for a weight I wasn't sure if I could do or not, but I never got to that point. I'm pretty sure the heavier RDLs I've been doing are helping my DL.

Vids:
315*5
405*2
425*1
445*1
455*1
465*1

chins
8, 7, 6

dumbell rows
85*5, 95*5, 95*5
These were easier than I expected. I'll probably add more reps next workout.

blast strap rows
8 8 8

face pulls
75*12, 85*12*2

lat EQI - 12 lbs 70s
flye EQI - 12lbs 55s
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Old 08-21-2010, 11:54 PM   #103
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Re: cha59's log

hey it looks like you are pulling all that weight on the DL with your back. i think if you used your legs more you could pull a lot more weight
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Old 08-22-2010, 12:21 AM   #104
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Re: cha59's log

Quote:
Originally Posted by theblackkeys View Post
Your shins are making the bar roll forward right before lift off, which is probably bringing it forward of your center of gravity, making the lift harder. Your hips rise a bit before the bar anyways so you don't even need to set up with your hips that low (low hips = shins angled forward more). Keep the bar close, don't move the bar, set up higher, pull.

Read this:
http://startingstrength.com/resource...63&postcount=2
Quote:
Originally Posted by theBruiser500 View Post
hey it looks like you are pulling all that weight on the DL with your back. i think if you used your legs more you could pull a lot more weight
see above - thats from a while ago. I have been working on my form so that I dont bang my knees with the bar on the way up. I was using my legs more before. Now I'm using more back - intentionally.

Maybe my body type doesn't allow for a conventional DL using more legs without banging the knees - I'm not sure.

One thing I am planning to do soon is to try doing sumos. I think I might be able to get my legs wide enough apart for those to be a good option, So I might be doing them next time I do DLs.

Anyone else have thoughts on that?
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Old 08-22-2010, 12:23 PM   #105
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Re: cha59's log

Quote:
Originally Posted by cha59 View Post
see above - thats from a while ago. I have been working on my form so that I dont bang my knees with the bar on the way up. I was using my legs more before. Now I'm using more back - intentionally.

Maybe my body type doesn't allow for a conventional DL using more legs without banging the knees - I'm not sure.

One thing I am planning to do soon is to try doing sumos. I think I might be able to get my legs wide enough apart for those to be a good option, So I might be doing them next time I do DLs.

Anyone else have thoughts on that?
I would find it extremely weird if you're unable to bang the bar with your shins. Sounds more likely that it's a bad habit that's been formed over a long time which is hard to undo. Just focus really hard on leaning into the bar with the shins, but very controlled so the bar doesn't move. It certainly leads to a bad bar path and slight hitching.

After doing sumo for a while I find regular better, there's a lot of pressure on the abductors/outside of the hips/ass doing sumo. At least that was my impression back then.

What is your body type though exactly? Long torso, short arms etc etc?
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Old 08-22-2010, 01:13 PM   #106
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Re: cha59's log

hey cha i read your link but didn't really understand it. i can tell you that when i used to deadlift i scraped my shins really badly (which i think is the same problem as banging the knee) and this was because i just pulled backwards with my back and didn't use my legs. now i use my legs more and the bar doesn't touch my shins and it feels better...

it's weird we have the same problem but think it was caused by the opposite reasons
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Old 08-22-2010, 02:49 PM   #107
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Re: cha59's log

This maybe explains what I'm getting at a little better -

That link to the post by Rip was posted after I posted the vid in this post:
http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/sh...9&postcount=47

My knees were getting in the way because I dont think I was getting my shoulders out over the bar far enough, and my hips got lower & my knees drifted out too far over the bar and they got in the way at the start of the movement.

Notice my hips are not as low and my shoulders are more out over the bar in these vids:
http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/sh...&postcount=102

SM, to answer you question, I really dont think I have unusually long or short arms, legs or torso, its just that doing the DLs starting out with my hips low - that made my knees drift out too far over the bar. I kind of think I fixed that now.

I'm going to try the sumos to see how I like them. I've done a few reps with very light weight and they feel like something I think I can do. I'm hoping I'll be able to eventually pull more weight doing sumos (because of being able to keep my back verticle and the knees out of the way, so I can make better use of my legs), but I'll definitely start out lighter.
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Old 08-25-2010, 12:00 AM   #108
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Re: cha59's log

8/24

bench press - went for some heavy singles today.
45*10*2, 135*10, 185*5, 225*3, 245*2
265*1, 275*1, 285*1 (+10 from 3 reps the past couple workouts), 295 got about halfway up and came back down. I was hoping I was ready to crack 300 again, but not today.

DB low incline press
50*10, 75*8, 85*5, 95*6 (+10)

close grip bench press
135*8, 155*6, 175*6 (+20)

DB curls
40*6, 50*6*2 (=)
supersetted with tricep rope pressdowns
85*10, 105*8, 115*8 (+10)

pnfd2 - 25 lbs * 10 * 2

tall kneeling cable lift - 25lbs * 10 * 3

blast strap ab fallouts (handles 1" above floor, feet on top of 12.5" box) 10*3

flye EQI - 12 lbs 75s
lat EQI - 12 lbs 50s

As far as PRs go, I have quite a ways to go before I top what I did ~13 years ago on the bench - 300*3 and 320*1. I've been setting a new PR almost every time I squat lately, and topped my old PR on the DL the other day.

Thinking ahead, I might want to put in some more work to get my bench up to/past where it was before. I know I can do this now because of the way my shoulders feel when I bench. They are so much more stable than before because of how I'm setting up and holding my shoulder blades back when I bench now. My back might be a little stronger than it used to be as well.

I'll probably try some heavy single squats next workout. After that, I'll be doing less weight/more reps on everything for at least a couple/few weeks.
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Old 08-28-2010, 01:33 PM   #109
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Re: cha59's log

8/27

squat
(extra warmups prior to PR attempt)
45*10*2
135*10
225*5
275*3*2
315*2
335*1
355*1 (= to PR @ 3 reps)
375*1 (PR+20)
I had never attempted a 1RM squat before, so I was too scared to attempt more, even though I'm pretty sure I could have done 385 or 395. I've never dumped a squat, and am concerned about getting injured if I try a weight that I might have to dump. All that being said, I decided I needed more squats after that, so I did
315*5

RDL
45*10
135*10
225*5
275*5
315*5
345*5
375*5
385*5

I was absolutely spent after this. I had planned to do DB step ups and pull throughs, but I think I might have hurt myself if I had attempted any significant weight, so I stopped. I felt ready to stop after doing the 315 set on the RDLs, but forced myself to finish those. Doing those heavier ones with a flat back just sapped all my energy last night. Part of this might have had to do with not getting quite enough sleep the night before. Part might have had to do with the squats taking more out of me than I anticipated. I guess both of those things had some affect, but it was kind of disappointing to run out of gas. I did at least force myself to do EQIs at the end.

flye EQI - 12 lbs 60s
lat EQI - 12 lbs 60s
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Old 08-28-2010, 02:52 PM   #110
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Re: cha59's log

Nice PR. Dumping squats really is no big deal, try it with lower weights first.
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Old 08-29-2010, 12:49 AM   #111
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Re: cha59's log

Thanks.

Yeah, I started to consider that might be a good idea - try dumping at a lower weight. At the time I considered that, I already had 300+ loaded on the bar, so I figured I'd try it another time and stay with a weight I knew I could do, which is fine for now.

I think I will try dumping at a low weight to see how its done so I dont have to be concerned about tearing up a shoulder or breaking my neck.

vid of 375:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-6XSXn10E3Q

Notice I took the cable attachment off my rack. I assessed the situation and figured out if I went forward, there would be a good chance of hitting the thing with my head, so I unbolted it & moved it between sets.
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Old 08-31-2010, 01:26 AM   #112
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Re: cha59's log

8/30

I still had DOMs after last Friday's squats and RDLs. I had some ART done today, so it felt good enough to do DLs today.

sumos (1st time)
135*10
225*5
275*5
315*5
365*3*4
These felt a bit awkward prior to using mixed grip at 315, but they felt more awkward after that. I figured because I'm getting used to them, I'll stay fairly light with low rep sets, and just add one more set than I initially planned. I was really using my legs at 365 lbs, and the DOMs was still there, so tomorrow should be interesting. My back barely got warmed up from doing these. I'm not sure yet how many more times I'll do sumos.

chins
8 8 7
The back was definitely fresher than usual after doing DLs.

DB rows
50*10
75*8
95*8*2

blast strap rows
8, 7.5 (not enough rest between sets), 8
I moved the straps up a bit so my back didnt touch the floor between reps. This made the angle very slightly easier, but overall, it was harder because of not de-loading between reps.

face pulls (lying on bench)
75*12*2, 85*12
I read about this variation the other day so I thought Id try it. I like them, except for the fact that I need a handoff to reach the rope when I do them this way.

pec eqi - 15 lbs (+3) * 40 sec
lat eqi - 15*40
The extra 3 lbs made these a lot harder. I figured tonight would be the time to try that since I didnt lift anything all that heavy.
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Old 09-02-2010, 12:09 AM   #113
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Re: cha59's log

9/1

bench press
45*15*2, 135*8, 185*5, 225*5
245*5*3
relatively easy, which it should be. My 5RM is probably 255 right now, but there's no way I could do 3 sets at that weight and I did a max effort single last week, so I went for for a little more volume/less weight/no failure today.

Because of my shoulder issues, I thought I would never do dips again. Well, my shoulders have been feeling fantastic, and I thought I could try dips to see how they felt. I figured I could quit if they caused any issues. Huge success!

Dips
6, 6, 12 (because 6 was so easy)
I really like these and my shoulders felt great the whole time. I'm going to keep doing these for now. These really got my triceps fried.

low incline DB bench
50*10, 75*5, 75*6 (-20 lol)
I was spent from the benches and dips.

DB curls
40*10, 45*8, 50*6

blast strap rows
8 8
Wanted to get a little pulling in with my pushing today. I think this is a good exercise to balance the chest workout a bit.

pnfd2 - 25 lbs * 10 * 2

tall kneeling cable lift - 25lbs * 10 * 3

blast strap ab fallouts (handles 1" above floor, feet on floor) 10*3
Doing these with my feet on the floor instead of on the box made me able to stretch out more effectively and really fry my abs. This is a really ****ing hard exercise when you do it this way.

pec eqi - 15 lbs * 65 sec
lat eqi - 15*35 (abs fried, so that made this harder)
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Old 09-02-2010, 12:57 AM   #114
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Re: cha59's log

You've been doing the EQIs consistently since the start of your log, how much and what kind of benefit are you getting from them? I saw Robertson mention a (Bulgarian) split squat EQI in an article, have you considered doing that?
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Old 09-02-2010, 01:11 AM   #115
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Re: cha59's log

That's a good question. I'm not sure how directly the EQIs are related to how good my shoulders feel, but I am pretty sure they're some part of it, along with all the other stuff. Mike told me the EQIs are important for my shoulder health, & they dont take a lot of time, so I plan to keep doing them after every workout.

A lot of the other stuff includes these exercises I'm doing like core stuff, cable lifts, PNF D2 flexions, & stuff I did before including cable chops & a lot of other unconventional stuff. The rolling and mobility stuff is probably the most important imo.

I was actually doing some split squats in February, but then a 60lb dumbell fell on my left big toe. I got it xrayed and the doc said there was a good chance I had a hairline crack. Also, there's a blood blister under my toenail thats still there and probably will be for a few more months. That injury caused me to stop split squats altogether because I cant put a lot of pressure on that toe. I may be able to do them again soon. Whenever that happens, I'll look into split squat EQIs.

cliffs - I cant split squat right now, but might try the split squat EQIs in the future.

edit - I should probably mention this as well since you mentioned I've been doing the EQIs since the start of the log - I've done my same rolling/soft tissue activation and mobility warmup routine before every workout. I just dont post it because it is the same every time.
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Old 09-04-2010, 08:08 PM   #116
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Re: cha59's log

I have a weird thing going on behind my right knee - the tissue between my calf and hamstring. For a few months, the tissue will tighten up and kind of pop out after I do squats, especially after heavy, difficult sets. Its not really painful, but its tight. It feels like its tied in knots.

I've had my chiro do ART on it several times, and it usually feels a lot better after he works on my calf & hamstring. The last time he worked on me, last Monday, it seemed like more of the same - it felt better when he was done. Monday night, I did the sumo deads and it has been worse than its been before. Backing up, prior to last Monday, I did a PR squat & heavy RDLs a few days earlier, and a PR DL a few days before that.

I think all that stuff contributed to where I am now. Yesterday I had planned to do my squat/RDL workout, but figured it would be a bad idea with how tight this feels now.

I've been doing some extra rolling, using the stick on my calves & hams, and using an electric massager on it. It all helps a little, but it still feels like something is wrong.

Anyone else have experience with this sort of problem?
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Old 09-05-2010, 07:53 PM   #117
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Re: cha59's log

9/5

terminal knee extensions - 20 with each leg and my thickest band

front squats - I did these instead of back squats to lessen the hamstring work.
45*10, 95*8*2, 135*5
185*5*3
My form sucks at this. I cant rack the bar normally because of wrist issues, poor flexibility, and weird shaped arms. I tried the G4S way with the straps and that wasnt so good. Arms crossed in front worked best.

RDL
45*10, 135*10, 185*8, 225*5, 275*5, 315*5
365*5*3

DB step ups
65*5, 75*5, 85*5

lat eqi - 15*60 sec
pec eqi - 15 * 35 sec

KB swings
44*8*2, 62*8*2, 70*8*2, 80*8*4

MB slams
10 sets*15 reps

Prior to working out, I took a long hot shower and rolled my legs more than normal. That thing behind my right knee hasnt flared up yet, so getting it warmup up seemed to help, but my knee is cracking more than normal (it cracks frequently), and I'm getting some sharp pains (not bad pain, just small sharp pain) in it when I walk and get up from a chair. I'm not concerned about it at this point. I think its probably due to quad muscles pulling in ways they havent for a while because of the front squats.
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Old 09-08-2010, 12:05 AM   #118
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Re: cha59's log

9/7

The knee issue was muscle adhesion related, as I suspected. It was kind of nasty, but I was able to get it to calm down by really working the lower quad over with the stick.

The thing behind my knee is also calming down a bit. I have been rolling my hamstring with a lacrosse ball, and even working it over with a kettlebell a little. There's something really deep in there thats pulling on that spot behind my knee. Gotta remember to have my chiro work on that next week.

DLs - banded
135*10, 225*5, 275*5, 315*4, 365*4*2
Using the bands makes it harder to lock out and harder to hold onto the bar at the top. I felt like these werent super hard, but didnt want to push anything with my hamstring & quad acting up.

chins
9 8 7

DB rows
50*10, 95*8*3

Blast strap pushups
10 10 10
I decided it would be a good idea to mix in some kind of pushing movement with all the pulling. I'll do blast strap rows with bench presses & stuff next workout.

face pulls (lying on bench)
85*12, 95*12, 105*12

lat eqi - 15*50 sec
pec eqi - 15 * 45 sec
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Old 09-10-2010, 02:48 PM   #119
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Re: cha59's log

Great article on training the core here:

http://www.robertsontrainingsystems....ur-abs-part-ii

It gives a lot of good reasons not to do crunches & situps, and gives several examples of much better exercises.
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Old 09-10-2010, 03:15 PM   #120
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Re: cha59's log

Man. I'm not sure about Robertson. Like, one of the studies he cites where injured athletes who did core training rehabilitated better and stayed injury free. I don't think that's relevant whatsoever. I would have liked to see a comparison of guys who were strong from squats and DLs vs the same population adding core training.

If Rip is on one end of the simplicity scale, Robertson seems to be on the other end. Like, what if you did crunches on top of squats, DLs, barbell rows, kroc rows and chins/pullups? Will the crunches really affect your posture that much if done twice a week?

And adding stuff for the bros ("eat a clean diet") is sort of tilting.
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Old 09-10-2010, 03:52 PM   #121
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Re: cha59's log

Too late to edit. I now noticed he uses studies of the spine in vitro to justify the "number of cycles" a body has for flexion-type movements. Wow. Really dude? Realllllllly?

I mean, it's not that I think crunches are the best things evar but some of these justifications seem really weak to me.
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Old 09-10-2010, 05:27 PM   #122
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Re: cha59's log

Bwahaha, sorry to spam your log but...case in point:
Rip answers a question about APT
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Old 09-10-2010, 06:51 PM   #123
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Re: cha59's log

The way he answers those questions, he doesn't sound like an expert to me, although Rip knows more than I do. But so does Mike. Mike sounds smarter to me, and his exercises have worked for me (pretty important imo), so I'm going to take that side of this issue.

I didn't see Rip advocate situps or crunches in that thread, but I think you said he likes weighted situps & you were doing those.

I posted that link as a PSA for anyone wanting to know more about that kind of stuff. If you don't think its good, well, you have a right to your opinion, but I don't agree with it.
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Old 09-10-2010, 07:50 PM   #124
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Re: cha59's log

Well, Rip likes to troll a bit. He actually wrote an article about abs where his theories are explained quite clearly, and where he warns against situps for many people. Here's the thread, where you can find the article and a pic of the apparatus he describes.

I don't think Mike is wrong, but I don't like it when he uses weak science to underpin his theories. And from what I can see the theories really are weak.

That being said, I think I'll vary or replace the weighted situps (where I don't use a lot of abdominal flexion) with some of the stuff I found in an article on elitefts' site. Coincidentally (...) they have a lot of the same stuff Mike does, only some harder stuff as well.
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Old 09-10-2010, 10:24 PM   #125
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Re: cha59's log

Thanks for the links. I'll read that Rip one later. I want to mention that the stuff Mike had me progressing to, and farther progressions, is pretty much the same thing as what's on that elitefts site.

Here's what I was doing for my first set of workouts:
1 - front planks
2 - side planks

second set about 6 weeks later
1 - ab wheel rollouts (these are really ****ing hard imo)
2 - tall kneeling pnf d2 flexion and tall kneeling cable chop

3rd
1 - ab wheel rollout isos (harder than regular ab wheel rollouts)
2 - tall kneeling pnf d2 flexion and tall kneeling cable lift (lift is harder than chop)

I took the progression of the ab wheel up a notch with the blast strap fallouts that I learned how to do from reading his stuff.

If you look at his youtube site, you'll see all kinds of useful stuff similar to what they do at elitefts. A lot of the stuff he writes makes reference to guys like Dave Tate (owner of elitefts) and he plugs some of their products as well. I think they're more on the same page than you realize.

http://www.youtube.com/robtrainsystems#g/u


fwiw, I learned a lot from reading SS, and I have a lot of respect for Rip.
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