EDF Wine thread

[KDawg]

There's been a real lack of wine talk in this forum and I know from previous wine threads on specific regions or varietals that we have some drinkers in this forum.

I figured that we should get one going and hopefully there will be enough intrest to keep it going and hopefully a few volumes of it

I figure this can be for general stuff like questions on varietals, regions, styles, etc. I'd also like to encourage tasting notes and discussion about food and cheese pairings

As far as what I can bring to the table, I can hopefully help people out in discovering bordeaux, burgundy, the rhone, and tuscany. I can also help a bit with california, but I do know that other posters can help out more in that area


as far as posting tasting notes, I fully encourage people to use CellarTracker as it's free. It'll make it easy for everyone to keep notes and post them in here.

So, I'll get things started off with a Tasting Note of a 1995 Archery Summit Premier Cuvee Pinot Noir. This is Archery Summit's appalation Pinot and the 06 retails around 45-55. I was able to get this on the cheap at a auction site, so here are my notes:

• 1995 Archery Summit Pinot Noir Premier Cuvée - USA, Oregon, Willamette Valley (9/4/2008)
  nose: very reticent nose at first that starts to open up after an hour and half with tones of brown spice, dark cherry, dark plum, and some forrest floor tones. soft and balanced with a nice mature tone to it
  
  taste: nice light feel with tones of brown spices, forrest floor, and sour cherries. Very much together with melded flavors working together
  
  overall: some browning at the rim. This took a bit to open up, but this has turned into a very nice pinot with age on it. I'm surprised at how well it held up and the cork was in immaculate condition. The wine posseses a nice and smooth sour cherry attack and a brown spiced finish (88 pts.)

Posted from CellarTracker

[stakman1011]

I would like to get into wine someday and I think having a wine thread a la the Lounge's TLDR Beer Club is a pretty good idea.

My roomates and I often buy a gallon of Carlo Rossi for 9.99. We usually get sangria. I like to have a glass at night before bed, I like how it tastes.

I would say it's fairly obvious that I'm a bit lacking in wine knowledge and experience, so I probably won't take part in this thread, but I'll read with interest...

Stak

[mmbt0ne]

Seeing some stuff on how to do this:

nose:

taste:

overall:

Would probably make this thread go further as new people would be able to try this stuff out.

[KDawg]

Originally Posted by mmbt0ne

Seeing some stuff on how to do this:



Would probably make this thread go further as new people would be able to try this stuff out.

tasting notes are all very subjective to each person. What I may get off of a wine may be a bit different for you as it all goes back to experiences that I've had. If we're tasting a wine together, we're smelling the same thing and tasting the same thing, but its possible to get a few different descriptors because smells and tastes that I will associate with the wine will be based on my own experiences and vice-versa


that said, something that I would reccomend that people do to work on their palate and nose is hit up a grocery store. Do it with a few friends and buy blueberries, strawberries, various cherries, a variety of spices, cassis, etc. A lot of those flavors exist in wine whether it be from having traits of a grape, oak manipulation, to having orchards in a short vicinity to the vineyard

what I can say is that it can take a while to really start to pick apart a wine and really get descriptors going. I know for me, it took smelling and drinking a lot of wine before I could smell a wine and say that there's vanilla, oak, lemons, etc in a wine as it would just smell like citrus for a while. There's no real right or wrong to what you smell and what you taste.

The only thing to really do is just do as much smelling and tasting as you can do as there's no magic way to just figure it all out. Even if you just quickly jot down some thoughts after trying a wine, you've now done more then you did before, which is where you need to start

[KDawg]

something occured to me as many people have a hard time getting into french wine because they don't know the grapes involved in them. Here is a quick primer for the main varietals of the main french wine regions:

Loire White: Sauvignon Blanc and Chenin Blanc. Sancerre and Pouilly-Fume are almost always sauvignon blanc while vouvray is chenin blanc. The dessert wines that are made are from Chenin blanc

Loire Red: mostly Cab Franc. There is some Pinot noir made here too, but it mostly sucks

Red Burgundy: all pinot noir

White Burgundy: all chardonnay

Beaujolais: Gamay(think of this as pinot noir lite)

Red Rhone: In the South, the wines are Grenache heavy and in the north the wines are Syrah heavy. Other grapes that are used are Mouvedre and Cinsault as those are blending grapes

Rhone White: Viognier, Roussane, Marsanne, Grenache Blanc, and there are other rare grapes

Bordeaux red: Cabernet Sauvignon, Merlot, Cab Franc, and Petit Verdot. WHen one refers to the left bank, the wines will be Cab Sauvignon heavy and when one refers to the left bank, they will be merlot heavy(with cab franc as the main blending grape)

Bordeaux White: Sauvignon Blanc and Semillon. These can age and are interesting

Bordeaux Sweet: Semillon. To make Sauternes, the vineyards have to allow a rot to happen called botrytis. These are insanely long lived wines and can be utterly profound


Alsace: here they list the varietals on the bottle. I don't know much about this region to give a real breakdown of it, but the grapes you will see from here are Pinot Blanc, Pinot Gris, Gewurztraminer(this is the best known grape from Alsace), and Riesling

[Cancuk]

Add:

Champagne: Chardonnay, Pinot Noir, and Pinot Meunier.

[Go_Blue88]

What does a forest floor taste like?

[KDawg]

Originally Posted by Go_Blue88

What does a forest floor taste like?

its more an association that I taste with the smell that I got




One of my favorite things to drink is White Burgundy with age on it. It's really something that everyone should try. Top chardonnays can age for a long time and become extremely interesting with age on them. Here is one that I'm having right now:

• 1998 Michel Colin-Deléger et Fils Chassagne-Montrachet 1er Cru Les Chaumées - France, Burgundy, Côte de Beaune, Chassagne-Montrachet 1er Cru (9/11/2008)
  blue tinge on the end of the cork and rich golden color
  
  nose: nice and evolved nose with scents of honeycomb, creamed pears, with some roasted nut and oil tones. a bit tight on the nose, but starts to blossom as it opens up
  
  taste: medium weight feel with tones of honeycomb, creamed pears, and oil tones
  
  overall: With this domaine I was expecting this to be shot. It's far from shot with soft aromatics and nice rounded flavors that balance well. This is a nice and evolved wine, with a honeycomb attack and oily finish. Drinking perfectly right now (88 pts.)

Posted from CellarTracker



something I should explain is why I noted the blue tinge on teh cork and the color of the wine. Now, while I have said its a joy to drink aged white burgundy, since 95/96 there have been premature oxidation problems with some domaines. One theory is that there was a change of corks and that some of the domaines used lesser corks then they were using before. This domaine's wine that I'm drinking has been a poster child for premox, but I got this for a very good price so I gave it a go and am very glad that I did

[KDawg]

something that I always reccomend to people that want to really build a cellar for aging is to go to bordeaux. These are wines that generally require a lot of patience, but with the 05 vintage, prices have gone haywire. Well, with the 04 Vintage, people will be able to find plenty of wines that will age great and are very beautiful. Now all of the wines in this tasting were between 50-130, so, they aren't exactly cheap, but you can still find lots of really good bordeauxs from 04 for under 40. Granted I did title this the last affordable vintage, but the thought behind that is if you are going to get profound wines, yes you will have to spend $$$ to get them

That said, these are my thoughts from a tasting monday where a bunch of us took a look at a bunch of 04s that got a 93 from either Spectator, Robert Parker, or Stephen Tanzer


2004 BORDEAUX- THE LAST AFFORDABLE VINTAGE? - Sweets and Savories, chicago IL (9/22/2008)

A bunch of us met up to take a look at a bunch of 04 Bordeauxs that had recieved a 93 from either Parker, Suckling, and Tanzer. We focused on wines that were generally between 50-100, though some were a bit higher then 100. All wines except for the welcome flight and the desert flight were served blind. They were also revealed after every flight
Welcome White
we also had a cava too, but no notes were really taken. I found this to be a very interesting wine, and will be glad that I have this when I have mine in a few years

• 2004 Château Malartic-Lagravière Blanc - France, Bordeaux, Graves, Pessac-Léognan
  nose: a really interesting smokey backdrop with loads of minerals, limes, lemon cream, lychees, and some gunflint tones too
  
  taste: mineral laced on the palate with sweet lime tones, lemon cream, lychees, and flinty tones
  
  overall: a very pretty blanc. On the young side, but this is very nice with medium acidity and a mineral based attack and lychee+flinty finish. Will be a nice one to revisit in 3 years (88 pts.)

St Estephe&Pauillac
A very interesting flight that really showed an interesting range on the wines. The LP had to be flawed, it was just odd and there was a consensus that this was a flawed bottle. This was also made more interesting when revisiting the wines later as they showed more of their characteristics, is that because of the reveal, or did they need more air time?

• 2004 Château Cos d'Estournel - France, Bordeaux, Médoc, St. Estèphe
  nose: at first this was an upfront and very new world-esque nose of dark red fruits(with dark cherry being the predominant note, mixed in with smoke, red currants, and black berries. a bit more surface at first that then evolves giving off tones of cedar that then unravels by the end of the evening into coffee tones, red and black fruits, chalk, and asian spice tones. This really ran the gamut of being a simple wine that then showed what it really had by having more depth on the nose and more complexity
  
  taste: ever changing with black currants, black cherries, cedar box, and blackberries at first. On the retaste later in the evening, it revealed subtle tones, but with power behind it of asian spices, roasted coffee beans and exotic herbs
  
  overall: During the initial tasting, this was a good, but in a way simple wine that had a nice nose to it, but not that much depth. Everything was well in place and it was a 88-90 pt wine, but, when retried after the bag was taken off and at the end of the evening, it revealed a much more interesting wine that can age as it picked up body and tannins actually and turned into a 90-92 pt wine. With the aggregate it was a 90 pt wine, and really needs a long decant or another 12 years sideways (90 pts.)
• 2004 Château Léoville Poyferré - France, Bordeaux, Médoc, St. Julien
  nose: very odd but pungent nose with bannana tones striking you right off the bat, while tones of nail polish remover, cedar box, orange peels and some red currants lie beneath
  
  taste: much more smooth on the palate with rich cedar tones, cherries, blackberries, and black currants
  
  overall: VA problems on teh nose? I had a feeling this was an off bottle to begin with, and when revealed, I just knew that this wasn't how a Leoville Poyferre should taste or act. The nose and palate were two completely different beasts, but a few of us came to the conclusion that this had to be a bad bottle as it was just bizzare, and not in a good way NR (flawed)
• 2004 Château Pichon-Longueville Baron - France, Bordeaux, Médoc, Pauillac
  nose: nice classy and elegant nose showing floral tones, spice box, red cherries, and crushed rocks. Very pretty nose that made me guess this to be a pomerol
  
  taste: very rich tones of coffee, black currants, spice box, and red cherries. Smooth and rounded with a fat feel
  
  overall: this one was a shocker when it got revealed. I have never had a Baron that acted like this. There was no bully or gut punching style that it normally has, but, it was still a outstanding wine that was thought provoking and possesed a fluid coffee attack and rich blackberry finish (92 pts.)
• 2004 Château Pontet-Canet - France, Bordeaux, Médoc, Pauillac
  nose: very tight upfront, that took a while to reveal its charms with bold cedar tones, red cherries, loads of red and black currants with bits of spice box hiding underneath. It became a very expressive nose towards the end of the night as I let this sit in a glass
  
  taste: backwards and tannic with cedar planks, red cherry tones, red and black currants, and some pencil lead poking its head out
  
  overall: as usual with pontet canet under alfred tesseron, this needs a lot of time to fully come out. A brooding beast of a wine that screams for a rare steak, and also an 8 hour decant. This will certainly be one to revisit in 15 years(yes it probably will take that long), but it has a very nice and bold attack of cedar and a penetrating red and black currant finish (91 pts.)

Right Banks
This was a very confusing flight. Only the LeGay could've possibly been construed as a right bank in the flight, but it was guessed more as possibly the palmer. They generally showed to be very modern in style. The aromatics in this flight were great and this flight showed a lot of promise on all of the wines(the Pavie needed a lot more air time, so its hard to make a full judgment)

• 2004 Château Angélus - France, Bordeaux, Libournais, St. Émilion Grand Cru
  nose: very interesting nose of Iron and iodine right off the bat that evoked an aged chateauenuf at first(if I didn't know that the whole lineup was bordeaux). As it unwound, it reavealed a very dense and layered nose of dark red cherries, cedar box, red currants, tobbacco, and some root vegetal tones. Classic Angelus that toes the modern/traditional line
  
  taste: wonderfully fluid on the palate with layered tones of red currants, roast coffee tones, black currants, red cherries, leather and some cedar box tones
  
  overall: Great polish and wonderfully smooth and elegant. Somewhat acting like a margaux wine with a very polished black currant attack and a elegant finish possesing tones of leather and cedar box. This will definitely be a fun one to revisit in 6-8 years to see the evolution and can age gracefully for probably 25-30 years (92 pts.)
• 2004 Château Le Gay - France, Bordeaux, Libournais, Pomerol
  nose: a wonderful and beautifully open nose with impeccable balance possesing rounded tones of leather, varied floral tones, and a giant red fruited core with bits of mixed berries just permeating in your nose. Very polished and elegant with a sweet touch of class
  
  taste: very rounded and beautiful feel of leather, various red fruits, floral bits, and plush tones of mixed berries
  
  overall: a wine that is just pure class in a bottle. Silky and refined with very pretty length on the palate that just glides across like an ice dancer with a silky red fruited attack and berry based finish (93 pts.)
• 2004 Château Pavie - France, Bordeaux, Libournais, St. Émilion Grand Cru
  nose: bold but tight nose of roasted cedar tones, coffee, smoke, black cherries, and anise. When this was blind, I mistook it for a graves(notably I guessed this to be the smith-haut-lafite)
  
  taste: ridiculously tannic with roasted coffee tones, black cherries, and anise
  
  overall: in fairness, this wine wasn't decanted before the tasting, and was just bottle aired and was put towards the end of the second flight. Still, since this was a blind tasting, we can only go on what was present at the time, and it was just brutally young. Insanely tannic and wasn't as expressive on the nose as I'd expect from Pavie. This really needed more air time and under different circumstances, I'd probably have different notes, but be it as it is, this is how the bottle showed tonight (88 pts.)
• 2004 Château Pavie Macquin - France, Bordeaux, Libournais, St. Émilion Grand Cru
  nose: bold nose of roasted coffee tones, loads of black fruits, smoke, and black cherry tones. As blind, I never would've guess this nose to be close to a st emilion
  
  taste: excellent feel and fluid with roasted coffee tones, black fruits, smoke, and some black cherry tones making their way through
  
  overall: an outstanding wine with a nice full feel. A bigger merlot that left us not thinking that this was right bank(and hell, none of guessed right bank on the flight in general). Full attack of roasted coffee tones with an effusive smokey finish (90 pts.)

Graves&Margaux
a very interesting flight. This really showed off the stylistic characteristics and terroir differences the best. Outside of the shut down Haut-Bailly, we really got a sense of the terroir, and that made it really fun to dissect the wines in this flight

• 2004 Château Smith Haut Lafitte - France, Bordeaux, Graves, Pessac-Léognan
  nose: dark nose filled with smoke, scorched earth, cassis, anise, some cedar tones, and a bit of black cherry. Classic graves profile that stuck out in the flight for me
  
  taste: good medium/full bodied feel with smoke, charcol, scorched earth tones, cassis, anise, and some black cherry with bits of cedar on the back end. Well balanced and blended together
  
  overall: If you like graves, you like this wine. There were divided opinions of this wine, but for me this was just what I would expect from a graves. Nice smokey profile with a charcol attack and cedary finish (90 pts.)
• 2004 Château Palmer - France, Bordeaux, Médoc, Margaux
  nose: beautifully lifting nose of floral tones, small berries, leather, smoke, and sweet red cherries abound. wonderfully pungent and balanced with sheer beauty everywhere
  
  taste: very polished feel, but young at the same time with small berries, all sorts of florals, leather, and sweet red cherries
  
  overall: this was my co-WOTN. Both this and the le gay were on another level(though for some reason the angelus won, even though it didn't win WOTF). A very beautiful Palmer with it's sheer elegance and ingrid bergman-like class and beauty. Silky berry attack that fluidly gives way to a sweet red cherry finish. This wine will certainly reward patience as it will get even more beautiful with time (93 pts.)
• 2004 Château Lascombes - France, Bordeaux, Médoc, Margaux
  nose: very aromatic nose filled with tones of leather, dark cherries, cassis, anise, and some tobbacco leaf notes
  
  taste: great medium/full feel with some elegance possesing tones of leather, dark cherries, cassis, blackberries, and tobbacco leaf
  
  overall: an oustanding wine with a classy medium/full feel. Silky tannins with a fat leather attack and a tobbacco and dark cherry finish (91 pts.)
• 2004 Château Haut-Bailly - France, Bordeaux, Graves, Pessac-Léognan
  this was closed for business. Even moving it to one of the bigger glasses and letting it sit in there a while it just refused to offer up much

Dessert Flight
The Kracher and the Buller were real treats. It was a lot of fun and really capped off the night well

• 1998 Weinlaubenhof Alois Kracher Chardonnay TBA #2 Nouvelle Vague - Austria, Burgenland, Neusiedlersee
  nose: great and pungent nose with fat tones of apples, caramel notes, honey, and bits of apricots all blending well together in great harmony
  
  taste: wonderful and smooth feel with loads of apple tones, honey, and sweet creamed apricots on the back end
  
  overall: A really wonderful sticky. Great aromatics that translate well on the palate with just the right amount of sugar on this bottle. Drinking perfectly this just posseses a great and big apple attack with a creamed apricot finish (93 pts.)
• 1999 Weinlaubenhof Alois Kracher Chardonnay/Welschriesling TBA #3 Nouvelle Vague - Austria, Burgenland, Neusiedlersee
  nose: sweet nose of honey, melon tones, and apricots. This really paled in comparison to the 98 #2 as it was a lot more simple on the nose and didn't have the depth
  
  taste: very nice flavors of honey, melons, and apricot tones. Pretty, but more surface then anything
  
  overall: a very good wine, but doesn't have close to the depth on either the nose or palate that the 98 #2 had. It was more surface on the flavors and palate, but still very tasty, it just didn't bring it to that next level that one would expect from a Kracher (89 pts.)
• N.V. R.L. Buller & Son Calliope Rare Muscat - Australia, Victoria, North East, Rutherglen
  nose: massive nose of caramel, raisins, dates, and loads of dark chocolate with some maple syrup tones mixed in there
  
  taste: bold flavors of caramel, raisins, maple syrup, and dates. Well blended and well defined while still being big and bold
  
  overall: amazing stuff. So pungent with great balance while being pure and having great depth. Bold and brash with a big attack of caramel and a maple syrup finish (94 pts.)
• 2004 Château de Fargues - France, Bordeaux, Sauternais, Sauternes
  nose: light nose filled with honey, lemon juice, nectarines, and white peach tones
  
  taste: good feel, though a bit light with honey tones, lemon juice, and white peach notes
  
  overall: extremely young and very light in the glass. Nice and perfumed that should pick up weight as it ages with a lemon juice attack and white peach finish (91 pts.)

The lineup presented in front of us certainly led to high expectations, and everything was met for me. Lots of great wines that showed off a very elegant and beautiful vintage. For me, this is fast turning into one of my favorite vintages, and we got to taste a bunch of great young wines that showed that they will have the stuffing for the long haul.

Enough about the wines, it was also great meeting a whole bunch of new people and having a steal of a dinner, that just can't be beat
Posted from CellarTracker



so, with this, please fire away on any questions on how to get started in bordeaux. IMO there is nothing like bordeaux as they make wonderful terroir driven wines while producing a ton of cases, they also bring tons of depth that is hard to imagine considering how much they produce

[LuckyDevil]

Originally Posted by Go_Blue88

What does a forest floor taste like?

I was thinking that same question.

[Boris]

Originally Posted by Go_Blue88

What does a forest floor taste like?

I don't have an overly discerning palate but the forest floor/damp wood/mushroomy aroma is quite common in red wines that have aged over ten years. I wish I could remember the varietals I drank.

[KDawg]

Originally Posted by Boris

I don't have an overly discerning palate but the forest floor/damp wood/mushroomy aroma is quite common in red wines that have aged over ten years. I wish I could remember the varietals I drank.

piney tones are also common in burgundies and some pinot noirs from oregon

[BK_]

Anyone have any Scholium Project wines? I'm really impressed.

[KDawg]

Originally Posted by BK_

Anyone have any Scholium Project wines? I'm really impressed.

I've heard great things about them. I really want to try some of their wines before the end of the year. I have had some Sean Thackery wines, and I've really enjoyed them

[renodoc]

I'm snarfing the 1994 Pontet-Canet as I type.

Its ready and willing....