That's not what I said at all. Can't believe you passed up on this. If I were you, I'd probably regret it for the rest of my life.

Cross posted in the OOT thread, so by consensus I meant across both.

I think its the combination of the 19, plus friends sister thing that makes it a no go. (I'm actually friends with two of her brothers fwiw). If they perceive it as dodgy it could ruin friendships that I value much more than a quick shag.

And to turn your words around, if you regret for the rest of your life not bagging one 19 yr old at 29, then I'm not sure you are doing that well in life.

Meh I'm 26 and find very little in common with 19 year olds. They are just really young/naive/emotional and it's kind of irritating.

I am 22 and feel the same way for the most part.

Yeah I see what you're saying about the brothers. In a perfect world they'd understand that she is free to make her own choices, but they'd prob be pissed if they found out.

I dunno, I certainly hope I'm doing well enough at 29 to be bagging 19 yo's, but it seems kind of unlikely. Pretty rare that such young girls are interested in such older men.

I just turned 31, and as a very average looking guy, I'm always amazed at how many young women are in love with older guys. (I don't mean 19, but definitely 21-23 range).

As others have said though, it's pretty hard to have decent conversation with people that young. I think the youngest I'd probably seriously date at this point would be 25+.

Thats kinda wierd.....

There is no shortage of hot girls 22-30, there is no reason to be targeting girls in there teens at 29 unless you are a creeper. Also, if you are in a country where girls can get into bars at 18, bagging 19yos is not going to be difficult at all. Probably a lot easier to bang a hot 19yo than a hot 26yo imo.

If you had said you would hope to be banging girls in their 20s when you were 40, I would completely agree.

so what girls make the ideal "targets"? haha

Are you more attracted to girls with tight bodies or wrinkly bodies? Do you like girl with a bit of flab, or girls that have thin, firm bodies? When would you say girls' breasts and legs finish developing? What age do you think is their physical peak?

Good point, I forgot every every girl becomes fat, wrinkly and has saggy breasts at age 22. Brief googling says that breasts are fully developed between the ages of 14-17. Go get em tiger

If girls look after themselves, imo its pretty close to a plateau from 18-30, or at least close enough.

Im not arguing that 19yo girls arent hot, im arguing that you are a bit of a creeper if you are hoping to be banging them when you are 29.

a) Its predatory (though in this case I dont really care, whatever gets you going).
b) The SLIGHT increase in hotness (arguable) is negated by a HUGE decrease in personality/sexual experience. I guarantee the experience as a whole will be worse.
c) Hoping to be 'cool enough' to bang 19yos when you are 29 shows a misguided idea of society and what is cool.

FWIW I'm not against hooking up with a random 19yo at a bar if it happens for any moral reasons (though some will judge), but going after them specifically seems creepy.

I wouldn't say I've ever been in a state where I'll 'target' them, but all things being equal, if I'm just going for a random shag, I'd probably rather do it with a random 19 yo than a random 22 yo. The 19 yo is guaranteed to have a better body. Obviously she will be much less mature and have a lot less to say, but whatever, it's just a shag.

As silly and irrational as it is, we always want what we can't have. When I was 18 I fancied milfs cause I knew I would never be able to hook up with a 35 yo woman. As I get older, I come to find more and more nostalgia in hooking up w 19 yo's as it becomes less and less realistic. By the time I'm 29, I probably won't have the opportunity, so it will become more appealing.

Also "if girls look after themselves" is a huge if. Of girls over 27, it is pretty slim pickings because most people are lazy and don't maintain their bodies. 19 yo's can have perfect bodies and never exercise.

Hey guys. Haven't updated for a bit.
I know most of you said I was wayyy too much if a wreck to meet up with my ex and said that I would fall apart if I saw her. I don't take that personal at all, and I gave all the signs/reasons for most people to assume that. Anyway, A few weeks ago we hung out. It was a little bitter from both sides (dont know what I did). We talked about how we would see how hanging out goes and that it would be cool if we could be able to hang out a bit here and there as we do get along well and can talk for hours - Good company. I thought a lot and I decided I would not want to get back together. I told her this. She said she didn't want to either. At the end of the night I had to get some stuff from her house that was still there. We ended up sleeping together. Out of nowhere. It definitely wasn't where the night was heading and we hadn't been flirting or doing anything that would be suggestive.

I leave town and then have to come right back unexpectedly. A few days later she messages me on skype. I mention this to her and she said something like "so we're hanging out then?? ok which day?". Originally, I was not going to ask to see her.

Second time around. We said we would hang out for a few hours and get a drink. While we were walking to the bar she gave me the 'what happened last time can't happen again' speech. We get to the there, haven't had much to drink. She kisses me. umm? end up making out a bunch as go back to her place. bang 'til the sun comes up and then fell asleep. I didn't want to sleep there, but I actually just fell asleep.

She said she will come visit me in Whistler on my birthday in a couple weeks. I suggested that some other time would be better but she said that is the only time she can get off work (which is likely bs).

I really meant it when I said I didn't want to be with her anymore. I still feel very resentful towards her. It just wouldn't work with a barrier like that. It took a lot for me to come to that conclusion and was very tough for me; I was in denial. Now that things have taken a strange turn its thrown me off course a bit. She is messaging me more often now. Nothing crazy.
I'm just trying to understand things the best I can. It's a weird situation.

lol wat

Imo thats wrong. At 19 every girl puts on the fresher 15 (gains 15 pounds first year at college). You should probably be going for 17/18 to make sure.

I think you

a) Have some ideal in your head which is completely unrealistic regarding how perfect 19yos are
b) Overestimate the drop off from 19-25

re: 18, 19, etc. year olds.

a) it is creepy but society has put young looking girls on a pedestal. young girls are young looking so that's exactly why they are seen as so attractive/appealing to many. pedophilia is an extreme extension of this. the biggest age gap i had was sleeping w/ an 18 y/o when i was 24 and that was deemed creepy but ok by my friends b/c the girl was so ridiculously hot. at 29, i'd be ashamed of it but do it if the chance presented itself. i think the distinction of "seeking it out" vs. "doing it if the oppotunity arises" is the key.

b) at 30+, 18 y/os are pretty much creepy but again, if you're single, not looking for a relationship, and happen into it, it can be ok.

c) once you get past 35-40, it's just downright creepy and that's it. no ands ifs or buts.

d) the "they have a better body argument" only holds true for those lazy girls. my current gf has one of the best bodies i've ever been with by far and she's 35 (also first time i've seriously dated a girl older than me). sure she has genetics on her side, but she also takes great care of herself.

this thread has taken a turn for the bizarre-o

out B4 the lock

pedophilia has NOTHING to do with that, actually dcifr

Yae saying that pedophilia is an extreme extension of ppl liking younger girls is ridicolous. Pedophilia means that you are sexually attracted to pre-pubertal girls/boys. Kids that are completely undeveloped. Maybe banging 15 year olds that are like half developed is an extension of that but banging fully developed 18-19 year olds is not. People like them because their bodies are just a lot hotter than most 30 year olds since girls in general suck at taking care of their bodies making them decline in beauty faster than men.

This might be a bit off-topic but I dunno where else to post it.

I think I have some sort of self-esteem issue when it comes to girls and it's really starting to overwhelm me. I find myself constantly seeking attention from attractive girls. I wouldn't say I'm ugly, but I'm not really good looking. Despite this I've always done OK with girls, but I've always felt really insecure about my appearance. My looks are probably 6.5 or 7/10, but I'd say my personality is 9/10.

I think it stems back to my ex gf, who i was with for 4 years. After the initial infactuation period she was never really overly affectionate with me. I fancied the ass off her and I never got the impression she found me really attractive. She never said I looked hot, or ever complimented me. I could come out of the shower in a towel and she didn't bat an eyelid. Since then I've felt totally insecure.

I've just got back from a 2 week holiday. I kissed a few girls and had sex with one, she wasn't hot and it was a drunken mess. On the last night I met an absolute stunner. She was gorgeous and awesome. We hit it off straight away and ended up kissing and talking crap all night on the beach. In the morning I kinda blew her off because I thought she'd realise I wasn't a total hotty and be like 'Ughh what did I do' - even though she was sober for 90% of the night. We kissed and parted but I was a little cold and off.

Now I'm home and all I'm doing is seeking attention from girls I met, like the stunning girl gave me two of her numbers and added me on Facebook, I'm constantly checking to see if she has messaged me. On the night she kept going on about how nice I was and how there aren't any guys like me where she lives, and that I'd probably go home and forget about her (Lol @ that). She's travelling for another 6 months though which sucks.

On the holiday I spent a lot of nights talking to girls with boyfriends, I didn't care where it lead I just wanted some attention to make myself feel better. Like I'd say - 'If you were single would this go anywhere?', all of them laughed and said yeah and it made me feel good. Yet I still crave the attention and it's annoying me so bad.

I just don't know whether everyone has these feelings or if it's just me. I feel like I want to just be content and happy with myself but all i think about is how I look and obsess over getting attractive girls to like me. I'm sure nobody else realises this because even my best mate was shocked when I told him I was so insecure about my looks, and once i talk to a girl I become really relaxed and forget about everything. On holiday though I wasn't happy unless I was talking to girls.

I'm aware all this makes me sound like a stalker weirdo, but I really don't make it obvious - I've only messaged the stunner once since I got home so they don't have a clue about all this.

basing your self esteem on others' opinion of you is a recipe for low self esteem and lots of suboptimal behaviors. i don't really know how you would change this, i guess taking time to appreciate yourself for all of the things you are proud of, and building up your internal sources of self esteem.

i can relate in that i've felt some of the same things you describe at various times (the ex that never complimented you especially rings true), but this typically seems like a female pattern of behavior - seeking validation from the opposite sex to make you feel attractive.

i do find it odd that you say you have self-esteem issues, then go on to give yourself pretty lofty ratings for looks and personality. you're probably fairly high in narcissism as well.

Yeah I think it is a recipe for low self esteem.

I think it's mainly the ex thing, I always felt like she didn't find me attractive, we never had a great sex life, and she said some stuff to me afterwards like 'I used to think I had a problem with sex, now I know it was just our relationship'. I swear that killed me when she said it.

Well 6.5/10 isn't exactly high is it? I am very confident with my personality, I've been brought up right and respect everyone and have a good sense of humour. I don't think I suffer from narcissism in the sense that I am self obsessed and selfish, I'd say I'm very unselfish if anything.

Maybe using the term self esteem is wrong, it's more about my looks than anything else. I'm a confident person when everything is based on personality but as soon as it comes down to looks I feel insecure.

Maybe it does just fall down to the ex thing. I just don't really know how to try and deal with it.

FF, I felt the same way quite frequently during my university years. I think it stemmed from the fact that at high school I was nerdy/fat/never got girls and it took a while for my mind to accept that I had become more normal. People were also pretty shocked I felt that way, at least those I met post high school.

Obviously this isnt a solution that you can just apply, but what worked for me is dating a girl who DOES think im really good looking. Being told you are good looking by an attractive girl every day for 2 years does wonders for the confidence. My only concern is that if we break up I am going to have an extremely overinflated view of how good looking I am haha.

I know that probably doesnt help, but at least you know that other people have had similar experiences.

FF - My guess is that the way your ex made you feel unattractive isn't uber-relevant to your self esteem issues. There's something else rooted deeper into your foundation that causes that insecurity, something that predates that relationship.

Everyone needs validation, but one girl's lack of validating you probably can't affect you that deeply unless it's your mom.

try therapy FF

Yeah that's probably true, but she's the only serious relationship I've had.. since then I dated a girl for about a month and she constantly told me I was gorgeous.. but she wasn't nearly as attractive as my ex and seemed a bit needy so it didn't feel the same.. I'm aware how vein that is.

I wouldn't even know where to start with getting therapy.. what's weird is out of all my friends I'm the most confident with girls. When we went away I'd just walk up to any girls and ask them if I could join them, I could see my mates thinking 'How the fek does he do that' .. Even when I pulled a smoking hot girl I still didn't feel validated. Now that I'm home and she hasn't really messaged me since I feel even more deflated.

I just wanna feel content with how I look and stop worrying, I feel like I have the personality to attract almost any girl but then once they get over that my looks let me down, that's what I feel happened with my ex.. like if I was better looking things would have been a lot different between us.

A girl I'm seeing at the moment, who is pretty hot, hasn't mentioned my looks.. I'll compliment her but she doesn't ever really compliment me physically, she said I had a nice smile.. but usually it's just how funny I am etc.

I know, it sounds completely pathetic.