Actually, for some reason due to the 880's high retail price on Logitech's site ($250) I never bothered looking for it - turns out online shops sell it for $100 less than that. Just ordered one, as I'm willing to pay a little extra to never have to deal with batteries.

fwiw, i owned and hated the remote. details in the second post of this thread.

Well **** me. I even read that post yesterday but had forgotten about it by today.

Fortunately I don't think I'm quite as particular about the things you mentioned - I rarely if ever watch TV in the dark and button layout doesn't matter a ton to me, and the rechargeable issue does make a big difference for me. I should be getting it early next week at the latest, I'll let you guys know my thoughts on it.

I have it and it's fine. I guess I'm also not as particular as astro. And I also love the rechargeability.

i found the usability to be an issue in perfect brightness as well, since i use dvr functions such as pause/ff/rw all the time. the location was more difficult for me to reach than i thought it should have been, especially compared with my tivo remote, and the buttons tactically nondescript.

i also use rechargeable aa batteries with my 680. when they go low my remote notifies me, and i put them on the 15-minute charger in my kitchen's self-designated charging area. it's worked great for me, and i've been using the same set for a long time - perhaps years - with no need to put my remote in a dedicated base station.

big fwiw attached on both those segments, and everything else i say in here. although i made the OP, i hope that nobody thinks i'm asserting my thoughts as definitive. i'm just another voice in the crowd here.

Just bought the Optoma HD65

http://www.projectorcentral.com/Optoma-HD65.htm


It's really terrific, and a good price too!!!

I think I had a bad experience with rechargeable batteries or something because I had some Energizers with a travel charger and it seemed like they would just never last long at all.

Could have something to do with the fact that I once accidentally put non-rechargeable E2 lithiums or something in them once, though I don't know if that has the ability to affect the charger.

But anyway, I'm digging the 880 so far. I'm surprisingly impressed by the software; since I'm a computer geek usually stuff that strives to be user-friendly irritates the **** out of me since it generally sacrifices control options to achieve that, but it's really easy to set up the 880 to work exactly the way I want and it helps that once you input your device information it gets most of it right anyway. I'm sure this is true of all Harmony remotes though, not just the 880.

I don't really have any complaints with the buttons; I do prefer the isolated, rubber style (click link for pic of what I mean) to the 880's partitioned plastic buttons but I'm not really that particular about that sort of thing and have found it easy enough to use.

Also, super nifty feature I did not expect (also, true for all Harmony remotes I'm sure) is that it knows the "jump forward" code for my DVR, despite the fact that my DVR remote doesn't have a jump forward button; skipping through ads has never been easier!

EDIT: Since I hadn't posted it in this thread, here's the BBV thread I made about my new TV: 58" Panasonic plasma (TH-58PZ750U). I'm not a TV expert or anything so I don't know what to say about it other than that it's ****ing awesome and I love it. The 50" Sony LCD rear-projection TV it replaced had grown a little small over time, and I love having a huge screen (I sit like ~8-10 feet away). Apparently now all I need to round out my setup is a receiver and a couple floor speakers (setting up surround in my apartment living room would be a huge PITA imo) since I'm just using TV sound right now.

i love my denon avr-3808ci and 4xSBS-01, 1xSCS-01, 1xPB10-NSD speaker setup.

you could buy a sub and two surrounds, intending to pick up a matching center and two or four more surrounds later.

scotchnrocks posted this in Video Games:

Thoughts? I don't think I'd need anything too fancy from a receiver, just something I can hook a bunch of consoles and a cable box into.

When you say I could buy a sub and two surrounds, are surrounds the same type of speakers I would buy if I just got a two-channel system or would I be sacrificing quality until I did finish off the surround system? Or would it even matter since I'm not much of an audiophile?

it sounds simple, but once you put hd stuff into the equation that can start to disappear. my basic advice would be to go really 'dumb' with your receiver and use it for audio only, or pony up for a good hdmi one with support for the kind of crap you'll probably want: 1080p, good video processing and/or a bypass option, "hd audio" support, no outstanding hdmi handshake issues, net-upgradeable firmware, etc. something in-between can end up being a big pain in the ass when it comes to issues such as passing high definition content from a console through your receiver to your tv.

what i suggested would likely be a sacrifice over a dedicated 2.1 setup depending on what you selected. i'm inclined to think it wouldn't matter that much to you, but it's a big eye of the beholder kind of subject. you could do an 'upgraded' 2.1 bookshelf setup using all centers instead of surrounds as another option. i'm much more into home theater than home audio, and if it were between great-quality 2.1 or good-quality 5.1 i'd take the latter every time because of immersion. i live in a condo too. when i did the setup, it just meant some more cabling along the wall behind some shelves and couches, and instead of saying i was finished after 2 speakers i had to wait until 5. i still did it all at once. if you feel the need to hide cables inside your walls or under your floorboards or whatever, i can see that as being more of a pain in the ass.

can any of you audio/videophiles give me some advice on a system?
budget is 10,000. im moving into an apartment with a large living room, with 6-7 large windows shining sun in. building is pretty new and quality, so system can be pretty loud but nothing too crazy.

i was hoping to get a projector, but with the windows beside where it would be, im not sure it will work? i was thinking about getting a 65" plasma, but they're about 7k. i can get a quality 50" for 3k.

what it do?

You just need a couple of good blinds/curtains.

Plasmas do better in dark rooms so get good curtains or go with an LCD.

I would definitely look at the $500 Onkyo, Denon, Yamaha, and Harmon Kardon recievers. All of them should have HDMI and be grat for a systems. For speakers I would definitely look at stuff from AV123 and the other online sellers. Check AVS forum for the others since I am drawing a blank. They are often better speakers for the price as the have no storefronts and no advertising costs. Surrounds are just the left and right speakers as in a 5.1 system you have two front surrounds, two rear surrounds, a center speaker, and a sub. My room can't have room for surround (which is overrated IMO), so I woul also reccomend to start off with great bookshelf or mini-towers for your front surrounds and you can always add better speakers later.

Typically people spend the most money on the front surrounds and sub as the will also be the stereo speakers for music and most tv is not surround. Then people will add a good center channel speaker as it will carry alot of the dialog and then last the rear surrounds, which are basically only useful for movies with surround sound.

Goofy, check my post in this thread that says what I went with. My setup is an awesome 2.1 setup with Onkyo receiver and speakers from AV123.

edit: just realised i dont think i actually posted what i ended up getting, so here it is.

Pioneer 50" Plasma
Onkyo 650 Receiver
2x Rocket towers for the front
1x Rocket center channel

Then of course PS3, Oppo upconverting DVD player, TiVo Series 3, etc.

So to anyone - If I don't own a decent DVD player yet, shouldn't I just buy a BluRay player and be done since they are backwards compatible with my 20 or so regular dvd's and they won the war and I'll be getting a HD 1080p soon?

Definitely would recommend a ps3 if you have any interest in gaming or streaming music/movies through your system

I'm looking to pick up a new TV mainly for PS3 gaming/movies. Leaning towards the new Panasonic plasma's.

http://www.onecall.com/ProductDetails.aspx?id=90565

I'll also probably pick up a Onkyo htib for a cheap sound solution.

If you're willing to do a bit of research and spend a bit of extra time shopping around, you may be able to put together a superior alternative to an htib for about the same price. Check this thread in the AVS forum. I stumbled across it after getting my Panasonic plasma a few months ago and am very glad I did.

Just so you guys know

Here

This is where I go to get my electronics online. Here are some 60+" DLP TV's for on average under $2k, and IMO have as good of a picture as plasmas. I have a 65" in my living room and it has an absolutely crystal clear picture and 1080p blu ray's look incredible. I bought it from here for $1599, and it looks like there are some refurbs for even cheaper.

For plasma, there are glare reducing screens. I've seen them side by side with the non-glare-reducing screens, and I slightly prefer the non-glare-reducing, because the picture is brightest and clearest. So, you'll need some darkening shades or blinds. The glare-reducing coating or process puts a slight haze on the picture, IMO. Although they claim to increase the contrast ratio on the TV to compensate.

I think the best plasma I've found for the price is the Panasonic TH-50PZ700U, which is 1080p. Of course if you don't feel you need 1080p at 50" (many feel you don't) then you can get by for less. This is about $3k. To get better you probably have to go to the Pioneer Kuro, which is going to be more expensive. Costco has the Panasonic for $2,300.

Didn't know the 85 series was available already. That is probably a good bet.

With regard to PS3 - I'll add some things I've learned.

The PS3 is supposedly a fine Blu-Ray player. It also plays CDs, etc. (if other music formats are important to you, check into it.) You navigate the movie menu with the cordless game controller by default. However you can buy an optional remote for movies that costs around $25. It's included in some packages. It is generally not compatible with universal remotes, because it doesn't use infrared.

There is a 40G model which you should avoid if you want backward compatibility with PS2 games. Otherwise, not a problem.

The PS3 does not bitstream the advanced lossless audio formats - i.e. TrueHD or DTS-MA. It will decode TrueHD itself, however there's not any support for DTS-MA at all. Now, one advantage of the PS3 over some other Blu-Ray players is that it's internet-upgradable (you can download updates to it.) This does not mean it will bitstream DTS-MA, because the chip it uses won't support that. But there are rumours it could decode DTS-MA with an update in the future, but Sony hasn't said.

That might or might not be a big deal to you. Most Blu-Ray discs have multiple audio formats. Even if you can't decode DTS-MA, the disc might offer PCM or TrueHD. If not, then plain DTS, which is still going to be better than plain Dolby. It all depends on what formats the disc provides, and what direction this is headed in the future.

So, the PS3 seems like a great choice - a total no-brainer for some - as a Blu-Ray player, because it costs about the same or less than a dedicated BR player, and adds - well, all the Playstation stuff that most people buy it for anyway! Current lack of DTS-MA is an issue, as is the remote. But it reportedly gives an excellent picture, and also loads faster than most dedicated players.

I'm currently leaning toward
- Panasonic TH-50PZ700U
- PS3
- Onkyo TX-SR605

The Onkyo decodes all the advanced bitstreams like TrueHD and DTS-MA. This would be a great choice in a relatively inexpensive AV receiver for mixing with a new Blu-Ray player like the Panasonic DMP-BD30K. This is what I'd get instead of the PS3 if I wanted a dedicated player (it bitstreams DTS-MA for the Onkyo to decode.)

good post lavaman.

regarding dts-ma, i'm not sweating it. virtually no players support it at the moment, but it's starting to happen and i expect the ps3 to quickly follow suit. on bitstream vs pcm, i'll also need to hear a side-by-side before i can bring myself to get especially concerned about the latter. bitstream seems more correct to me by hop reduction alone, but are there any professional blind tests out there?

the current-gen onkyos would appear to pack a value punch, but i've read about tons of issues: altered black levels, speaker popping, audio sync. you talked about the ps3's firmware updates, and that's the main reason i wouldn't buy a new heavier onkyo. no internet-based updates, and you're supposed to fill out a waiver before doing a manual snail update or take it to a dealer. when the process sucks that bad, i have to think that updates are also much less likely to be issued. i trust that most things can get worked out in firmware, but there need to be updates and they need to be deployed easily. others, like denon, have ethernet ports and internet-based updates and that's part of the reason i went with them even though the onkyos have reon video processors.

i'd similarly avoid a dmp-bd30k. no ethernet. with a set-top player you can still update via burned cd or whatever, my oppo works that way and it's fine. hd dvd and blu-ray have pumped out regular updates for a while though, and blu-ray has a lot more going on than dvd so that pace might keep up for a while. cd-based could become a pain in the ass they became regular and necessary. the real problem no ethernet on a blu-ray player presents to me is that it has no shot at bd-live (profile 2.0), though, and an soon-to-be incomplete blu-ray implementation is a total dealbreaker for me. release and post-release internet features could become a huge thing.

i basically think HT things are becoming less like appliances and more like computers, and that the importance of software updates can't be underestimated.

my one and only serious complaint about the ps3 as a blu-ray player is the lack of built-in IR remote support. i imagine that harmony will come around to bluetooth on stuff soon though. logitech is already courting the htpc/ps3 segment with the upcoming dinovo mini keyboard/pointer combo, it's bluetooth-only. maybe it'll kickstart a bluetooth remote trend in general, which doesn't necessarily sound like a bad thing if it actually reaches standard status. my wii remote sync issues had me concerned about bluetooth remotes in general, but the ps3's controller connection has been rock stable for me.

guys i have a few on topic questions that i hope can be answered.

i saw some blu-ray and was just in love with the picture quality. now, i like my home theater setup (just a 'system in a box' sony, but it fits my viewing area great) can i just fun cables from the blue ray rcvr/PS3 into the home theater console?

follow up, i have an xbox360 as my gaming console. i dont use it much so i dont feel i NEED a PS3....however if getting a PS3 is overall better value than just a standalone BL-RY player i will just get the PS3. also, if the PS3 is a clearly superior platform to the 360 i will just upgrade also. i am going on the assumption that the BL-RY player on the PS3 is just as good as any other.

Seems like concensus is that XBox>PS3 for gaming but that PS3 is a pretty decent BR player as long as you don't care that much about the convenience of the remote. So if you'll play the PS3 (it has a few sweet games, but not nearly as many as XBox) and you won't mind using a separate remote from your universal, then just go ahead and get PS3... And yes, you can just run cables into your HT. But they might have to be component cables, depending on your HT, as opposed to HDMI...