I appreciate the reply.
i jsut recently switched to FR and ive always had spew/tilt probs... so ive been trying to nit up, and i have greatly.

but do you think I could be 3betting fairly light from the button? and also im guessing if its folded to me I can start open raising ATC from the high jack and cutoff?

Appreciate your reply wems. MP seems to be problematic for me, I was playing alot of 6 max recently where MP is almost inexistant and have really lost my idea of how to play these 2 positions. I have found loosening up my game here with lots of steals hasn't been profitable as the button and CO often come into the pot and I am now playing OOP and basically have to hit the flop. As for limping UTG it is something I never do anymore, the small difference in vpip is from when I began this sample size and was doing some experimenting. 95% of the time my gameplan is raising 4bb+1 per limper from any position.

Also I saw in your last post that you have spew/tilt probs..I can relate lol. I've played with you a few times in the FR games wouldn't be surprised if you saw me donk off a stack. I swear there is no worse feeling then what comes after you 3 barrel someone for no reason without even thinking with complete air after just losing to a 2-3 outer, then realizing what you just did. I have come to name this thoughtless, tilt induced, momentarily insane 3 barrel phenomenon as 'matusowing'.

Another question I have is about my button play. As you can see my VPIP goes from 23 to 34 from CO to button and I think I may be playing too loose, even for the button. I choose my spots however any suited/non suited connectors paint cards and pairs I am usually raising with 0-2 limpers (with regard to stack sizes of course..I am not raising short stacks with 56o for example). However I am starting to think it may be optimal to play my button at high 20s VPIP. What do you guys think? However I'm going to go over my hands and see exactly how many of my losses have been from spewing as I have been known to fire the occasional terrible 2nd/3rd barrel..so it may turn out my button is more profitable then CO in reality (had I not mindlessly spewed!!!)

Hi, if anyone could analyse my stats and graphs, thanks!

I'm really curious now about the non-showdown line being in the minus, and wether it's indicative of a leak.

Doesn't it almost entirely depend on the tendencies of your opponents instead?

I've thought about it, and it seems to me that against calling stations (which is from whom most of your money comes from at 5NL and 10NL), the optimal strategy will result in the non-showdown line being far in the minus and the showdown line skyrocketing instead. Whereas against opponents that can lay down their hands (much rarer at the lower stakes and more common at higher stakes), you can grow the non-showdown line by bluffing them off their hands.

I mean imagine playing against people who will almost never fold to pot-sized bets when they have a little something. Essentially you will play your hand face up against them: bet hard three streets whenever you have a hand, and give up when you don't. When you don't have anything, the best thing to do is give up, because you can't get them to fold worse. When you have a good hand, the best thing to do is to bet ridiculous amounts for value, because they will call with worse. This means in non-showdown pots, you never win much, because when you don't go to showdown, that means you don't have anything, and you are just giving up on the pot. Whereas when you do go to showdown, you likely have been value betting the whole way and now get paid off ridiculously. The non-showdown winnings line will be in the negative because mostly it will consist of hands where you gave up after putting something into the pot. While the showdown winnings line is actually skyrocketing from the massive pots pumped full of pure value, even if it doesn't look that that impressive on the graph. If you reduce the amount of money lost in the non-showdown pots by being more timid, you lose a proportinal amount from the showdowon pots. You cannot reduce the amount of money lost in the non-showdown pots by being more aggressive with weaker holdings, because you can't get your opponents to fold: if you have indeed been too timid thus far, you will instead increase your showdown line even more, because you are getting paid on the hands you weren't getting paid on before; if you have been aggressive enough, you will instead lose from the showdown pots by losing more whenever your opponent has the better hand, without altering the non-showdown line that much.

And now in contrast imagine people that fold everything but the nuts. If you see showdown, that means you just lost because your opponent has the nuts. On the other hand, you take down every single pot that they don't have the nuts. Now your showdown winnings will be in the minus, whereas non-showdown winnings are going to skyrocket.

It's obviously a simplification, but honestly I feel at the microstakes most of your profit comes from pretty much playing your hand face up against calling stations, betting hard on your good hands and giving up with your bad ones. If you are actually good enough to bluff at the right spots and decieve a thinking opponent etc, you shouldn't be playing at the bottom micros. At the higher limits however, people are much more capable of folding worse, so there's a much lower potential of making $$$ with showdown - and much higher one without.

In short, as long as your game isn't downright dreadful, I don't feel the difference between the showdown line and the non-showdown line is indicative of a leak or even your playstyle - it is instead indicative of the playstyle of your average opponent.

Ok please some input from Good PT analysts thanks

As you can see I am not doing badly but I want to somehow get to 6-8bb per 100

Haha, I'm definitely not Good in any way but...

9-tabling? Might the fact of how many tables you play become a limitation here? It's easy to see how to get the PTBB/100 up, but if you need to drop the number of tables for it, $/hr may even decrease, so keep that in mind.

In any case you definitely need to loosen up from late position (I'm like 20/16 OTB and I thought I'm nitty... I would get it even higher, like 25/20 at least, if I wasn't multitabling on the limit of my attentiveness, while UTG I'm 8/8 almost like you), get your attempt to steal up to at least 25%, that should be manageable even on many tables. As it is you're just not positionally aware enough.

I see you limp small pocket pairs in EP? I would say raise. It's too easy to catch on to what you're doing, and fold to your set. People who are paying off to your set as it is, will also pay off (and perhaps even better because the pot is bigger) to it when you raise your 22-66 preflop. While some of the people who are figuring out your low PP setmining as it is might pay you off a bit more when you start raising them instead.

Be more bold postflop. W$SD of 61% indicates you might be sometimes folding when you're ahead. You might want to get in more cbets as well.

In short, be more bold overall.

At least such are the thoughts of a n00b like me

Not sure if this was in response to me.
9-tabling - No I usually play between 16-22 tables at a time.
Not sure where u get the limping from EP - tend to open for raises but I cold call alot of my pairs outside of kk/aa - which I could be 3-betting.
I am concerned about W$SD being 60% but doesnt that mean could mean I am not value raising well enough - I think you will find alot of my action goes in on the flop and turn..and when it reaches the river I dont always extract the most value except on the top of my range - this can lead me to be happy to c/c or see the showdown. It might also be a function of the level I play at and the fact that I am willing to price the loose passive players into calling...ah its hard to tell.
The c-betting and double barrelling which might be why I am not winning enough money without showdown - well that is a good point - it prolly means I need to getting better postflop which is hard to do while playing 16-22 tables. But I find that not c-betting air has definite advantages in multitabling because i dont have to spend too much energy defending marginal situations.
I would like someone to help with defining more closly HUD stats I should be exploiting in late position and with c-bets but getting that info is like pulling teeth from people.

Oh. Simple calculation said you go at about 600 hands per hour, I usually get about that when 9-tabling, that's where I took it from. Probably some quirk in the stats then.

From your UTG stats being 8/6. You can't cold-call UTG, because you're the first to act, so that's the position I automatically chose to check for this. UTG+1 has the same thing to a lesser extent. Now that I rechecked it, your UTG+2 and UTG+3 stats are legit, so I have no idea what's going on. I just assumed if you open limp a fourth of your UTG range, it's the same for the whole EP. Small pocket pairs was the obvious assumption. I wonder what on earth makes the UTG stand out? What are you open limping UTG and UTG+1 that you are not open limping UTG+2 and UTG+3?

Yes, I sometimes have to do this even 9-tabling, so I can't imagine how it could be possible keeping up optimal style for one table while megamultitabling, you need an almost automatic strategy for that. You definitely need to cut down on the number of tables if you want to improve and move up. For 16-22 tabling at your current limits, your stats are probably quite optimal. A winrate of 6-8ptBB while 16-22 tabling would be pretty darn spectacular. So you'll have to split your time between studying in order to move up, and doing what you do now in order to make $$$ and build your roll for moving up.

Just use Folds to Continuation Bet in your HUD, fairly straightforward at the micros as far as I can tell. If a high fold to continuation bet, high VPIP and low PFR, has limped in front of you, you can open up considerably from late position, because they will likely call your preflop raise and then fold to your cbet.

Your far to much of a nit digger, no offense.


Your Att to steal should be double what it is now, your losing on loads of money by being so tight from LP.

Again you are losing alot in non-showdown pots. If someone limps in front of you instead of of limping alot with small PP's or SC's you should be raising and c-betting nearly every flop if it's heads up.

I'd start 3betting more aswell, if your only 3betting K' and A's people will eventually realise. You'll get through NL 50 fine, but as you move up you will struggle as people will know you have the nuts. Depending on vilans but I'd 3bet nearly all P's on the BTN. I'd definitly be 3betting T's+ in any position. IF your just calling preflop, then c/f when you dont hit your set thats throwing alot of money down the toliet and one of the reasons your losing in non showdown pots.

Vantek summed it up in last last post, you have to decide which is more important, moving up, improving winrate or improving your game.

Vantek - I have a pretty good sample size of most of the reg/semi/reg players at 50NL - but playing 16-22 tables makes HUD hard to manage in terms of it begins to crowd the screen. I currently keep the VPIP/PFR/Cbet/FCbet/Hand No. - I might have to include fold to steals to get my LP stats up.
So I am not sure if it is a function of playing the amount of tables I do or that I am too nittish. I guess I need to find some solid LP techniques combined against suitable villians as well as open my 3 bet with position range.
Thank you Ted and Van - If you think of anything else feel free to PM me with any thoughts you have or post it here

I agree with adjusting gradually and if I was you I would write down a list of the things you feel you could imrpove and just take them 1 at a time to try and imrpove slowly.

I'd still like to know what makes your UTG stats 8/6 :P

Have you tried stacking your tables? I hear it's optimal for megamultitabling and I can imagine why.

That's not even necessary, I don't use it, it takes a big sample size to determine it - you can assume it fairly well from VPIP, PFR, overall aggression, attempt to steal and fold to continuation bet. A typical tighty-passive will fold a lot to steals. Someone who is very loose will obviously not. Someone who folds a lot to cbets, will likely fold a lot to steals and even if he won't, all the better for you, because he will likely fold to your cbet instead, having donated extra money. Someone who attempts to steal a lot himself however, will likely understand if you attempt to steal.

Sounds good luck!

hi.
Ive been playing NL100 for the last half year but hit a big down recently so I started over at NL50 again 4 days ago.
this is a small sample but my NL100 stats looked similar.
I still feel unlucky, in fact Im down with KK..

can you guys give me any advice based on my stats?

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Obviously I suck at the internets/computers but I got the images up even if its ugly.

Was wondering if anyone saw anything specific?

The main thing I saw my self is my WTSD% is at 20% which is not near the 25% that is stated as ideal in the first post.

Why is this am I folding too much before showdown? Or other reasons?

I generally play get it in or or out on earlier streets but I want to see what people think about that number being so low..

I also think there is an odd gap between my vpip and pfr. This seems to be coming from huge gaps in these numbers out of the blinds is this a potential leak? And how would I address it?

Thanks and sorry for the messiness

Where did you get the never limping from UTG?
I know of really good players limping with 22-99

Don't compare televised tournament late stages or high stakes to online beginners. For the latter, never limping first in is the standard you shouldn't really deviate from without a good reason.

Just wondering if you people can give any comments on my stats. I'm playing poker for about 3 months now, starting at 2NL, moving up to 5NL and after 10k hands there now at 10NL (planning on moving to 25NL once my roll is good enough for that...).

Are there any really noticable things I might have missed? I usually 4-table.

Overall:


By position:

You can play it both ways. There are much more important things to worry about imo. Like your post flop play.

a) I think 22 is a flea ridden dog of a hand in cash games
b) Limp/called flopped sets are much harder to stack with than if you either are the preflop raiser or have position or both.
c)Against aware opponents your cards become face up in effect so unless you are gonna rep sets successfully some of time it can be a leak

I'd STILL like to know what makes your UTG stats 8/6, Digger :P

Which was kind of my point. Perhaps you can limp, but you must be damn good to do it. If you are playing the micro stakes, you are not damn good. Raising makes poker easy. Just use the industry standard preflop, and concentrate on improving your postflop. The industry standard preflop is almost never limping.

If UTG raising range is any PP, AQs+ AK then probably raising 22-TT and calling 3bets for set value.

I do that, but my UTG is 7.45/7.45 (and UTG +1 10.21/10.09, UTG+3 8.97/8.79). Calling a reraise to your raise still counts towards PFR.

I would like to know too... I am still trying to get my head around PT stats
If you have some detailed threads to point me to. I would be much obliged.

Go to Filters choose Actions, then mark "open limp".

Two hands showed up for me, one 22 and one 44 :P Probably things were hectic at that moment so I literally didn't have time to raise them.

I wonder if PT3 takes into account if you auto post blinds out of position