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| Micro Stakes Full Ring Discussion of up to .25/.50 online no-limit pot-limit Texas hold'em full ring games, situations and strategies |
06-06-2010, 03:02 AM
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#1
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See my coaching listing
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: "That Gay Chap from 2+2"
Posts: 10,730
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LC--Light 3 Betting: The Quiz
OK, this is mainly for the NL $50 players, at whose stakes semi-bluff 3 betting is becoming a fairly standard part of the game. Everybody is free to participate, I just thought that I might point out that some of this stuff might get you in trouble below $50.
I took these hands from a hand review I did with my coach yesterday in which we were focusing on this issue. So all 10 of these hands have been reviewed by both yours truly and my coach, and we have agreed on a best answer, which I will post later in the thread. Some of them are very close decisions.
What I am going to do is to post the hands in groups of 3, 3 and 4, and we will discuss each group until we have identified the factors for each that we think argue in favor of 3 bet, call or fold, and what we think the right answer is for each.
To aid you in making a decision, I have included my HUD stats and any reads or history I have with the players in the hand. If I don't mention reads or history, there is none that would aid our decision.
Hud Stats:
Hands/abbreviated name/WTSD
VPIP/PFR/AF/3bet%/F3bet%/4bet%/F4bet%
FBB2steal/FSB2Steal/ATS/FlopCbet%/FFlopCbet%/TurnCbet%/FTurnCbet%
Hud Stats:
Hands/abbreviated name/WTSD
VPIP/PFR/AF/3bet%/F3bet%/4bet%/F4bet%
FBB2steal/FSB2Steal/ATS/FlopCbet%/FFlopCbet%/TurnCbet%/FTurnCbet%
Hud Stats:
Hands/abbreviated name/WTSD
VPIP/PFR/AF/3bet%/F3bet%/4bet%/F4bet%
FBB2steal/FSB2Steal/ATS/FlopCbet%/FFlopCbet%/TurnCbet%/FTurnCbet%
Eyeballs is a good, solid regular. No specific read, but I have seen him around a fair amount.
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06-06-2010, 03:13 AM
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#2
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adept
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Vancouver
Posts: 717
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Re: LC--Light 3 Betting: The Quiz
Hand 1) Fold
At first I thought the hand was at 50nl, and I'd 3bet it if we had these stack, but since it's at 100, I'd probably just fold it, as we don't have much showdown equity, and not as much FE as I'd like to make a move here.
Hand 2) 3bet
I've been experimenting with 3betting in these spots lately, and I think against a halfstacker it's a profitable 3bet/fold. With his stack size, and the size of the pot if he calls, we can profitably get it in with TP IMO as he'll be likely to stack any big pair, or any big draw.
Hand 3) 3bet
Against this reg, I think we've just got way too much FE to take any other line. We can apply tons of pressure, and get him to fold even overpairs. However, I'm expecting to take this down pre most of the time, since it looks like a pretty std iso. If he 4bets, ez fold, but if he calls, we've still got some equity with our suited 3 gapper.
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06-06-2010, 03:17 AM
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#3
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Pooh-Bah
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 4,366
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Re: LC--Light 3 Betting: The Quiz
Hand 1: Fold
Hand 2: 3bet or fold, depends how wide he steals from CO
Hand 3: Undecided between 3betting or folding b/c fish may call our 3-bet with a lot of his range and it's likely reg's ISO range is narrower than his CO steal.
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06-06-2010, 03:18 AM
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#4
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banned
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 1,802
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Re: LC--Light 3 Betting: The Quiz
Fold
Fold
3-Bet
I'd explain it in more detail but trying to process all that and going back and forth between pics and stats just gave me a headache.
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06-06-2010, 06:28 AM
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#5
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veteran
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 2,876
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Re: LC--Light 3 Betting: The Quiz
hand 1 - fold. don't have enough stats to go off on, and we won't be able to barrel him off all that often
hand 2 - fold. he's a nit and 1/2 stacked which is the main problem, because post- our FE is going to be drastically reduced w. an SPR of just under 2.
hand 3 - 3bet. reg will give you more credit, and his CO iso range is still gonna be pretty **** wide. only problem is if fish decides to limp/call the 3bet, in which case reg will and should call with alot of his range (obv disregarding the range he was gonna 4bet anyway). it's unlikely ur gonna get 4bet-bluffed by reg here if fish folds also.
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06-06-2010, 06:39 AM
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#6
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journeyman
Join Date: Apr 2010
Posts: 278
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Re: LC--Light 3 Betting: The Quiz
1) Fold (Coming from a guy who's 3-betting 7.5% @ 100NL FR)
His openingrange there is only about ~10% (guestimated from pfr + ats)
His 3-bet is very high (altho sample maybe too small) => he may understand light 3-betting
0% Fold to CBet doesnt rly help either altho again sample is prolly too small to draw a real conclusion
K7o ain't a a super light 3-bet hand, you got a blocker and thats about it
2) 3-Bet
He opens about 20% there. His Fold to 3-bet isnt very high but add Fold to Flop CBet compensates enough imo
A4s is the perfect light 3-bet hand
3) 3-Bet
He opens like 25% there, Folds a whopping 83% to your 3-bet. Fish isn't dangerous.
K9s is ok for a 3-bet
5-bet shove if BB 4-bets (16% 4-bet lol)
Fold if SB 4-bets
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06-06-2010, 07:27 AM
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#7
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old hand
Join Date: May 2009
Location: NY
Posts: 1,507
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Re: LC--Light 3 Betting: The Quiz
Maybe its just me, but I don't see any HH in the OP...?
EDIT: nevermind, the images are just taking a while to load
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06-06-2010, 08:16 AM
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#8
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banned
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: you want some grapes? bitch.
Posts: 1,860
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Re: LC--Light 3 Betting: The Quiz
1: fold
2: call
3: toss up between call and 3 bet. i lean towards call because fish like to limp/call 3 bets. If the fish didn't limp I would certainly call instead of 3 bet.
Disclaimer: I like playing postflop and avoid 3 betting hands I can profitably call.
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06-06-2010, 08:34 AM
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#9
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Pooh-Bah
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Soft Sites, Great Staking Deals.
Posts: 3,890
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Re: LC--Light 3 Betting: The Quiz
Hand 1: 3bet. Two nits in the blinds who arent going to try any bs, he folds enough to make it outright profitable, we cant call this hand profitably ever, we have a blocker etc.
Hand 2: Fairly standard light 3 bet spot. Would be better if he was full stacked though.
Hand 3: Call or fold, if your 3 betting this, its an attempt to re-iso the fish, and should only be done if you think that is profitable, b/c you will get called alot.
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06-06-2010, 08:57 AM
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#10
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Pooh-Bah
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: lol giblaments
Posts: 4,544
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Re: LC--Light 3 Betting: The Quiz
I don't play 50NL, but I (want to take the quiz and I) would say:
1) fold
2) 3bet
3) call
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06-06-2010, 09:48 AM
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#11
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centurion
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 154
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Re: LC--Light 3 Betting: The Quiz
Hand 1: fold
Hand 2: 3bet, We have a blocking card and feel we take this down enough of the timeto be profitable, not to mention we will have position postflop if he decides to call, I fold to a 4bet from him though, I dont think he would ever 4bet light here.
Hand 3: 3bet, I think we are taking the pot down here, shoving to a 4bet from the reg (17%) and if the fish decides to call and the other folds, im cbetting any flop. I dont feel like the fish even with a 22% FtoCbet is going to continue many flops in that pot. We only have 80 hands and its not a standard raise 3x and cbet, its going to be a huge pot that hes going to think that we have Aces in. Also folding to a 4bet from blinds.
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06-06-2010, 11:11 AM
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#12
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Carpal \'Tunnel
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Not ITT
Posts: 6,876
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Re: LC--Light 3 Betting: The Quiz
Hand 1, I fold. We don't really have enough of a sample on this guy to know what he's going to do, the reads we DO have don't really suggest we'll have a lot of FE. Also, our hand's really a bit too weak to be doing this imo. If we had a better read, I'd contemplate a 3bet with K9s or something like that, but here, I'd just let it go.
Hand 2, I usually fold due to stack size. If villain was full, I'd probably 3bet, given that we have a suited high-card hand IP (which means we can actually manipulate the pot size if we hit TP) and that we can flop equity a decent % and get him to fold a medium PP with some aggression. With this stack size, however, we're going to find ourselves in quite a few marginal commitment spots (especially since this is the kind of hand that can flop equity), so I'd rather just let it go.
On another note, if we had a larger sample on this guy, his postflop #s suggest that he's going to cbet wide, but never really barrel wide, so calling to keep the pot small and leave yourself room to float is a good plan as well...I just don't think we have enough hands yet.
Hand 3, I'd 3bet. Aside from the FE we'll have, we're really not in an awful spot if the limper calls, given that we're IP with a decent suited king. I don't think that the iso-er is going to overcall a whole lot and we can fold easily if we get 4bet. As far as hand strength, this is exactly the kind of hand I'd be 3betting...once we start getting into KJs/KQs, I think we have enough postflop value to just call IP, but K9s is just outside of that range (imo).
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06-06-2010, 11:18 AM
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#13
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old hand
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 1,380
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Re: LC--Light 3 Betting: The Quiz
fold
fold
3b
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06-06-2010, 11:28 AM
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#14
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old hand
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: POWER range merging
Posts: 1,615
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Re: LC--Light 3 Betting: The Quiz
fold
3bet
3bet
When do we get the answers?
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06-06-2010, 11:55 AM
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#15
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veteran
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: UK
Posts: 2,039
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Re: LC--Light 3 Betting: The Quiz
1 fold
2 close but fold
3 3bet
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