Regular Wars

Disclaimer!! / A little about myself

I am mainly a 1/2 FR player on ftp, I play under the name newmanmi and employ a very aggressive style which is only profitable because of my hand reading skills as well as my pre and post flop game. Some of the things I say in this COTW may be more suited towards a lot more aggressive games such as small or mid stakes fr games. The concepts and ideas however can be tried and tested at micro stakes, it is important to note the overall level of aggression will be lower at the micros and some of the plays not as necessary because reg wars will be less likely.


Glossary:
To save myself some time later in the post I am writing a small glossary of terms I will use frequently with their meanings, by now I hope most of these acronyms are easy for everybody to understand but just to be thorough I thought I would include them:

PFR: Preflop raiser
IP: In positon
OOP: Out of position
TAG: Tight aggressive
3b: 3-bet, a re-raise before the flop
RR: Reraise / reraised
C/R: Check / raise
cbet: A continuation bet (a bet as the pfr after the flop is dealt)
HEM: Holdem Manager
HUD: Heads up display
TAG: Plays a modest amount of hands with a high level of aggression post flop.
LAG: A loose aggressive player, can be very hard to play against.
NIT: A very tight player, normally very straight forward pre and post flop.

What is a regular
A regular is a player who plays a considerable volume of hands at a particular limit. You will consistently come across these players across many of your tables (if you are multi tabling) and have to deal with them day in and day out. It literally pays money to try and understand each of these regulars and exploit their leaks to the fullest.

There are many different types of regulars because not any 1 pre flop style is the most profitable for any 1 person. Learning to play a different style can be great for your game, both in terms of your progression as a poker poker and it can be fun!

ALWAYS REMEMBER EVERY REG IS DIFFERENT, EVEN IF THEIR PRE FLOP STATS LOOK THE SAME!!

Dealing with constant 3bettors:
There are many things to think about when dealing with a player who consistently 3bets pre flop, it is also important to note if they are specifically targeting you or just generally 3betting everyone pre flop. The difference will decide whether we are going to be in a war or not.

What type of hands are they 3betting, from what positions?
This is a very important concept to understand for various reasons; many weaker players will be only re-raising a very narrow, polarized (towards value) range of hands and it is important to know who simply is not re-raising light. On the other hand a person who is 3betting a lot pre flop may have a well balanced range mixed with pure bluffs (junk hands), connected hands (suited connectors, suited aces etc) and premium hands (JJ+ AK etc).

Open your HEM, go to the “Players” tab, filter for the stake at which you play regularly and put a minimum number of hands (1000+ should be good). Your results should come out something like this (names blocked out for obvious reasons).



By right clicking on the row of a regular in which you would like to study, you get several options; we will be using the “Popup player detail window” which is the second option:



This will provide us with a screen that looks like this:



By changing to the “preflop cards” tab and selecting “3 bet” we are able to see what hands (that have gone to showdown) that a player is 3betting before the flop. It is important to note the more aggressive the regular, the less likely they are going to be showing down hands so the range that we see here may not include a lot of their trashier hands (i.e when a hand is rr pf and the pfr folds, that player successfully widened their 3b range without anyone noticing the hands they may be 3b).

In the example above we can see two very different player types; we will call them player A and B from left to right respectively.

- Player A plays a very tight 11/7 style with a 3b of 2.4%, using poker stove (http://www.pokerstove.com/) we come up with a range of roughly TT-AA (no AKs or AKo). This is in line with his chart as displayed above; the majority of his 3b range is comprised of super premium hands.

- Player B plays a much looser 17/14 style with a 3b of 7.3%, we can see by looking at his chart he is 3betting a much wider range of hands (not as polarized towards only strong hands), we can imagine this player has a much wider 3b bluffing range and should be adjusted to accordingly (we will talk about this later).

Another useful way to study in what way a player is re-raising pre flop is to note what % of hands they are 3betting from what position, this can be achieved by hovering your mouse cursor over their 3b stat in the HEM HUD whilst playing, a box like below will be displayed in which we can view their 3b % by position.



As we can see the player above ( who has an overall 3b of 5%) 3bets roughly the same percentage of hands from each position, although slightly more from the CO and BB and slightly less from the sb.

What does this tell us? The slight increased 3b % in late position spots shows us that this player likely 3bets a wider range of hands as bluffs against aggressive late position openers (people who have a high steal %).

So how do I fight back, Newman? That’s a great question and I am glad you asked!! There are several ways to combat a player who wants to “go to war” with you and I will try to explain the pros and cons to each, always remembering that the best poker players are able to “switch gears” constantly, I will try to explain that concept later.


How do they react to 4bets? (4b bluffing)
Just because a player 3bets a lot does not mean they are willing to stick all of the money in pre flop, the player above has a fold to 4bet of 50%, however a lot of regulars who 3b a high % of hands have a much higher fold to 4b%, this stat is important to note because we can start successfully 4b bluffing these opponents showing instant profits.

Example 1:
Full Tilt Poker $1/$2 No Limit Hold'em - 8 players
The Official 2+2 Hand Converter Powered By DeucesCracked.com

UTG: $50.00
UTG+1: $215.00
Hero (MP1): $356.25
MP2: $425.30
CO: $480.90
BTN: $244.00
SB: $200.00
BB: $111.85

Pre Flop: ($3.00) Hero is MP1 with A 5
2 folds, Hero raises to $6, 3 folds, SB raises to $20, 1 fold, Hero raises to $46, SB requests TIME, 1 fold

Final Pot: $42.00
Hero shows A 5 (Ace Five high)
Hero wins $42.00

A typical 1/2 hand, hero opens from middle position and an aggressive 3bettor (6.5% 3b) 3bets me out of the small blind, I note he has a high fold to 4b (70%) and I have a fairly good hand to 4b bluff with (suited ace, ace blocker means its less likely he holds AA, AK etc). In the event that he does call my hand plays fairly well post flop having almost 30% equity v any pair. However if he does decide to 5b shove all in we can safely fold knowing we haven't put too much money in pre flop (getting the incorrect price to call v his 5b shoving range).

Please note the sizing in this hand as it is very important, the ability to 4b bluff relates a load to stack sizes and pfr sizes, 3b sizes etc. Hero opens 3bb, sb 3bets to 10bb, hero 4bets to 23bb (anywhere between 22-24bb is perfectly fine). We end up taking down a nice pot pre flop and further enhancing our aggressive table image.

Remembering that each player is different, we have to have a balanced strategy adjusted to each opponents general pre flop strategy. A lot of players do not like to call 3bets pre flop (especially oop) and prefer playing the pre flop reraising game, against this type of opponent it is generally correct to 4b bluff a load to balance the times we do have our super premium hands to ensure they are likely to go all in with dominated hands (our AA v their QQ etc).

How do they play in 3b pots? (ip, oop)
As I mentioned earlier, some players become attached to 3bet pots and will generally not give up post flop with any hand if an opponent does decide to call pre flop. Against this type of player it is important to start flatting with premium hands as well as hands that likely dominate the hands in their 3b range.

Example 2:
Full Tilt Poker $1/$2 No Limit Hold'em - 8 players
The Official 2+2 Hand Converter Powered By DeucesCracked.com

UTG: $208.25
UTG+1: $215.30
MP1: $283.80
MP2: $200.00
CO: $100.00
Hero (BTN): $200.00
SB: $254.00
BB: $863.55

Pre Flop: ($3.00) Hero is BTN with 9 Q
5 folds, Hero raises to $6, 1 fold, BB raises to $24, Hero calls $18

Flop: ($49.00) 6 Q T (2 players)
BB bets $32, Hero calls $32

Turn: ($113.00) 3 (2 players)
BB bets $99, Hero calls $99

River: ($311.00) J (2 players)
BB bets $69, Hero calls $45 all in



In example 2 above villain is a hyper aggressive regular that loves to consistently 3b (10+%) my late position opens, whilst Q9 may not be the best hand to flat, we do have position and are capable of flopping a solid top pair hand and take away pots on certain flop textures that this player may not like.

As shown earlier, study your opponents 3b range so you are aware if you can start flatting hands like AQ IP in a 3b pot, if they are 3b hands like KQ, KJ it can be very correct and a way to extract the most value from a hand rather than 4betting pre flop.

I would advice against calling too much OOP pre flop to 3bets as players are much more capable of controlling the size of the pot, taking a free card when they should, etc. I would generally recommend playing the 4b or fold game when facing a 3b pre flop and being OOP in the hand unless you have very solid reads on how your opponent plays post flop.

Dealing with players who raise a lot of flops
There are many ways to deal with players who raise a lot of flops (whether by C/R, or raising IP). Understanding how to deal with this type of player can be very confusing, especially against LAG players who have a much wider range for raising certain flop textures.

Example 3:
Full Tilt Poker $1/$2 No Limit Hold'em - 6 players
The Official 2+2 Hand Converter Powered By DeucesCracked.com

Hero (UTG): $209.00
MP: $84.75
CO: $200.00
BTN: $772.75
SB: $214.45
BB: $212.75

Pre Flop: ($3.00) Hero is UTG with 7 9
Hero raises to $6, 2 folds, BTN calls $6, 2 folds

Flop: ($15.00) 4 A 6 (2 players)
Hero bets $8, BTN raises to $24, Hero calls $16

Turn: ($63.00) 2 (2 players)
Hero bets $42, BTN raises to $742.75 all in, Hero calls $137 all in

River: ($421.00) Q (2 players - 2 are all in)

Final Pot: $421.00
Hero shows 7 9 (a flush, Ace high)
BTN shows 6 6 (three of a kind, Sixes)
Hero wins $418.00
(Rake: $3.00)

In example 3 above villain is a very aggressive winning regular that normally plays higher stakes, his fold to cbet is 57% and he raises cbets IP 15%. This is not a flop I expect him to be playing back at me lightly, the flop is ace high which normally hits the PFR's raising range more than the callers.

If I decide to 4b this flop I am going to have to call any shove and am most likely going to be crushed by his all in range, however by calling I widen my range and he can continue with his bluffs on turn. I however hit my flush on the turn and decide to take an alternate line to extract value from him, I don't think he ever expects me to have a flush when I lead the turn here so I could potentially be shoved on by a bare Ax hand knowing it will be hard for me to have a hand in my range that can call.

A lot of good regulars know which flop textures are good to play back at because of the likeliness that the PFR hit the board.

A flop like 678 with two of one suit is a perfect example, plenty of LAG players love to attack this kind of flop with all sorts of hands expecting the PFR to bet/fold the flop a lot. To counteract this we should simple cbet less, or cbet hands that are able to bet/call a raise, or b3b (bet and reraise the flop).

The raise flop stat is very important to identify the type of player that is raising a lot of wet flops. It can be found by hovering over the fold to cbet stat in your HEM HUD. I would say a stat of 8-13% would be typical for a tight players flop raising range and 13-20% including a large amount of bluffs and semi bluffs.

Another important thing to note is how inclined the regular you are playing is to slow playing. I do not advocate slow playing hands in many spots, if you are playing a wide range of hands pre flop this is balanced because you are able to raise a wide range of flop textures with different sorts of hands, always putting your opponent at a guess whether you have a set, a big draw, two pair or complete air:

Example 4:
Full Tilt Poker $2/$4 No Limit Hold'em - 7 players
The Official 2+2 Hand Converter Powered By DeucesCracked.com

SB: $212.30
BB: $809.20
UTG: $213.70
UTG+1: $440.50
MP: $412.00
CO: $416.00
Hero (BTN): $1392.70

Pre Flop: ($6.00) Hero is BTN with 2 2
UTG calls $4, 2 folds, CO raises to $18, Hero calls $18, 3 folds

Flop: ($46.00) 6 J 8 (2 players)
CO bets $24, Hero raises to $68, CO folds

Final Pot: $94.00
Hero wins $91.00
(Rake: $3.00)

The above hand shows the benefits of raising a wide range on a flop, rather then calling to float with possibly the best hand, I raise the flop representing quite a narrow range of hands. I take control of the pot and my opponent loses the ability to double barrel the turn on any scare card if I just call the flop.

Please note a good regular is going to be able to adjust to this kind of play if they are paying attention, be sure to raise hands like 9Ts (oesd w/ a backdoor flush draw), sets, etc to balance your range if you do decide to fast play often.

Dealing with regulars that float a lot
Fairly easy to deal with, you should note how lightly an opponent is willing to call YOU (just you, not other opponents) down in a pot. Again noting their tendencies to slow play is very important. If an opponent has a wide range preflop (16+vpip) they will have a very wide range on the flop that may be able to call a flop bet, but have to fold vs the majority of your double barrel attempts (whether for value or as a bluff).

Look at a players fold to flop cbet%, tighter players will be 65-80% playing poorly post flop simply folding their pocket pairs to one barrel if they do not flop a set, these guys are generally pretty easy to play against. LAG players may fold to as little as 40-55% of cbets, adjust by either cbetting less if you are uncomfortable firing many barrels or firing many barrels on board textures that develop well for your PFR range and not your opponents.


Tilting regulars (breaking points)
By constantly pushing other regulars around you are able to eventually break them, unless you were born nanonoko most regulars you will play against WILL over adjust if you consistently put pressure on them, whether pre flop or post flop.

Example 5:
Full Tilt Poker $1/$2 No Limit Hold'em - 8 players
The Official 2+2 Hand Converter Powered By DeucesCracked.com

BTN: $309.20
Hero (SB): $235.00
BB: $301.05
UTG: $118.90
UTG+1: $169.45
MP1: $248.20
MP2: $197.40
CO: $164.00

Pre Flop: ($3.00) Hero is SB with K K
UTG calls $2, 3 folds, CO calls $2, BTN raises to $11, Hero raises to $36, 3 folds, BTN raises to $309.20 all in, Hero calls $199 all in

Flop: ($476.00) 8 8 6

Turn: ($476.00) 5

River: ($476.00) J

Final Pot: $476.00
BTN shows 9 9 (two pair, Nines and Eights)
Hero shows K K (two pair, Kings and Eights)
Hero wins $473.00
(Rake: $3.00)

Using my loose aggressive image pre flop i am able to tilt this winning regular who was obviously sick of me pushing him around, he isolates two weak limpers in early position and I place a 3b for obvious value knowing his range for isolating weak players is very wide, instead of folding pre flop and saving himself some money he decides to 4b shove and ends up losing a huge pot massively dominated.

REG WARS CAN GET EXTREME!!
A small note, some villains will be so persistent in trying to run you over at the tables that sometimes you have to make a stand to show them that they are not going to be running you over any time soon. The two following example hands show the level that extreme reg wars at higher stakes can get to, and I will then talk about the adjustments that need to be made against this kind of crazy.

Example 6:
Full Tilt Poker $1/$2 No Limit Hold'em - 8 players
The Official 2+2 Hand Converter Powered By DeucesCracked.com

MP2: $200.00
Hero (CO): $222.00
BTN: $109.00
SB: $226.35
BB: $205.75
UTG: $623.90
UTG+1: $70.00
MP1: $200.00

Pre Flop: ($3.00) Hero is CO with A 7
4 folds, Hero raises to $6, 1 fold, SB raises to $20, 1 fold, Hero raises to $44, SB raises to $226.35 all in, Hero calls $178 all in

Flop: ($446.00) 3 9 2

Turn: ($446.00) 6

River: ($446.00) A

Final Pot: $446.00
Hero shows A 7 (a pair of Aces)
SB shows K 8 (Ace King high)
Hero wins $443.00
(Rake: $3.00)


Example 7:
Full Tilt Poker $3/$6 No Limit Hold'em - 8 players
The Official 2+2 Hand Converter Powered By DeucesCracked.com

MP2: $645.55
CO: $600.00
BTN: $868.05
Hero (SB): $600.00
BB: $734.90
UTG: $420.00
UTG+1: $327.90
MP1: $1183.15

Pre Flop: ($9.00) Hero is SB with 9 9
6 folds, Hero raises to $18, BB raises to $54, Hero raises to $124, BB raises to $734.90 all in, Hero calls $476 all in

Flop: ($1200.00) 4 4 8

Turn: ($1200.00) 7

River: ($1200.00) 2

Final Pot: $1200.00
Hero shows 9 9 (two pair, Nines and Fours)
BB shows 6 3 (a pair of Fours)
Hero wins $1197.00
(Rake: $3.00)

In example 6 the regular had 3b me around 12 times in 3 orbits, not respecting any of my opens. I had 4b bluffed him once before (and showed my hand, most likely causing him to tilt). I adjusted knowing that the next time I went to 4b him he was very likely to 5b bluff me.

In example 7 I make a correct adjustment vs a very aggressive winning regular that likely knows I was shot taking at 3/6. Instead of calling pre flop OOP v a good regular I decided that I was going to 4b and call his shove knowing that he it was very likely he would try to move me off my hand. By widening my 4b value range my opponent incorrectly shoved a very marginal holding hoping I would fold.

Tilting regulars can be done in ways other than simply 3betting a load pre flop, you can call a lot post flop to float, raise a lot of cbets, min raise a lot of bets they make and more. These can and will cause a player to explode and generally make him send all his money your way. Be very careful trying to induce tilt from solid winning regulars as they are less prone to tilt and more inclined to soul own you.

Leveling
Not as necessary in micro stakes games because players are normally only thinking on level 1 at most. The multiple levels of thinking are as follows:

• Level 0: I know nothing
• Level 1: What do I have?
• Level 2: What does my opponent have?
• Level 3: What does my opponent think I have?
• Level 4: What does my opponent think that I think they have?
• Level 5: What does my opponent think that I think they think I have?

It is important to understand what level your opponent is thinking on, if he understands what your ranges are for betting in different spots you have to be able to make adjustments to counteract that.

Generally players who think on multiple levels are capable enough to play hands in different ways (switch gears) to obtain the max value vs you and also bluff you in spots which you would think they are never bluffing. Unfortunately vs a player this good sometimes you are going to have to go broke with a medium strength hand and run into their good hands until you have a deep understanding of the way that they play post flop.

I would avoid playing guys that are capable of thinking on higher levels at micro stakes at all costs, there is simply too much easy money to be found by table selecting well.

If your opponent however can only see the two cards in front of him and knows that 57 on a 468 flop makes a straight and he raises whenever he has a big hand, you can adapt by playing a much more straight forward style against these simplistic players betting when you have a monster, betting when its likely he will fold, betting when you have good equity and giving up when he likely has you beat.

As a general rule playing 1 level above your opponent is said to be the most profitable way to play against them, so keep that in mind the next time you are playing.

How do I out level my opponent?
A very hard topic to discuss in broad terms, out leveling your opponent will take a load of previous history of playing together to become a successful way to make money. It often requires turning a made hand into a bluff and putting a load of money into the pot.

I would recommend avoiding trying to out-level your opponent until you are at a higher level of poker, standard TAG w/ good hand reading skills is still profitable in today's 200nl FR games, building a solid foundation of skills is much more important than getting into extreme leveling situations with a specific opponent and can greatly hurt your win rate if you pick a war with the wrong person.

Switching Gears
One of the most important things to be able to do as a poker player is switch gears. Good players WILL adjust if you consistently play the same hands in the same manner, in order to improve the profitably of every hand you should take alternate lines with strong hands in similar spots to balance the weaker part of your range.

On the flip side, if you play against opponents consistently who are not switching gears, simply taking 30 minutes to study their game can be immensely profitable noting what type of ways they are playing hands in specific spots. Do they play nut flush draws very aggressively, do they always raise the flop if they hit a set, do they always just call if they flop a set on a rainbow flop.

Things like this are easy to scan for looking at previous hands your opponents have played in HEM so use the tools that you have available to you to maximize your win rate and always take good notes on your opponents!

Conclusion & General thoughts
In general I would avoid getting into wars with other regs, it can be -ev if you pick the wrong targets (players who are better than you) and unless you are capable of exploiting small edges and leaks that an opponent has, it can be simply better and easier to fold and move onto the next hand or find a better spot to put your money in.

If you however do want to put up a fight, I hope that some of the things that I have taught will help you in your battles and you progress to one day battle me in a reg war as so many others try to do. Feel free to leave any questions about stuff that I might not of covered so well, I wanted to go a lot deeper into this but I could of just written forever.

Live long, grind hard and prosper!

Wow, that looks nice. Gonna read right now. Thanks so far.

Awesome post

Good read.

great post, sick garph, tyvm

very nice post (and graph :P ), thanks for taking teh time

Good post, but this may be a bit too optimistic. Light 3-bettors get 4-bet light all the time, I don't think anyone who 3-bets light will tilt when they lose 15bb's or so once. Most likely it will not affect them at all. 3-betting light is standard practice for them, they might even hope to get 4-bet light, so they gain more value for their strong hands.

People who are used to aggression usually don't tilt as easily, the whole point behind their game is to abuse high variance situations that other players are afraid of. A nitty player might tilt when bluffed, someone who bluffs all the time himself isn't affected as easily because he knows it's a part of the game.

Good post, OP. I think this one needs the warning label of "If you haven't mastered the COTWs before this, this COTW can do serious damage to your BR."

Key points.

1. You have over 1000 hands on the villain.
2. You've actually spent time looking at their hands to see how they play multiple hands off line.
3. Formulate a strategy and range specifically for them.

Most random and regular micro players are not 3 betting light. Don't spew.

Good read, nice work

Gonna munch on some eggos and read, love when newman posts

Very solid post, thanks a lot OP

Prob a dumb question, but is there a way to see player stats (like the ones mentioned) on PT3?

i think you've done a great job there writing it all for the forums.
But I strongly disagree with you on some parts, especially on examples you gave.
Example2:
This is just complete spew to call preflop with Q9o even in position even against a wide range. You need to have SUPER strong reads to do it(for example if you know he's always slowplaying pf and will fold to a raise on the flop when he doesn't hit). If you don't have this read just 4 bet him or fold. Q9o plays super poorly. Yes, sometimes he has 98 and you stack him on 9xx but so many things can happen for you that there's almost no way you will profit by calling here. I can see an argument for calling with Q9s but again your reads must be very strong and you should be a much better player than he is.
Example3.
I don't mind a flop call against some players but this shouldn't be your default line by any means. He should be giving up on the turn a lot for us to show a profit(or bet folding turn with a super high frequency in which case we just c/ship a lot of turns). A good bonus is that and 5 or 8 on the turn give you some equity to continue against pretty much any range.
But once you hit your flush, it's just really bad to donk out. 1)I would expect him to bet this turn with all of his bluffs
2)if you say he's a winning player, he can read hands. After your flop call you either have a made hand or a draw. When you donk the turn you are either
1)turning your made hand into a bluff
2)betting for value
Not many players will be so tricky to call the flop w a hand like 99 and donk turn as a bluff expecting Villain to lay down(what?).
And final point: if you called on the flop, you assumed his range is wide, right? If you think he's wide, just crai as he will fold his bluffs to your donk bet and bluff this turn himself a lot. If you think he has a tight range, calling on the flop is meh
Now he can't continue with his bluffs after you donked out. This line can be good only if you think that
1)bluffs are a very small part of his range
2)he's going to check back 2pair and sets on the turn
Example 4.
I agree that raising> calling but only because calling is just complete spew without very specific reads. The thing is 22 is one of the worst hands to raise him on the flop as you have so little equity when he decides to continue. So it's much better to do it with a hand like AQ that has some outs rather than with 22. If you're raising here with 22 you're very unbalanced because there are so many hands that are better to do it with. And i would argue that T9ss is a call most% of the time because our hand is deceptive and has a lot of implied odds

Example 5.
This hand doesn't mean he's tilting. In fact it's a +EV play for him most of the time if your 3 betting range is wide.
Example 6.
I agree that you should be adjusting here, but widening your 4 bet calling range to A7o is just not going to show a profit. At best it is a 0 EV spot with tons of variance but there will be times when he says ok, i 3 bet this guy 12 times in a row, time to tighten up. And now your play becomes massively -EV. The thing you can do is to tighten us preflop, call his 3 bets wider and maybe widen your 4 bet calling range but A7o is just too wide.

Didn't want to be a douche or smth, appreciate your effort =)

I <3 this COTW, great work OP and next time I spew off a stack to an aggro reg, I will be sure to blame it on you =)


+1 people please don't misapply this stuff and start going spew crazy and 4betting A4s just because a 17/15 reg with a 5% 3bet over 250 hands decided to 3bet you twice IP in a half an hour. There is a lot of great stuff in the OP, just make sure to try to understand it and apply it correctly.

Thanks Newmanmi, great work!

Thanks! Great Work!

There's a lot of great stuff in this CotW. Like others have said, be cautious applying it, and the lower you play the less willing you should be to apply any of it.

That said, this meme that micro players are thinking on level 1 at most has got to end.

For example, how many of us have isolated a limper who calls, and then donks into us for pot on a 882 flop. Same thing for when we steal, the BB calls and then donks the flop. Why the **** do you think he did this? It is because he has us on a range that includes a lot of unpaired overcards and knows that a lot of the time we are going to (correctly) fold to his pot-sized donk bet.

The guy is a typical loose passive, and he is putting us on a range and playing accordingly. By newmanmi's description, this is level 3 thinking, and it is completely ordinary and very, very common at $25 and $50.

.

Eh mpethy I'm pretty sure loose passives are doing that just to find out where they are at and if to see if we have AK or not, not actually putting us on a logical range. I do agree that at 25NL and especially 50NL, most people who aren't complete ******s are at least on some form of level 2 thinking, even if a lot of them are downright awful at handreading...like that's why you Cbet A high flops, even bad players will understand to some degree that a good portion of the time we have a hand with an A in it after raising preflop.

Have to agree with mpethy. IMO, level 3 is more common than most are willing to give their opponents credit for.

That being said, overall a terriffic post newmanmi.

I like this COTW, but im playing at 25nl which is the upper section of the micro's and I really dont feel as if I can play like this profitably agaisnt them, they dont have high 3/4/5bet% and are only really shipping AA KK and AK on tilt.

Other opinions?

There is a huge difference between making some primitive attempt at thinking on a certain level and actually having the capacity to think on that level. When fish say "I put you on AK" technically they are thinking at level 3(or level 2 if you start with 0) but they aren't really thinking on that level because they aren't doing it logically. It takes a real special kind of fish to see an AKT97 board and go "I haz pair of pocket threees I call". Only the absolute worst players in the game do stuff like that. But just because someone is making some kind of primitive guess on what you might have doesn't mean they are actually capable of putting you on a realistic range, that's all I'm trying to say.

If someone is opening 12% of hands but only continuing with 1% and refuses to adjust, can't you find a very very simple way to exploit that fact?

When you put it that way, yes.

And the best part about it is so often one of 2 things will happen, they will either never adjust and continue to be a nit for the rest of their life and just keep waiting for aces while you mercilessly pillage all their money...or they will overadjust by going on tilt and getting so sick of you that they 4bet shove 77 on you, and then you snap them off with KK. Turning a nit into a spewbox is like the most fun thing in the whole world.