I recognize this isn't a fair question, BUT can you give us a little info about your win rate at the various levels using this strategy? Have you made any level-specific changes to your strategy?

Maybe someone should re-title this A Complete Guide to Beating the Nanostakes, referring to the smallest micro games.

At NL2 or NL5, this is fine.
At NL10, this might work perhaps if you select tables carefully.
At NL25+, you might have a bit more trouble.
Presumably this strategy would run into difficulties on rush tables.

During the Party Poker boom, you could have printed money with this thing.

What do you think are the differences, in general, between 25+ and 10-? Any specifics for how to overcome?

Every time you move up, fat value becomes harder to find and thin value becomes more important.

Is this true? Do you think this poster is correct or incorrect? Why or why not?

Will following the advice in this thread not result in one being a winning player at 25nl and 50nl at the USA friendly sites like Pokerstars and Full Tilt poker?

If that's the case, what's missing? Have the games changed or are the players at 25nl and 50nl no longer fitting the profile the play in this thread was designed to beat?

And how do the advice here compare to that in the Jack Wilcox thread?

i.e. http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/32...-limit-496983/

looks more or less right; the central idea behind sircuddles' guide is to get fat value from teh fish; as the stakes increase, the fish are slightly less plentiful and generally not quite as horrific-bad at poker; for instance a standard fish at 25NL might have just as bad a set of preflop stats as another fish at 2NL, but would be less likely to auto-call all streets with any pair/any draw; more likely to play loose-passive pre, but then fit-or-fold postflop (obviously this is still a bad and exploitable strategy, but it's not quite as bad as the 2NL payoff-monkey's strategy, in terms of it's less profitable in terms of bb/100 for us to play against the 25NL guy.)

meh probably not a winning player @ 25NL, almost certainly not @ 50NL, but that was never the point of sircuddles' guide; it was meant as a way for a losing player to stop the bleeding, and to lay solid foundations for your game for you to build on later with more advanced stuff. even if all a reader does is break even at 10NL after reading the guide, that's still better than losing @ 10NL, no?

afaik the guide was never meant to be a magic bullet to beat all pokers evar, iirc it actually says that somewhere near the beginning?

never seen that thread before, thanks! have only read the first 100 posts, but it looks nice. um difference is that that's a player who (apparently) plays 400NL, so obviously he's going to play better, and have a higher winrate, than most of us micro posters. the strategies and concepts he uses are more advanced than the ones laid out in sircuddles' guide. i don't think those strategies are absolutely necesary to beat small games like 2NL-10NL on stars, but obviously if you can apply them correctly they're going to do good things for your bankroll; also to be borne in mind though is that if you applied them incorrectly, you'd quite possibly do worse than you would have just playing like sircuddles recommends.

several of the things that i read mentioned in that first 100 posts are concepts covered in the CoTW threads here in uNLFR, for example in the hand in this post, the concepts of thin value and psuedo-thin value are used, as discussed in the thin value CoTW thread.

the way i would recommend using those threads is this:
first read and understand and apply sircuddles' guide, this is the basic outline of how you will want to play against fish at all levels, cause fish are still fish.
only when you have all that down should you do anything you read in that jackwilcox thread, and don't try everything at once, just try to add a concept or two to your game, see what works for you, post some HH threads in this forum (or the beginners forum i guess?) before adding anything else to your game. if you just suddenly try to play like a 400NL'er, you will almost certainly butcher it and do the wrong stuff against the wrong players in the wrong spots

oh also that thread seems to deal wth 6max rather than FR.

all this is imho, obviously, hope my rambling is sort of useful anyway

Thanks for the reply. Another thread you might like is Digger's Nit Clinic thread:

http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/78...clinic-564111/

As I understand it, he's coming from a similar direction. Apparently he has good success with it at 50nl from the looks of a graph he posted in the thread.

Not sure what's different about what Digger is sharing .vs Sir Cuddles' guide if Digger's works at 50nl and Sir Cuddles's does not quite do the trick. That's the main reason I posted, as I'm not sure what the missing ingredients are for 50nl.

I'm spending most of my time lately struggling at 50nl. Should probably play lower, but trying to get my game up to 50nl standards. Last 8k hands or so have been up and down -- pretty much break even.

Decided to revisit and refine by basic "swiss cheese" looking play book and patch up some leaks. Figured a good way to help is to go through these sort of epic threads and take notes to review and work on applying when I play. Very time consuming, but hopefully will be worth it.

This forum is so helpful. I wish I had enough time to go through everything and absorb it all. Don't we all.

Your post was very helpful. Thanks for sharing and for pointing out the things you did.

judging from that thread, insane amounts of analysis? i occasionally try to read that thread, but my eyes usually glaze over, i know i should do more homework but don't seem to get around to it as often as i should looking over that thread i see i actually have a reply in there, but i just couldn't keep up with the mad infostream and lost the thread of what he was talking about, made a little more sense this re-reading but still glazed over towards the end of the first page.

w/r to the graph digger posted, i would say that in my inexpert estimation, 25K hands might not be enough to reliably extrapolate a winrate, and plus regardless of what digger might say in the thread, it was still him playing the hands so he'll have a bigger expected w/r than someone of less skill and experience playing the same preflop strategy.

anyway i've only really played upto 25NL so maybe you're already in a better position than me to know what is needed at 50NL?

Thanks for the guide Sircuddles. I have been taking this no risk strategy for 2NL and am currently winning at almost 20bb/100 over 6.4k hands. My win rate before reading the guide was lower because I was doing too much analysis and giving the donks too much credit. With this strategy I should be up to 5NL relatively shortly.

I think this post gets at the exact purpose of the thread.

Example 2
CO: $25.60
Hero (BB): $27.05

Pre Flop: ($0.35) Hero is BB with A A
4 folds, CO raises to $1, 1 fold, Hero calls $0.75

Action with aces! You like it. You'll just call so you don't scare him away.

Flop: ($2.10) A K 8 (2 players)

Top set on a board like that! "Hot damn!" you think to yourself. Your opponent could be sitting on AK, AQ, KQ, any number of hands. You decide to be crafty and check to let your opponent bet.

Hero checks, CO bets $1, Hero calls $1

Turn: ($4.10) T

He seems like he may have something worth playing, so you lead small on the turn to keep him leashed.

Hero bets $1.50, CO calls $1.50

Nice!

River: ($7.10) 6

Hero bets $2.50, CO calls $2.50

Final Pot: $12.10
Hero shows A A
CO mucks 88

What!? He flopped a set too! What happened here? You slow played top set while your opponent was sitting on bottom set. This hand is a total disaster. Had you have been aggressive in the hand you could have stacked off on the flop or the turn very easily. In a hand like this he was more than likely getting all his chips in on the flop or turn had you been betting and raising. The river card killed the action and had him worried about a straight or a flush, so he only called. In this situation your slow play cost you an extreme amount, to the tune of about $19.00. That’s 76 big blinds. That is huge.


The river card was a huge disaster card for him. On the river?
79... he thinks you called a 1 dollar raise with 79, then cold called with nothing on flop?
lol I think you mean turn. (just pointing it out)

Wanted to compliment you on the great post though!
Good job.

where is example 1? and who are you talking to?

Hey, I've been having trouble with JJ/QQ from 2NL.

When do we 3 bet these?
When do we call a raise pre flop?
What happens if we are 4 bet?
- what about with KK facing a 4-bet?

I'm leaking, help!

same

always consider stack size too.

this is a great guide that i try and follow. recently moved up to 10nl.

i think i raise too much.

being first in isn't very common especially if you do the correct table selection.

could someone try and give some general guidelines regarding what to do if there are x limpers before you? of course i know it is villains dependent and i'm not looking to follow an exact chart. while following this "nitbox 101" would you just for example fold kq-qj from the hj/btn when there are two limpers before you?

and another question, just to make sure i'm reading this correctly, is it really recommended here to just not play ATo from any position? i know it's for beginners and you're supposed to play more after you gain some experience.

a huge leak? this is what i do since people like calling so i want to build a bigger pot with my hands..

thanks!

I just wanted to thank the OP. Good info going to read again to take it all in.

You're welcome - answers above.

just read this guide, ty OP.

I love this guide, but I have had terrible results 3 barreling TPTK. I typically only like to bet 2/3 streets. Is this logical or should I be 3 barreling TPTK most of the time?

Thanks a lot Sircuddles, all of your energy and passion involved really helped and will continue to help others absolutely.

Actually, it seems you do very well in tense situations and always take the best from a situation, as even if no one told you any of these golden advices back in the day when you really needed them, still you shared it with us.

Appreciation and respect.

Rob

wow! Very nice guide!
Could I translate it to portuguese? All the credits to you, of course.

cheers!

good work buddy, amazin guide

Are you talking to me with this reply?
What I said is undoubtedly specific.

Thank you for posting this. Getting started in poker is so hard if you have absolutely no idea about anything like I did. It always seems like you just sort of have to pick up different ideas all over the place and try to put them together. As someone who has trouble even at the lowest levels this was greatly appreciated.