Two Plus Two Publishing LLC Two Plus Two Publishing LLC
 

Go Back   Two Plus Two Poker Forums > No Limit Hold'em > Micro Stakes Full Ring

Notices

Micro Stakes Full Ring Discussion of up to .25/.50 online no-limit pot-limit Texas hold'em full ring games, situations and strategies

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 05-27-2012, 05:01 PM   #1
enthusiast
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Nottingham, England
Posts: 69
50nl: T9s OOP flops a flush multiway. All-in on flop?

I limped behind and then called a raise (about 4:1) with relative position on three opponents. And hit a lovely flop.
I was then first to act and checked, with my plan being to shove on the flop after the original raiser c-bets and (hopefully) someone else calls. But the action was a bit unexpected -

    Poker Stars, $0.25/$0.50 No Limit Hold'em Cash, 9 Players
    Poker Tools Powered By Holdem Manager - The Ultimate Poker Software Suite.

    SB: $47.25 (94.5 bb)
    BB: $13.20 (26.4 bb)
    UTG+1: $30.70 (61.4 bb)
    UTG+2: $27.50 (55 bb)
    Hero (MP1): $52.25 (104.5 bb)
    MP2: $40.30 (80.6 bb)
    MP3: $20.35 (40.7 bb)
    CO: $82.30 (164.6 bb)
    BTN: $55.95 (111.9 bb)

    Preflop: Hero is MP1 with 9 T
    UTG+1 folds, UTG+2 calls $0.50, Hero calls $0.50, 2 folds, CO raises to $3.50, BTN calls $3.50, 2 folds, UTG+2 calls $3, Hero calls $3

    Flop: ($14.75) 2 K 7 (4 players)
    UTG+2 checks, Hero checks, CO bets $4, BTN raises to $12, UTG+2 folds

    The original raiser bet really small, and then the button put it in a small raise.

    So my question - is it still best to shove here, and possibly get two quick folds?
    (I don't think it's a good idea to just call, because of the great odds I'd be giving to a flush draw which could beat me)
    Street Urchin is offline   Reply With Quote
    Old 05-27-2012, 06:38 PM   #2
    newbie
     
    omgwtfnooooo's Avatar
     
    Join Date: Sep 2011
    Location: doomswitch dungeon
    Posts: 37
    Re: 50nl: T9s OOP flops a flush multiway. All-in on flop?

    Stats on the CO and BTN? It's a sick enough spot but unless they are not usually aggressive in MW pots I'm prob shipping this now. you are getting called by AcK, weirdly played AcA and any set, and picking up some nice dead money when they fold

    Last edited by omgwtfnooooo; 05-27-2012 at 06:41 PM. Reason: BTN has AQcc though right?
    omgwtfnooooo is offline   Reply With Quote
    Old 05-27-2012, 09:52 PM   #3
    newbie
     
    taglius's Avatar
     
    Join Date: May 2012
    Posts: 36
    Re: 50nl: T9s OOP flops a flush multiway. All-in on flop?

    get it in. We don't play a hand that makes a ten-high flush and then fold worrying about higher flushes.
    taglius is offline   Reply With Quote
    Old 05-28-2012, 06:10 AM   #4
    Carpal \'Tunnel
     
    NJD77's Avatar
     
    Join Date: Dec 2007
    Location: New Round New Chances Everyone
    Posts: 8,217
    Ship it. BTN would play sets like this and Pair+NFD.

    Our equity is pretty solid.
    NJD77 is offline   Reply With Quote
    Old 05-28-2012, 06:44 AM   #5
    adept
     
    Join Date: Feb 2011
    Location: between the clowns and the jokers
    Posts: 1,053
    Re: 50nl: T9s OOP flops a flush multiway. All-in on flop?

    raise or fold pre
    enigmatic1x is offline   Reply With Quote
    Old 05-28-2012, 07:14 AM   #6
    Carpal \'Tunnel
     
    MartL's Avatar
     
    Join Date: Mar 2008
    Location: Following tiltedpoker.org
    Posts: 9,147
    Re: 50nl: T9s OOP flops a flush multiway. All-in on flop?

    Yep hate pre.

    Now just get it in and hope BTN has a set.
    MartL is offline   Reply With Quote
    Old 05-28-2012, 10:32 AM   #7
    centurion
     
    Dondarrion's Avatar
     
    Join Date: Apr 2012
    Location: Exploring the Stickies and Archives
    Posts: 124
    Re: 50nl: T9s OOP flops a flush multiway. All-in on flop?

    I'm going to try applying REM in this situation. I've been reading about it and will use this opportunity to practice it, if you folks don't mind

    Range

    AcK, KK, AcA, 77, Ac7, AcQc, AcJc, QcQ, JcJ, QcJ, QJc, QJcc

    Equity

    Way behind of AJcc, AQcc, QJcc (3 combinations)

    Way ahead* of KK, 77, AcK, Ac7, AcA, QcQ, JcJ, QcJ, QJc (3+3+3+3+3+3+3+4+4 = 29 combinations)

    29 >> 3 => we are likely to be favorites.

    Maximize

    Haven't read this part in PNLHE yet :P However, we are certainly committed, especially considering that the SPR is below 2, so I say shove the rest of your stack (likely favorites, big pot).

    *I gave villain 7 outs for each of these hands. For KK and 77, that's 1 out to quads, 6 outs to the board pairing the 2 or the other flop card. For AcA/AcK/Ac7 I just gave the villain the 7 remaining clubs as outs. "Way ahead" here translates to about 70% equity using 7 outs. Our equity goes down a bit (no lower than 60% I expect) if we consider things like runner KK/K7/K2/K2 for AcK, etc.

    Decision

    Re-raise all-in.

    Last edited by Dondarrion; 05-28-2012 at 10:43 AM. Reason: Added QcQ, JcJ, QcJ, QJc to opponent's range. Gave them about 7 outs too.
    Dondarrion is offline   Reply With Quote
    Old 05-28-2012, 11:20 AM   #8
    Carpal \'Tunnel
     
    Join Date: Aug 2009
    Posts: 6,691
    Re: 50nl: T9s OOP flops a flush multiway. All-in on flop?

    I think shipping is ok. CO looks like he block bet which means there's a decent chance he will call. BTN is likely trying to protect something.

    But I also think you can make a good case for slowplaying. There are very few turn cards that could get you to fold (I'm thinking a club that is smaller than your 9). The call pot commits us, so even if the board pairs, we are still getting it in. If we call, our stack would be $36.75 on the turn. The pot would be $42.75 with a CO fold and $50.75 with a CO call.
    DDAWD is offline   Reply With Quote
    Old 05-28-2012, 02:24 PM   #9
    enthusiast
     
    Join Date: May 2010
    Location: Nottingham, England
    Posts: 69
    Re: 50nl: T9s OOP flops a flush multiway. All-in on flop?

    Oh yeah sorry I forgot to include stats.
    CO - 17/8/inf over 46 hands
    Btn - 19/12/5.5 over 200 hands.
    And mine are 28/15/3.5 for this session (not looking great I know).
    I wasn't thinking of folding, just how to get max value from hands that I was beating. Thanks for replies.

    Quote:
    But I also think you can make a good case for slowplaying.
    Does anyone else think it would be a good play to call here then shove any non scary turn?
    Regardless of results, I still think it would be best to just shove in this spot and hope for the best. I'm going to test that spoiler thingy now...


      Spoiler:
      Street Urchin is offline   Reply With Quote
      Old 05-28-2012, 02:37 PM   #10
      Carpal \'Tunnel
       
      MartL's Avatar
       
      Join Date: Mar 2008
      Location: Following tiltedpoker.org
      Posts: 9,147
      Re: 50nl: T9s OOP flops a flush multiway. All-in on flop?

      Calling is gross.
      MartL is offline   Reply With Quote
      Old 05-28-2012, 02:43 PM   #11
      Carpal \'Tunnel
       
      Join Date: Aug 2009
      Posts: 6,691
      Re: 50nl: T9s OOP flops a flush multiway. All-in on flop?

      more I think about it, more I think flatting is the way to go to maximize value. Yeah, you risk a few scare cards, but you pretty much force your opponent to follow through with his TP hands which he can get away from if you shove.
      DDAWD is offline   Reply With Quote
      Old 05-28-2012, 02:53 PM   #12
      Carpal \'Tunnel
       
      MartL's Avatar
       
      Join Date: Mar 2008
      Location: Following tiltedpoker.org
      Posts: 9,147
      Re: 50nl: T9s OOP flops a flush multiway. All-in on flop?

      What hands do we call with here? its only ever nuttish hands, that wont be lost on either player. Given pre flop action your hand is either a made flush or 22 or at a push 77 when you flat a bet and a raise.
      MartL is offline   Reply With Quote
      Old 05-28-2012, 02:55 PM   #13
      Carpal \'Tunnel
       
      Join Date: Aug 2009
      Posts: 6,691
      Re: 50nl: T9s OOP flops a flush multiway. All-in on flop?

      draws
      DDAWD is offline   Reply With Quote
      Old 05-28-2012, 03:00 PM   #14
      old hand
       
      WowLucky's Avatar
       
      Join Date: Jul 2008
      Posts: 1,807
      Shoving looks best here. Our equity is against his range. I'd expect kx with a club to call along with sets
      WowLucky is offline   Reply With Quote
      Old 05-28-2012, 04:16 PM   #15
      newbie
       
      omgwtfnooooo's Avatar
       
      Join Date: Sep 2011
      Location: doomswitch dungeon
      Posts: 37
      Re: 50nl: T9s OOP flops a flush multiway. All-in on flop?

      Quote:
      Originally Posted by MartL View Post
      What hands do we call with here? its only ever nuttish hands, that wont be lost on either player. Given pre flop action your hand is either a made flush or 22 or at a push 77 when you flat a bet and a raise.
      exactly, definitely jamming this
      omgwtfnooooo is offline   Reply With Quote

      Reply
            

      Thread Tools
      Display Modes

      Posting Rules
      You may not post new threads
      You may not post replies
      You may not post attachments
      You may not edit your posts

      BB code is On
      Smilies are On
      [IMG] code is On
      HTML code is Off
      Trackbacks are Off
      Pingbacks are Off
      Refbacks are Off



      All times are GMT -4. The time now is 07:16 PM.


      Powered by vBulletin®
      Copyright ©2000 - 2013, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
      Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO 3.6.0 ©2011, Crawlability, Inc.
      Copyright © 2008-2010, Two Plus Two Interactive