Open Side Menu Go to the Top
Register
Turned the nut-flush on a wet flop? Turned the nut-flush on a wet flop?

08-10-2017 , 08:11 AM
Not really a hand analysis but any input on the hand I use as an example (actual hand that happened that prompted this discussion) is welcomed.
What do you normally do when you turn a straight when the flop brings two suited cards and really hits villains flop.

A bit of background first, I'm a live reg but I play micro stakes online to try out different ideas to see what works and what doesn't ie; what happens if I only limp pre-flop all night. What happens if I only 3-bet pre all night etc etc. Tonight my plan was to see what happened if I raised all flops in position when I had a draw with the intention of betting when I picked up equity or made my hand, or to check behind and get a free card on the river. The reason I'm trying this is because if you put in a raise smaller than 3x or 4x his flop bet then you get to see the river card cheaper than if you flat his flop bet and face another bet on the turn.

Take this hand I played at 0.5/0.10 for example.
Fold round to V in the CO(No reads playing zoom on PS) who opens to 0.30. Everyone folds to me in the BB with KsQd and I call.
Flop is 5dJhTh, villian puts in a c-bet of 0.43 into a 0.65 pot. As I said I'm trying the line where I raise the flop so I put in a small raise to 1.13. I think he folds all hand that miss with very little equity like small suited aces that aren't on this board, hands like AJ aren't likely to raise and if I get raised I'm up against at least AT and it's pretty easy to make my decisions based on his actions. V flats and I put him on hands like heart draws, combo draws, AJ, maybe JT and over pairs.

Turn comes Ac, V checks. Hero?
Our straight comes in so that's awesome but how do we get max value? My thinking is if he has a hand that call us here, its now something like a combo draw, two pair or the nut flush draw with top pair. But I'm a little bit confused as to how continue in a situation like this. We've turned the nuts against an unknown villain on a wet board that his continuing range is two pair or better.
Thoughts?
Turned the nut-flush on a wet flop? Quote
08-10-2017 , 09:01 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ThaKingOnerz
Turn comes Ac, V checks. Hero?
Our straight comes in so that's awesome but how do we get max value? My thinking is if he has a hand that call us here, its now something like a combo draw, two pair or the nut flush draw with top pair. But I'm a little bit confused as to how continue in a situation like this. We've turned the nuts against an unknown villain on a wet board that his continuing range is two pair or better.
Thoughts?
I think that's a pretty good analysis.

So firstly on the turn it should be obvious that betting is the correct play here. You get value from all of the hands that you've identified. At the same time, although you have an excellent hand you're, vulnerable to the flush draw (which is more likely than usual given his flop and turn play and the fact that the A,K and Q of hearts are not in your hand or on the board) or another K/Q landing and you having to chop the pot when he's got KJ/QJ. So for that reason you don't want to be giving him a free card.

On the river If he checks I'm sticking another 60% PSB on a non-heart, non-paring board card. If one of those cards does land and he donks I'll call (depending on donk-bet size). If he checks I'll bet out but fold to a c/r.
Turned the nut-flush on a wet flop? Quote
08-10-2017 , 09:25 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brussels Sprout
I think that's a pretty good analysis.

So firstly on the turn it should be obvious that betting is the correct play here. You get value from all of the hands that you've identified. At the same time, although you have an excellent hand you're, vulnerable to the flush draw (which is more likely than usual given his flop and turn play and the fact that the A,K and Q of hearts are not in your hand or on the board) or another K/Q landing and you having to chop the pot when he's got KJ/QJ. So for that reason you don't want to be giving him a free card.

On the river If he checks I'm sticking another 60% PSB on a non-heart, non-paring board card. If one of those cards does land and he donks I'll call (depending on donk-bet size). If he checks I'll bet out but fold to a c/r.
Definitely agree to the line. He also has some two pair in AJ and JT but I don't see that many sets that he's not 3-betting this flop with. That being said we don't want to check behind and give him a free card. I'm not sure how often I should be folding to the 5 pairing on the river because I see him 3 betting most of his flopped sets.

What size do you think we should be betting on the turn? Is it the kind of situation where his entire calling range will call either a 60% PSB or a 90% PSB or should we be more careful with the size to keep draws alive? Keeping in mind that his calling range is mainly two pairs and flush draws but most draws that will call now are combo draws (87, 98, Qx and Kx of hearts).
Turned the nut-flush on a wet flop? Quote
08-11-2017 , 08:35 AM
Fair point on the set being unlikely after the flop action.
On the turn bet sizing: most villains at these stakes call too much as opposed to fold too much so I'd certainly be making the bet sizing larger. If your hand-reading assessment is correct I think villain's calling range will be fairly inelastic with regard to your bet sizing so I'd probably make it around 80%.
Turned the nut-flush on a wet flop? Quote

      
m