I don't think we're going to lose tank meta, it'll just be different tanks. We'll still be 2-3 tanks per game. I think this is OK, it's what tanks are meant to be.

If they had a tank that could knock Rein's shield down immediately from melee range, that'd be interesting.

Bastion would be better if his transformation time was reduced. That'd solve the problems without him being too strong, I reckon.

We'll see... it's really annoying to me how they've made rein so essential to this game. I was in low gold trying to play some DPS, I started playing rein and got up to 2900 playing him for like 12 hours. If the enemy team doesn't have a rein, they're at such a disadvantage. I don't understand why they'd only make one tank who can tank so much better than the rest lol. And the only thing that can reliably block earthshatter is another rein. I think they should drop his shield health to 1k-1.5k range and make him more like other tanks. No one should be being picked 90+% in tournies. Diversity definitely makes the game funner to play and watch.

The problem is that you shouldn't change too many things at once because you can't predict what the interactions will be. DVa is much more broken, and that change, Ana change, hook change, is quite a lot to come in.

In theory hog and dva nerfs makes rein even more essential/played though.

finally cracked 2500-2600 this week. had 3 draws in a row yesterday. that sucks.

Yep. Not only will new DVa be completely unable to fake being the main tank(which I've seen some teams try), she was one of the better tanks at grinding down the opposing Rein. Now she's going to have to play more hit-and-fade.

I guess that might result in Bastion coming back into favor? I doubt it. I think we just see more Rein-Zarya-Ana-3 other guy team builds. It's not good for the game that there are 2 heroes that every team should always have, regardless of game type or map, and with Roadhog and DVa being nerfed I think Zarya might move into that tier too.

You think Ana stays in the meta after the nerf?

I think so yeah

That is ultra boring.

Like 30 min draws just drain my soul.

I feel like his ult is such a bit part of the reason he's a mandatory pick... it's just so easy to 4 kills with it as a team if the there is no enemy Rein to block it. I think they should experiment at some point with adding in some other potential counters to it, or changing how it works a little bit.

That being said, I really don't mind too much if a few of the tank/healer combos are pretty set in stone... I just don't want literally all 6 heroes to be the same in 75% of games.

Just get me out of this meta, I tank main, soldier is by far my best DPS, and it's by far the most boring period for me since the game came out.

The combo of Rein having the best ult and being the only character that can counter that best ult is icing on the cake. I have no idea why they nerfed 3 less often used characters. Maybe because he doesn't get a lot of eliminations?

Every other big damage ult generally needs another ult to coordinate with it or just the perfect positioning to get a quad+ kill.

I'm convinced Rein is making this game far less exciting than it could be.

The worst part is that Rein isn't even that fun to play but is a mandatory pick. I liked him better in the S2 meta where you were getting nano boosted a lot and you always had a Zarya to shield you when you would charge in.

Lucio is in the same boat as being a very important pick, but not fun to actually play. I see a lot of arguments in team chat over who should have to play Rein/Lucio in each game.

I find Rein to be much more important than Lucio.

I honestly can't remember the last time I won a non-KOTH game vs enemy Rein without our own Rein. I'm sure it happens more than I'm thinking but it feels helpless.

Back around 3200. Went 1-8 yesterday morning and then around .500 in the afternoon. This season is the saltiest yet. I frequently have games where we are winning and people are still fighting in team chat over something or other. Obviously people are fighting in 100% of losses

If I ever get ranked high enough to play with you (my SR is about half of yours), I will happily play Lucio. I think he's really fun to play.

I mainly focus on healing with him, but love having the opportunity to be a total pain in the ass to the other team. Zipping around with him, booping people off of ledges, etc., is a blast.

Pushing heroes like Rein and Roadhog off of cliffs or into pits is extremely satisfying.

One thing I'll never understand is how people will happily go into a game with a comp that is 90% to get steamrolled just so they don't have to play the "boring" character.

Maybe it's just me but I have infinitely more fun winning on lucio than getting spawncamped and assraped as mcree.

I had a 2 tank/Mei/2 healer/1 DPS team where the DPS refused to get off Junkrat when the other team had a Pharah that was just murdering us and he was CRYING about how we wanted him to switch despite him having a bunch of medals.

Yo man there are 6 players half the team gets medals, when you're the only DPS if you're silver in eliminations you ****ing suck.

I wish they would get rid of medals or at the very least do away with the ability to look at stats in game. Listening to people cite medals as a reason why they don't need to do this or somebody else needs to change that when the real solution to whatever problem we're having is right in front of their ****ing faces gets really old.

Starting about 2:45 explains pretty well how most of my interactions go when I try to get someone with three hours of experience on a DPS and a 40% WR to switch things up. No matter how you approach these situations, you wind up with someone getting defensive or other people piling on in a toxic manner, etc.



I wind up biting my tongue in solo queue so often because trying to explain to someone that yes, we need a soldier, but it looks like we need someone other than them to be soldier is basically impossible. If I do speak up, I usually just wind up saying mentioning that I think we have a damage problem and praying that someone else has the sense to figure out what needs to be changed.

I have a buddy who I duo queue with a lot and plays a lot of Junkrat. In his defence he does a lot of damage but JR damage so often is non lethal and not consistent, and ends up just boosting a Zarya or enemy healer ults. I mean he's typically worthless on any open map or on offense. Pharah outclasses him in so many ways.

The problem is even if you try to be constructive there's generally some ******* screaming at the problem guy, which makes him get defensive, which means not only does he not switch he also generally starts playing even worse.

at least yall are able to yell at the problem guy, in my games someone just randomly leaves after round one even when we pushed the cart all the way

yeah over 1000 games this **** evens out, but people dont play 1000 games they play like 6 games in a session and when half of them are broken that massive negative outweighs all the slightly fun sessions

People leaving when you're winning (presumably DC but still) is the most tilting for sure.

One thing I'd like to see, given that the "countdown" character select stage is already unnecessarily long, is a freeze on being able to select a character for the first 10-15 seconds so people can chat a bit about team comp.

In my games most of the time Lucio just sits in the back spamming his popgun, because your goal is merely continuing to exist to provide your auras. Booping people off the map is pretty fun but the opportunities are few and far between (depending on map), and it's not easy to do most of the time and often leaves you pretty vulnerable. On the pro teams Lucio is supposed to be the shot caller / guy who keeps track of enemy ults since he has the least stuff to focus on.

My biggest issue with Lucio is that as a character concept I actually think he has some potential, but in the beta they lowered his damage output so much that he just can't do much damage in a fight, on top of his gun already being one of the slowest moving and hardest to hit projectiles in the game. He has this cool movement ability, but mostly just sits in the back not using his movement ability. But he's been 80+% picked for the entire lifetime of OW because his auras are good.

It's the bystander effect. Everyone is just hoping someone else will do it. Also many people feel like they aren't very good with Rein (it would be tough to be truly bad with Lucio) and are hoping someone else on the team is better. Personally I've had too many games on Rein this season where I just die over and over without doing anything and I can't tell what's going on since I can't see behind me.