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02-01-2009 , 01:52 PM
Cancel is fine in most formats. Not an excellent card but good. I wouldn't be happy about playing more than one just because if you get behind and draw them it can be really bad.
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02-01-2009 , 02:44 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by kyleb

In the Bant deck with a few exalted guys and a threat that keeps attacking your opponent, holding Cancel is sick as hell.
You know why it's sick?

Because bant has no other way to deal with threat then to cancel/oring it. Bant is by far the worst of all 5 shards. If 2 stingers resolve vs bant, it's usually gg.

Cancel is only good against bombs you can't beat.

Oh yea. Archangel (the 5/8 mythic) is complete garbage .
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02-01-2009 , 04:38 PM
This thread went from making me want to play again to a stupid cancel argument that reminds me of all the things i really hate about magic.
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02-01-2009 , 06:22 PM
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Originally Posted by stabn
This thread went from making me want to play again to a stupid cancel argument that reminds me of all the things i really hate about magic.
you're welcome.

magic is pretty ******ed if you're a winning poker player.
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02-01-2009 , 07:29 PM
really disagree on the archangel being garbage. so hard to lose the game once it hits play.
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02-01-2009 , 07:38 PM
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Originally Posted by Sykes
you're welcome.

magic is pretty ******ed if you're a winning poker player.
zzzz
I'll stir the pot

poker is pretty ******ed if you're a winning magic player
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02-01-2009 , 08:29 PM
Whats a good way to go about re-learning MTG? I used to play when i was really young(and so was the game), and never really learned much of the "advanced" stuff. Also with how often they release new sets, how do you guys keep up with them all? Just pull up the list of cards and memorize them? Lastly, how long do I need to actually remember each set? Do they ever go "bad" and you don't need to worry about them?
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02-01-2009 , 08:35 PM
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Originally Posted by bugstud
really disagree on the archangel being garbage. so hard to lose the game once it hits play.
I mean, I guess it is hard to lose, but then again it's not like it impossible for the opponent to win when you cast it.

Plus the fact that if you draw it in your opening hand, it's basically like you mulled to 6 on the first draw.
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02-01-2009 , 08:50 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sykes
I mean, I guess it is hard to lose, but then again it's not like it impossible for the opponent to win when you cast it.

Plus the fact that if you draw it in your opening hand, it's basically like you mulled to 6 on the first draw.
It's not garbage, but I rarely ever have the 8 mana guys in my draft deck. I don't value them highly at all, so the only time I get them is in sealed.
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02-01-2009 , 08:53 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Momo
Whats a good way to go about re-learning MTG? I used to play when i was really young(and so was the game), and never really learned much of the "advanced" stuff. Also with how often they release new sets, how do you guys keep up with them all? Just pull up the list of cards and memorize them? Lastly, how long do I need to actually remember each set? Do they ever go "bad" and you don't need to worry about them?
To keep up with all the new sets, I draft a lot. After reading the spoiler ahead of time, and doing either a prerelease or a bunch of drafts, I have the cards memorized. Your best be for getting back into the game is just heading into a local shop, and asking the shopkeeper if there are people to play with. Another thing you can do is go on MTGO and play with the free decks.
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02-04-2009 , 09:37 AM
I haven't played magic for probably 10 years. How much has the game changed since then? Or, for somebody who played pretty seriously back in the day, what are the major differences now?
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02-04-2009 , 09:53 AM
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Originally Posted by HajiShirazu
I haven't played magic for probably 10 years. How much has the game changed since then? Or, for somebody who played pretty seriously back in the day, what are the major differences now?
its like a different game.

sure the basics are the same (7 card starting hand, life total 20), but the rules have changed alot and there are a ton of new mechanics.

i'd recommended reading a rulebook and practing with new cards
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02-04-2009 , 11:35 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by kyleb
Are you an idiot? No one is advocating leaving the mana up to not cast ****. You talk to me like I am some random Magic player who thinks Cancel is hot because you can counter their **** on turn three.

In the Bant deck with a few exalted guys and a threat that keeps attacking your opponent, holding Cancel is sick as hell.

w/e though I am sure you are a genius Magic player

I'll stick with the advice of pros that I know rather than some random 2p2ers.

Let's forget about this stupid argument anyway.
Yo, I think you may have misunderstood what you saw and interpreted in regards to pros drafting Cancel. If you saw pros taking Cancel first pick in Rochester specifically, it was likely to send a signal to neighbors that the Cancel-drafter wants to be the blue mage...not because Cancel was the most amazing, sick nasty card in the pack.

Also, it very much is not removal. It IS a one-for-one trade vs a wide range of things, and most removal is also a one-for-one trade vs most of that same range, so I guess I can see how you jumbled the terminology there.
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02-04-2009 , 12:28 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sykes
its like a different game.

sure the basics are the same (7 card starting hand, life total 20), but the rules have changed alot and there are a ton of new mechanics.

i'd recommended reading a rulebook and practing with new cards
I recently came back after being gone for 10 years as well. The game is much better now imo. More interesting mechanics, creatures are overall better, the stack is a huge improvement, ect.
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02-04-2009 , 12:51 PM
****ing MODO is down mother****ers until 1 PM PST. I was so looking forward to drafting this morning. Horse****.
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02-04-2009 , 03:27 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shmohawk
Yo, I think you may have misunderstood what you saw and interpreted in regards to pros drafting Cancel. If you saw pros taking Cancel first pick in Rochester specifically, it was likely to send a signal to neighbors that the Cancel-drafter wants to be the blue mage...not because Cancel was the most amazing, sick nasty card in the pack.

Also, it very much is not removal. It IS a one-for-one trade vs a wide range of things, and most removal is also a one-for-one trade vs most of that same range, so I guess I can see how you jumbled the terminology there.
LSV, on his conflux prelease/aaa draft wrapup

"Lapse of Certainty is a card I tried to play in a aggressive GWr deck, to little effect. Leaving mana up to counter a spell is such a burden, and doing so to just deal with the spell again next turn is pretty bad. This might be good in Constructed, but is worse than Cancel most of the time in Limited, and Cancel rarely makes my maindecks."
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02-04-2009 , 03:46 PM
Of course Lapse is bad. And that LSV doesn't play Cancel hardly changes my opinion on it.
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02-04-2009 , 04:40 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by kyleb
This is Sullivan's deck:

Artifacts
4 Chrome Mox

Creatures
4 Blistering Firecat
3 Dwarven Blastminer
4 Figure Of Destiny
4 Magus Of The Moon
4 Mogg Fanatic

Instants
4 Incinerate
4 Magma Jet
3 Shrapnel Blast
2 Smash To Smithereens

Lands
3 Blinkmoth Nexus

Legendary Artifacts
1 Umezawa's Jitte

Sorceries
4 Molten Rain

Artifact Lands
4 Great Furnace

Basic Lands
11 Mountain

Lands
1 Keldon Megaliths

Sideboard:

4 Trinisphere
3 Boil
3 Dead / Gone
2 Umezawa's Jitte
3 Shattering Spree

Not sure what I want to do specifically, but my first instincts are to cut the maindeck Smash to Smithereens and play 3 Jitte MD. After Conflux is legal, I'll probably play four Hellspark Elementals maindeck and possibly sideboard the new uncounterable Sulfuric Blast.

How many decks beat turn one Blastminer? I can't imagine many. Magus of the Moon is a real annoyance to tons of decks, too.
I'd add some steam vents to splash cancel.
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02-04-2009 , 06:18 PM
^^ <3 me some choo choo

god, dying of laughter here.
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02-05-2009 , 11:58 AM
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Originally Posted by cassette
I recently came back after being gone for 10 years as well. The game is much better now imo. More interesting mechanics, creatures are overall better, the stack is a huge improvement, ect.
And more synergy type decks, as in more than the fungallid/fungacid or whatever those things from fallen empires were. I only played a bit (after playing alot like 15 years ago) but now there seemed to a huge focus on making lots of independently weak cards work together as a whole based on race, etc. And shapeshifters added a ton of possible dynamics. From what I recall of the game before, decks were more polarized with lots of crap - and then your huge cards you brought out later.

but I'm drunk and no good at this game, so somebody else should comment on this.
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02-05-2009 , 02:24 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dire
And more synergy type decks, as in more than the fungallid/fungacid or whatever those things from fallen empires were. I only played a bit (after playing alot like 15 years ago) but now there seemed to a huge focus on making lots of independently weak cards work together as a whole based on race, etc. And shapeshifters added a ton of possible dynamics. From what I recall of the game before, decks were more polarized with lots of crap - and then your huge cards you brought out later.

but I'm drunk and no good at this game, so somebody else should comment on this.
Creatures are much better now. Stuff that was on the best creatures list 10 years ago, like Morphling, Juzam Djinn, Hypnotic specter, etc, wouldn't even bet played in standard now. At the first pro tour, people splashed green just to play Erhnam Djinn. Now he would be marginally good in draft. Counterspells and land destruction are much worse. They are catering to the casuals who hate having their land destroyed. They like playing their 9 mana spells without getting them countered.
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02-05-2009 , 06:05 PM
^^ lol wut? do u even play this game?
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02-06-2009 , 07:20 AM
he has a point
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02-06-2009 , 01:11 PM
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Originally Posted by flytrap
Creatures are much better now. Stuff that was on the best creatures list 10 years ago, like Morphling, Juzam Djinn, Hypnotic specter, etc, wouldn't even bet played in standard now. At the first pro tour, people splashed green just to play Erhnam Djinn. Now he would be marginally good in draft. Counterspells and land destruction are much worse. They are catering to the casuals who hate having their land destroyed. They like playing their 9 mana spells without getting them countered.
Pretty sure Morphling would still be played in control decks. Hypno is still the best discard creature printed and is playable in the right decks. It was in a mainstream deck 1 or 2 years ago.

I think you are right about Juzam Djinn though. Counterspells are worse because they were too good before. It it not possible to look at Mana Drain and not recognize how overpowered it is. Cancel is priced right I think. Land Destruction always sucked in tournaments. There was the occasional Ponza deck that would make a splash, but overall just being a sligh deck prob would have been good enough as well.
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02-06-2009 , 05:07 PM
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Originally Posted by Sykes
^^ lol wut? do u even play this game?
Yes, and I'll be playing it in Kyoto so see you there if you're qualified.
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