How does the action compare to WoW/other MMO's?

How good is the transportation? Do you get from A to B quickly, or does much of the game involve lots of boring star travel?

Is there anything to do besides kill things (for example, can you build vehicles/stations/cities etc?)

Can I play this game without becoming a broken, hollow shell of a man?

I've started a 14 day trial. So far it's fun. The learning curve is steep, though. Lots of information to process. But I think that's good. The tutorials are decent and you *need* to do them.

I've started out doing missions for the Caldari Navy. It almost only consists of killing pirates. I've bought a small frigate and it's working out OK. I've made a ton of money, so I can afford a cruiser now, but I don't have the skills to fly one. And I won't have those skills for another week.

So until then I might buy a different frigate or maybe try my hand at mining.

But killing pirates has proven quite lucrative I think. You get money for fulfilling the contract, you get bounties on the individual pirates and you get money when you sell the loot you scavenge from the wrecks.

I've noticed some lag in the solar systems with a lot of players (the Ironforge of EVE I guess). It was quite bad and there were times when the response times for simple actions was anything from 15-60+ seconds. I moved to a less crowded system and it was much better there.

I've only played WoW (to level 40) and SWG (maybe a month, when Jedis were a glimmer on the horizon), but I'd make two general statements. First, it's way better than WoW or SWG IMO. Second, it's way DIFFERENT than most MMOs. That's why I think it's better -- but some people don't stick with it long enough to find the depth. I don't mean that in terms of grinding / play-time. It just takes a few days to a week to really start having "oh [censored], this is awesome!" revelations, particularly if you just fly on your own in the safe areas.

I can answer more specific comparisons if you want.

Well, it depends. Travel across the galaxy would take forever. I mean, an hour or two. That said, there is literally NO reason to fly across the galaxy, other than sightseeing or just being able to say you flew that far.

Like I said in the OP, you tend to settle into a specific solar system as a base of operations. Travel within that system (to asteroid belts for mining / NPC hunting, to stations, etc) is pretty quick. And you'll usually venture out of that base of operations from time to time, usually no more than 5 jumps, 10 if you desperately need something unavailable near you (if you're in the safe, high-sec areas, then you're usually no more than 5 jumps from any item you'd buy). A jump + warping across that solar system to another jump gate is about a minute, 2-3 if you leave it on autopilot.

So... yeah. Travel is slow if you're going a LONG ways, because the galaxy is huge. There's 4400+ solar systems. But you're not going to even pass through the vast majority of them. You'll likely stay in an area of 15-20 systems in a single region where you'll make your home. You might rarely venture further for war combat. Or like in our case, we're setting up another base of operations deeper into space (more profitable area) and that's like 20-25 jumps away. But I haven't even been there yet.

I'll try to list as many basic activities as possible:
1) Kill NPCs (grind for cash)
2) Run Missions (killing NPCs, but it gives you cash and standing with the NPC agent who assigned the mission, which has a variety of benefits)
3) Mine ore (can refine into minerals and sell for cash, or build items/ships)
4) Build stuff (ranging from little ship items like mining lasers to monstrous ships and player-built space stations -- obviously it takes awhile to build larger stuff)
5a) PVP - Pirate (gank people, steal their stuff or threaten to kill their pod if they don't pay ransom [which can cost money and sends them to a cloning station, which could be a long way away if they didn't set their clone to a nearby station])
5b) PVP - Anti-piracy (attack all pirates to protect the area)
6) Trade - Play the market, haul your goods to where they need to go, profit.

I'd say that sums up all the stuff you can do solo. However, if you join a corp, then it can get more complicated. There are lots of things you can do in a corporation, because the politics, war, and economic/industrial design of the game is so wide open. It also means you can play more specialized pilot roles, like scout (goes ahead on hauling routes to look for danger), covert ops (cloaked ship that can seek out an enemy fleet, warp to them, and give your fleet their location to warp to for a big surprise), and myriad other active combat -- but unique -- roles.

I'd say it's easier to do so than a traditional MMO, in that the only disadvantage you have by not playing tons of hours is that you aren't making money (ISK). Your skills train at the same rate whether you're logged in or not, whether you're sitting in a station or fighting pirates -- so you can't fall behind. But obviously you need monies to buy ships and weapons and stuff, so if you don't play much each week then you might reach a point where you can't afford the things you're trained to fly. But that's not bad, and that's part of every MMO. At least here you aren't grinding to advance levels, or to pick up rare epic lootz.

HOWEVER. As you can tell by my long winded posts, if you get into the game, you are going to be pretty enthusiastic about it. So will you become a broken, shell of a man? Well, that depends on how much you like the game and how much self-control you have. Just because you don't NEED to be constantly playing doesn't mean you won't WANT to be, if this game is your cup of tea.

Lemme guess: Jita?

Get out of Jita ASAP. It is, indeed, the Ironforge of Eve. It is pure hell.

I'll PM you my in-game name. Feel free to give me a holler if you have any questions.

I remember that name, istvaan shogatsu from another game MMO I used to play (shattered galaxy, if you're curious). That guy was a complete ass too, also sucked at SG.

My thoughts on the game are similar to Ians I guess.

After playing several MMOs very hardcore back in the day, I looked forward to playing one that didnt require 24/7 (well, 23/7 w EVE downtime) play. Unfortunately, it seemed to me that the game had a very large void in between the learning phase and the corp/alliance endgame.

I absolutely love the concept of the politics, war and penalty for death (other MMOs would be wise to learn). Unfortunately, it seemed very difficult for me to bridge the gap that I encountered.

By choosing to be a more casual player, even while involved in a corp and alliance, it was hard for me to build the relationships necessary to enjoy the game. There is a fair amount of downtime, particularly when travelling. It can be hard to get any interaction if you arent constantly right with people in your corp and even then, you may not depending on what role you are playing.

Perhaps my gameplay experience is not representative, but for me I had to cancel the account. It just wasn't very fun or a must play and it seemed like I was working constantly.

There is no endgame in Eve.

Also, it sounds like you had a bad first corp experience. Like any MMO, there's plenty of crappy corps out there. There's also many variety of corps and it's important to find one that fits you well. Size, goals, location, etc can all make a corp either very fun or very not fun, depending on if it's the right fit.

The corp I'm in has 30-40 people on during prime Euro and US hours, with most of them playing in our home system. So there's lots of group stuff -- defense from player pirates, mining operations, NPC ratting groups, etc -- and lots of chat.

I don't know if your guild had a home system of it's own or not, but I know that I'd be having less fun if we were nomads wandering about high sec space, or if there weren't 30-40 people on for a solid chunk of the day.

Yes, it was in Jita. I'm glad to hear that that's an exception because the lag was really bad...

I've started the trial being a real fan of anti-wussy MMOs (yes, you can be killed/stolen from/looted blank/deceived/<enter anything in here that would make typical WoW wussies shout "OMFG GRIEFERS" and run yelling for mods> - and consent is not mandatory).

I must say that I'm both, a little bit frustrated (very complex game, steeeep learning curve) yet very, very intrigued (all the possibilities...).
The only thing that seems a bit out of whack so far is that it seems too easy to get plenty of ISK. If that impression proves to be right, this certainly will lead to intra-game economical problems sooner or later (if there aren't enough ISK "sinks" in place by then).

However, I'll have to search for some useful skill and tech trees to be able to map out a character and plan on how to tackle this game for some more fun. Especially, since jack of all trades type of characters seem to be vastly inferior to specialized chars - but I've got no clue how to map out my route to becoming a pirate, trader, miner, engineer, or what not else.

Furthermore, I'm not sure how difficult it is to get in touch with a good, useful corp and/or alliance. The channels that are supposed to be there for recruitment are filled by spammers - and I highly doubt the really good corps are spamming in there.

Either way, once I've learned basics, I'm probably going to build a new character and then set out for 0.0, kinda like the INNOMINATE NIGHTMARE.

Until then, do you have any tips for useful resources besides the official site?

Some screenshots of me in my Vexor (a cruiser, next step up from the starting class of frigates).

Mining some sweet, sweet ore (I'm in the middle, and tiny):





In warp on my way to our base:





Some shots of me fighting a NPC pirate. In the first I'm approaching him and the vertical blue streaks are my drones starting to orbit him. In the second, I'm draining his ship's energy for great red flashy justice.

There are, sort of. I mean, after a little while, losing a frigate is going to be pretty meaningless to you because they're so cheap -- while early on, losing a frigate can be downright painful.

But as you advance, the ships get more and more expensive. For example, I'm in a cruiser right now, and that runs me 3.7 mil through my corp for at-cost. The next true class up from this is battleships (arguably battlecruisers, but whatever) usually cost 100mil.

Start factoring in the cost of skills as you advance, and high-quality modules to fit your ships properly, and any corp expenses (some tax, some don't) or projects that you contribute to (corp operations can get REALLY expensive once you start building outposts / stations, plus buying blueprints, etc) and there's plenty of ISK drain on the player.

The only true ISK sinks (that removes ISK from the game) are things you purchase from NPC sellers -- that would mostly be skills -- and the money lost when you lose a ship.

Of course, that's fine, because players need lots of money. Lots of ships get blow'd up in war, so players in corporations and alliances at war need deep wallets.

Sure.

EveMon: Character Planning Tool

QuickFit

Grismar.net Wiki

Ideal Learning Skills Schedule

Eve Skills Roadmap: Can you effectively fly the ship you bought?

There's lots more I can list, if you're looking for any particular guides or resources.

Regarding corporations: the in-game chan is pretty worthless AFAIK. Checking the Eve-Online.com recruiting forum is somewhat better, but it depends on what style of play you're looking for.

If you can't find a corp on there that you think you'd fit with, convo me in-game and I'll see if I can find some corps that you might fit with. If nothing else, as long as you're not planning to be a pirate you could probably join the PA corp I'm in as they're pretty open. The corp is 99% PA posters, but there's a few that aren't and there isn't any particular requirement to join other than the "no piracy" rule.

The other route to take is just to keep an eye out in-game. Check people's profiles and their corps' profiles. Most will note if they're recruiting in there and who to contact, so you can ask around until you find one you think you might fit with. If you get in and decide you don't like it, you can easily leave.

The starting tutorial is sooooo long. I think the mining portion of "filling my hold before i go on the next training section" is going to take me a week.

Yes, tutorial is massively long.

But if you skip it, you tend to ask stupid questions and people tell you to do the tutorial. So it's worth doing.

Also, HELLO HI STABN!

Spicy is telling me i should not play this trial because it is addictive like wow which we have both just recently quit. I think instead i should get spicy addicted. Opinions?

Heh, just found this link on the Eve-O boards. A WoW EU player gave Eve a try. This is hilarious. And also a pretty good example of "if you'd react this way then Eve isn't for you."



You are never completely safe in Eve, and death has consequences. If you stick to the safer areas you're less likely to get blow'd up, but you'd miss out on all the action.

For example, you know that corporation from the story above that pulled off the huge heist? Story time!

Two nights ago, a corp member looted a wreck that had been left behind from a battle he wasn't involved in. Doing this is a gray area. If you're looting stuff that belongs to an ally (for example, the alliance who defends the region we're based in from pirates) then you can cause serious diplomatic problems.

Anyway, he loots it. He announces it in corp chat. Lots of people (including me) go a bit overboard nuts, and tell him to contact CVA (the larger alliance in our space) because we're fairly sure it's theirs. He does so, in their public defense intel channel. They say it isn't theirs. He decides to hang onto it and if anyone comes calling and can identify/prove ownership, he'll return it.

About 30 minutes later, I get blown up by a member of Guiding Hand Social Club, the corp that pulled off that heist. He and a buddy proceed to blow the crap out 3 or 4 other non-corp locals (everyone in our corp docked after I got killed, to figure out what was going on and whether we could defend). He then tells the looter that he wants his loot back, or he's going to keep killing people.

Discussions occur. Corp chat gets heated on both sides, between people telling him to give the GHSC member the loot, and others saying no way.

It quickly becomes obvious that it is NOT his loot, and this GHSC member just saw the announcement on the defense intel channel and figured he could pull a quick scam.

The looter proceeds to engage in negotiations with the GHSC member. What happened in these negotiations is disputed. The looter claims that he traded his Apoc battleship (~100 mil in value) for a fitted Taranis interceptor (which he claimed he sold for 17 mil almost instantly), plus 100 mil in cash. He also keeps the loot, which he says is worth 100 mil. Others in the corp are pretty convinced he's lying about both the loot value and the 100 mil in cash in that deal to save face after getting scammed.

After this, the GHSC member convo's me and tells me he'll compensate me for my lost ship if I post some messages for him in corp chat. I don't believe him about the compensation, but he claims to have a spy in our corp so he'll know if I posted it. I post it, decline his imaginary compensation. He replies, and quotes one of the other members saying "His motto ought to be 'I'm in ur station, stealin' ur shipz" and says that IS a good motto.

So we've got a GHSC spy.

No corp directors were on, so frankly you had a lot of people telling the looter to do the exact opposite of what should have been done, because policy in situations like this hasn't been clearly laid out for new members. So corp directors, when they saw what happened later, took his side on the issue by and large, and were none too happy with those of us who told him to give the GHSC member the loot.

Then this morning, he essentially came out and quit the corp. He admitted he'd been pretending to be a new player when he's played the game for quite some time. He claimed that the loot he got from the wreck was worth 500 mil. He called lots of people names for not hunting down guys who, frankly, would have demolished the noob forces that were in our area at the time (most were doing stuff to set-up our 0.0 base).

Basically, after all the heads of the corp backed him up, he then acted like a total dick, thought that everyone hated him, took his ball and went home (alt).

Oh, and the GHSC member has been in and out of our system since. Of course, now that our directors have said that not only that corp members should NEVER pay ransoms/make deals with con men like GHSC but that GHSC is now deemed kill on sight, these guys have been a little less irritating. Some of the combat forces have come back for a bit, etc.

My point? None of this could happen in high-sec, or in any other MMO -- not with the same stakes, and not with all the possibilities. The range of views on this in the moment ranged from "WE'RE ALL GOING TO DIE MOVE YOUR [censored] OUT OF HERE NOW" to "He's just a scammer, tell him to piss off." And really, the actions that lead up to it could have concievably led to any of those results. We could have pirates and scammers coming to our system, thinking we're easy pushovers. We could piss off the wrong scammer, and get involved in a war. We could have pissed off the alliance that controls the area, and REALLY gotten f'd in the ass. Or we could just end up with a couple annoying but powerful pirates that we have to chase out now and then.

Which is what seems to be the end result.

But that's why you gotta get out of high-sec, if you're trying this game. Whether you want to be the pirate/scammer, or the honorable anti-pirate/anti-scammer, you'll only get that kind of stuff going down in low/zero sec. To me, even if I'm only on an hour or two each day, that's way more interesting than grinding quests/levels/dungeons/etc.

I lost a ship worth about 5 mil in this whole dramabomb, but who cares? That [censored] was way more tense, entertaining, and exciting than any WoW quest I ever saw.



tl,dr: GHSC (corp that pulled massive heist) member killed me in order to draw out a member of my corp for a scam. Said corp member refused the initial scam, but probably got scammed anyway. We all wig out, because we be afraid of GHSC. Corp Directors tell us that we shouldn't take that from anyone, no matter who it is, and that GHSC isn't as powerful anymore as people think. Scammed corp member quits in particularly dickish fashion. We all chase around GHSC member because he's in our stationz, stealin' our shipz.



Last note: Probably should have mentioned earlier that they'll be having downtime for between 12-24 hours today to upgrade and maintain the servers and database. This doesn't happen often, I imagine it's to tweak things affected by the last huge content update to reduce lag.

I missed a few convos today since I left myself signed in, so if you want to PM me here or reply in thread with questions, go for it.