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Old 01-03-2007, 08:45 PM   #1
David Sklansky
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I Invented Caribbean Stud

The rumor that some of you may have heard is essentially correct. Here is the short version of the story. I'll elaborate if there is some good reason to.

In 1982 I invented the game that became Carribbean Stud. I called it Casino Poker. Except for the fact that I exposed one card rather than two, and had no progressive jackpot betting option, the rules were the same. Ante one, bet two more, dealer qualifies with AK. Plus there were bonus pays for high hands.

I was told I couldn't patent the game but I trademarked the name and put it on trial at Vegas World. I didn't follow through because my girlfriend died during that time and I wasn't up to it.

A few years later a poker player asked me about the game because he knew a casino owner in Aruba. He brought the rules down there, they added the progressive, exposed only one card and got it patented. There is ongoing controversy about that patent and I was asked to give a deposition about it a few years ago.

The casino owner eventually sold the game to Mikohn for a bit over 30 million.
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Old 01-03-2007, 09:01 PM   #2
alphatmw
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Re: I Invented Caribbean Stud

how do you pat someone on the back over teh internets?
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Old 01-03-2007, 09:04 PM   #3
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Re: I Invented Caribbean Stud

Yeah, but this is my internet you're using.
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Old 01-03-2007, 09:14 PM   #4
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Re: I Invented Caribbean Stud

There was a time when a clumsy or unsuspecting dealer at Carribean stud would almost always flash the bottom card of his hand. Especially in Atlantic city. This made for a +EV situation. Do you agree?

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Old 01-03-2007, 09:18 PM   #5
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Re: I Invented Caribbean Stud

Quote:
I was told I couldn’t patent the game…
Was this bad advice or was it true at the time. That sucks.

You have that other game you did patent going on now, right? How does when get royalties from a patented game like that? Not the amounts, I am just curious how it gets calculated for you to get paid. Annual fee or number of tables in a casino or what?

(If bad advice at the time, then we must say - “Where was Raymer when you needed him?”)
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Old 01-03-2007, 09:25 PM   #6
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Re: I Invented Caribbean Stud

Quote:
I didn't follow through because my girlfriend died during that time and I wasn't up to it.
story plz
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Old 01-03-2007, 09:29 PM   #7
David Sklansky
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Re: I Invented Caribbean Stud

Quote:
There was a time when a clumsy or unsuspecting dealer at Carribean stud would almost always flash the bottom card of his hand. Especially in Atlantic city. This made for a +EV situation. Do you agree?

leaponthis
Maybe. But only because of the fact that CS paid higher bonuses than CP. After all my game purposesly showed two cards and was unbeatable. Seeing two cards it is slightly correct to "bluff" if I remember correctly. Plus you can occasionally get away from small pairs.
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Old 01-03-2007, 09:34 PM   #8
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Re: I Invented Caribbean Stud

David,

did you work towards some kind of target House Advantage ( say 5% for 'expert'play ) when you invented that game?

How much was the HA anyway for your version of the game for expert or for typical play ?
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Old 01-03-2007, 09:34 PM   #9
David Sklansky
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Re: I Invented Caribbean Stud

Quote:
Quote:
I was told I couldn’t patent the game…
Was this bad advice or was it true at the time. That sucks.

You have that other game you did patent going on now, right? How does when get royalties from a patented game like that? Not the amounts, I am just curious how it gets calculated for you to get paid. Annual fee or number of tables in a casino or what?

(If bad advice at the time, then we must say - “Where was Raymer when you needed him?”)
I think the rules about patenting games was changed right after that. True or not I eventually parlayed my invention into OK money through a convoluted chain of events involving Shufflemaster and others. Maybe I'll tell the whole story someday. As for how you make money off these games, casinos pay a monthly rental of 500 to 1500 a month per table. The distributor gets about 80%, the inventor about 20%.
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Old 01-03-2007, 11:48 PM   #10
leaponthis
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Re: I Invented Caribbean Stud

Quote:
But only because of the fact that CS paid higher bonuses than CP. After all my game purposesly showed two cards and was unbeatable.
Well, the Carribean stud of which I speak is a Casino Table game played as follows.

"Caribbean Stud is played on a blackjack-sized table. The game is based on poker and you should know the ranking of hands. You are playing against the dealer and your hand must beat the dealer's hand. You do not have to worry about beating the other player's hands.

The game starts with each player making an ante bet equal to the table minimum. This is placed in the circle marked "ante" in front of the player. At this time the player also has the option of making an additional dollar side bet for the bonus jackpot.

An automatic shuffler deals the cards and each player receives a hand with five cards face down. The dealer's hand has four cards down and one card up.

Players look at their cards and decide to fold and forfeit their ante bet or call by making an additional bet, which is twice the size of the ante. If you are playing at a five-dollar table your ante bet would be five dollars and your call bet would be ten dollars.

After the players have bet or folded, the dealer's hand is turned over. The dealer must qualify by having a hand with Ace-King or better. If the dealer does not qualify the players are paid even money for their original ante bet and the second call bet is a push, which means it, does not win or lose.

If your hand beats the dealer you will be paid even money for your ante bet and your call bet will be paid according to the following pay table.

One Pair or less: 1 to 1
Two Pairs: 2 to 1
Three of a Kind: 3 to 1
Straight: 4 to 1
Flush: 5 to 1
Full House: 7 to 1
Four of a Kind: 20 to 1
Straight Flush: 50 to 1 "



In this Carribean stud it is to a players advantage to see 2 cards. I believe that most people that know Carribean Stud know this version and not yours.

leaponthis
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Old 01-04-2007, 06:55 PM   #11
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Re: I Invented Caribbean Stud

Quote:
Quote:
I didn't follow through because my girlfriend died during that time and I wasn't up to it.
story plz
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Old 01-06-2007, 05:30 PM   #12
Peter McDermott
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Re: I Invented Caribbean Stud

From Richard Marcus's Dirty Poker (yes, I know it sucks):

"According to poker room gossip, which I can state with a high degree of confidence is true, the game [which Marcus calls Tropical Poker] was actually invented, or at least the concept was, by a down and out poker player who was more out as a result of alcohol consumption than of bad beats at the tables.

After having stumbled onto the idea for Tropical Poker, he then took it to a high-profile poker player who today is world famous as the author of poker strategy books. This guy, whose name I will not mention but most of you will have already guessed, did the math on the bust-out's game and concluded Tropical Poker was a viable new table game to introduce to the casino industry."

Marcus goes on to claim that although this 'poker author' and the 'bust out' (who he calls Arnold) initially agreed to split the profits on the game 50/50, but then said bust out ran off to Aruba where he had the idea stolen by someone called Rick Sayers.

Presumably, the name we've already guessed here is Sklansky?
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