I wasn't sure if I can discuss this here, but according to the uNL FAQ: "uNL is a forum to discuss hand histories and theories that pertain to any stakes NL50 (0.25/0.50) and below." This would qualify as theory relevant to beating NL50 and below IMO.

One of my friends asked me to do a leakfinder for him. I think I have a pretty good system in place for doing these atm and since I've been glued to HEM data for the last few weeks, I asked him to ship me some HH's for analysis. It didn't take long to realize he is gloriously overplaying hands.

They are pretty basic situations in which I'm sure 95% of you could give him good advice. Like this one, vs. a 15/12 villain over a few hundred hands.

Full Tilt Poker $0.25/$0.50 No Limit Hold'em - 6 players
2+2 Hand Converter Powered By DeucesCracked

SB: $45.65
BB: $53.20
Hero (UTG): $50.00
MP: $50.00
CO: $50.00
BTN: $80.80

Pre Flop: ($0.75) Hero is UTG with Q K
Hero raises to $1.50, MP calls $1.50, 1 fold, BTN calls $1.50, 2 folds

Flop: ($5.25) 3 K 6 (3 players)
Hero bets $3.50, MP calls $3.50, BTN calls $3.50

Turn: ($15.75) 2 (3 players)
Hero checks, MP bets $9.25, BTN folds, Hero raises to $45 all in, MP requests TIME, MP calls $35.75 all in

I won't bother you with counter HH's but that seems to be the general pattern. I told him about this and he said something to the effect of "I just often cannot believe that my TPGK or overpair got cracked again. I know these things but just got excited about playing 100nl then played like **** when that goal disappeared. Like people always say the only goal should be to play well and make correct decisions."

Ah yes. The issue that seems to keep most of us back from crushing. It's not that we don't know the right answer to the hand if we get asked advice on it. It's that for some reason, some of us can't act on that knowledge.

The are other things we do as well which stunt our growth and our earnings. They have very little to do with strategy and an enormous amount to do with psychology.

For example, I can't play long sessions, and often when I get up a few buy-ins, I quit. I am loss-averse, so when I'm up, I don't want to give much (any) of it back. My perfect session is winning little here, little there, and then going on a massive rush 45 minutes into the session and then quitting at the peak of my graph. For example, here is my graph for today:



48 minutes of play after which I had 0 motivation to continue. After that, the stress of putting in additional hands is really high. I can usually come back and play another session later on, but meh - don't really want to. I'm still very, very result-oriented. My results effect my mood and I know this. If I end on a good note, I'm usually in a good mood for the rest of the day. The opposite holds as well. In the end, it's def costing me money though. Good luck telling me not to be results-oriented. It just doesn't work like that.

So what is the point of this post? As I was talking to my friend above, the conversation reminded me of this classic thread started by AZplaya called "Expensive thoughts you have". For me, it's not that I have that many expensive thoughts (I mean ... I still do, but I think my overall tactical game is pretty solid as is my emotional control at the tables). I do have tons of expensive habits and routines AWAY from the tables.

I don't sleep well. I would make tons more money if I was well rested and could concentrate for more than 60 minutes at a time.

I hate losing and thus if I lose a few BI's and don't win them back by the end of the session, I'm in a bad mood for most of the rest of the day (or if I play an evening session I have a hard time going to sleep which leads back to issue # 1).

I spend waaaaay too much time browsing forums and the internet in general. If I spent half the time grinding that I spend on the forums, I would be as rich and ballin' as G2K4.



It seems like the cookie-cutter piece of advice people give to beginning micro stakes players is "play tight, don't bluff, and value bet thinly". I hear the same version of psychological advice and it's something like "don't worry about your results, eat well, and get plenty of exercise." ORLY? Is that really it? Wow ... I'm off to crush then.

I am willing to bet a lot of $$ that the things that separate to long-term winners from the long-term losers in this game won't have nearly that much to do with a deep understanding of poker strategy at the tables, but a deep understanding and overcoming of one's baggage away from the felt. Yet, it seems that people spend 90% of their effort trying to develop their ability to play 3-bet pots or stuff like that.

So I'm curious what you guys are aware of that holds you back from really making a lot of money. Is the main issue your poker game at the tables or is the main issue completely unrelated to the actual strategy involved in specific hands and something bigger?

Terrific thread.
Mine is easy. I am a little older than most here and I developed my personality inclinations well before poker came into my life. Unfortunately for me low self esteem has been a life long problem, which is odd considering I have had career success and a comfortable life. Low esteem leads to high tilt factor caused by bad beats. Oh the amounts I've lost due to tilt. Another factor tied to fear of losing and resulting self loath/tilt is M.U.B.S.(monster's under the bead syndrome). I have TPTK-well the guy who called me must be slow playing a set so I better check it down. Of course he has a lower pair and I miss two streets of value. Fear of losing killed my game for year's and just now I'm doing better, but by reminding myself during my sessions to not expect the worst.
The advice commonly found around here states it best - don't be so results oriented, just make good decisions. I don't tilt now when I know I played the hand the best I could.

I'm extremely competitive. When I played team sports in school, I used to explode at teammates when they really f'd up. Even as a grown adult, in an ice hockey league, I lost a good friend who was also a teammate due to my competitive nature.

When I'm at a table and some overly aggressive donk tries to run over me, I find myself playing back at him (her?) way too much. "WTF are you doing motherf*%&er?!!! I am sooooo much better than you!!! I'm gonna show you..."

And that's how I lose a fair chunk 'o change from time to time.

Wow I can relate a lot to the advice you're trying to give. It's exactly how I am now to be honest. I feel like most of the times when I look over hand histories I know which line is best to take, but when I actually play, sometimes I don't act on my knowledge. Maybe I'm just a bit tired when I play or am playing too many tables, either way it gets pretty frustrating sometimes. Also, I browse the forums waaay too much and I can't get myself to consistently put in many hours for grinding, which is my biggest flaw I think.

I used to have the same problem. You have to cut down tables so you can make the best decisions. I have cut down tables from 9-12 to 6 with great success so far.

I have two of the same problems... I don't sleep well, although it is better lately... and I spend way too much time browsing the forums. I also share TAG-NIT, in that I have low self esteem, which generally leads me to playing poorly for awhile when things aren't going well.. this leads to a lack of motivation to grind. It also costs me $$ when I go against what I know is the best decision, and instead I convince myself that I'm probably wrong because wtf do I know.

Add the fact that I'm as bad at real life money management as I'm good at poker br management... so I'm withdrawing money all the time.

i have some of the same issues verneer does. i am results oriented (mostly from session to session, less so from hand to hand unless im running really badly) and hate booking losses, which leads me to grind more when im struggling and losing and running badly and less when i'm playing very well, running good and crushing.

i stay up too late considering the fact that i dont like playing at night, leading me to playing fewer hours a day.

when i start a session off hot, i am very likely to quit early and stopwin. if i ship a quick 6bi in an hour of play, im generally done for the day.

theres more but these are the things i immediately can think of.

Wow great post. I have similar issues to you. I am so results oriented its crazy. If I'm up 6bi in a session then get coolered or sucked out on for 2 bi's I get really tilted and can't play anymore despite the fact I'm still technically up 4 bi's. I also hate stopping a session while loosing. Atleast I sleep well I guess.

Sometimes I'm results oriented. Hate to loose when I'm up and if I'm down I feel I need to win it back. At other times I know how to let it go though; it's just one continuum; it's just a game of poker; who cares, tonight I'll be partying with friends. I guess, having others things going for you other than poker makes it easier to let it go and put it each session in perspective.

An other thing is being lazy with thinking, just wanting to play certain ranges in certain spots automatically. I'm actually starting to break through this lately, actively thinking about several factors in each hand, each street. I can say it's been paying off.

I would have so much more $$ if only I didn't spew so easily when I tilt. My A game quickly degrades into my B game after a few buyins and that becomes my F game just as fast.

I don't remember where i read that, but it was about this limit you don't want to cross, the point where you feel you lost so much that more losses become insignificant, that's when you start to feel nothing when you lose.
It said you shouldn't ever cross that line, or stop playing before you think you could go in this way.
I reached it, and now it's very hard to actually think about each hand individually, since you're used to the fact that anyway whatever you're going to do, you're going to lose.
That tends to keep me from playing, but i try to go on. It's hard though.

if i didn't comw home from work on a sat at 5am drunk and think i can easily beat anyone 50NL heads up... i think i know how to stop this but!!!

I have the same problems. I have learned to fold overpairs and top pair to turn aggression against fish, but still have a few leaks when I think regs are playing back at me and I own myself.

My top problems:

Capping Winning Sessions - Like you said, I should quit when I hit my heaters. I have been up as much as 3 buyins in a session and dropped down to 1/4 of a buyin and it is really killing my winrate. I really do get winners tilt and I need to stop.

Spewing Against Regs - Sometimes I get in spots and wonder how I got there. Something like 3 barreling with air with AK because I am up against a reg and think they are playing back at me.

Quit Hero Calling - Kinda tied into the other one. When I see a fish bet $5 into an $18 pot, I always call with middle pair or something thinking I am good. This is my biggest leak, I think.

Same problem here about still being heavily results oriented and the approach to the session is pretty much the same: the only thing different is that I try to play 4/5 short session by day.
I guess that playing short session has the merit to keep the focus high while, in my experience, long session (more than 1 hour) especially if multitabling (>8) create the problem to play way too robotic and the result is to have breakeven or loosing sessions too often (my red line became horrible in these).

i still kinda believe inside somewhere that i run worse than the next guy, and my perma runbad is a limiting factor

sometimes i use this silly notion as a justification of different things