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Old 03-18-2017, 07:04 AM   #76
akashenk
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Re: Wynn Summer classic

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Originally Posted by BoDiddleyMacau View Post
Have you been sneaking around my office?

We'll be out next week, stay tuned.
I thought that was Steve Wynn's office. Whoops.
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Old 03-21-2017, 01:12 PM   #77
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Re: Wynn Summer classic

For the upcoming signature weekend series April 20-23, its listed as 545 + 55.

At the bottom it says 4% is withheld for tip. Is this in addition to the 55? Making this roughly 525 + 75?

Just wondering, planning on coming to play either way.
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Old 03-21-2017, 05:35 PM   #78
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Re: Wynn Summer classic

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For the upcoming signature weekend series April 20-23, its listed as 545 + 55.

At the bottom it says 4% is withheld for tip. Is this in addition to the 55? Making this roughly 525 + 75?

Just wondering, planning on coming to play either way.
That is correct. The 4% withheld for the staff fee comes off the $545. The total "juice" on the event is 12.8%.

Look forward to seeing you there.
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Old 03-21-2017, 07:46 PM   #79
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Re: Wynn Summer classic

How are you doing on releasing the summer schedule. All others are now out.
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Old 03-22-2017, 04:04 PM   #80
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Re: Wynn Summer classic

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How are you doing on releasing the summer schedule. All others are now out.
It's going to "print" as we speak, meaning the collateral and website are in development. We should have a PDF version in the next day or two.
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Old 03-23-2017, 05:36 PM   #81
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Re: Wynn Summer classic

here we go http://www.visitwynn.com/documents/W...merClassic.pdf
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Old 03-23-2017, 06:34 PM   #82
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Re: Wynn Summer classic

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LOL. Shocking that there's only one non-NLHE event. At least I will have the satisfaction of knowing none of my cash will find its way into Steve Wynn's pockets this summer.
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Old 03-23-2017, 07:02 PM   #83
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Re: Wynn Summer classic

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LOL. Shocking that there's only one non-NLHE event. At least I will have the satisfaction of knowing none of my cash will find its way into Steve Wynn's pockets this summer.
+1
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Old 03-23-2017, 07:50 PM   #84
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Re: Wynn Summer classic

wow one PLO event and nothing else other than nlh. disappointed is an understatement
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Old 03-23-2017, 08:22 PM   #85
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Re: Wynn Summer classic

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LOL. Shocking that there's only one non-NLHE event. At least I will have the satisfaction of knowing none of my cash will find its way into Steve Wynn's pockets this summer.
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+1
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wow one PLO event and nothing else other than nlh. disappointed is an understatement
There are already a ton of non-NLH events being offered at other properties. Entering what is already a saturated and relatively small market wouldn't make a great deal of business sense. Now if you mixed game proponents actually showed up at these other events in the sort of numbers which justified the loudness with which you complain about the lack of options, I think these casinos would have no choice but to acquiesce to our demands. But historically, there just haven't been enough bodies in seats to justify offering more.
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Old 03-23-2017, 08:28 PM   #86
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Re: Wynn Summer classic

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There are already a ton of non-NLH events being offered at other properties. Entering what is already a saturated and relatively small market wouldn't make a great deal of business sense. Now if you mixed game proponents actually showed up at these other events in the sort of numbers which justified the loudness with which you complain about the lack of options, I think these casinos would have no choice but to acquiesce to our demands. But historically, there just haven't been enough bodies in seats to justify offering more.


If there were more of these events offered year round then more people may give them a shot. I'm not complaining I'm just disappointed. Nlhe is a fantastic game, perhaps the most exciting poker game of all time, and I can't blame the Wynn for there decision, they do a great job. I just think for the long term health of the game, there should be a push for other games to become more popularized, also exciting and a lot of fun.


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Old 03-23-2017, 08:36 PM   #87
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Re: Wynn Summer classic

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If there were more of these events offered year round then more people may give them a shot. I'm not complaining I'm just disappointed. Nlhe is a fantastic game, perhaps the most exciting poker game of all time, and I can't blame the Wynn for there decision, they do a great job. I just think for the long term health of the game, there should be a push for other games to become more popularized, also exciting and a lot of fun.

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Its kind of a chicken and egg situation, but if more mixed game players showed up to whatever mixed game offerings there are throughout the year, then casinos would be justified in offering more options. But these players don't show up because mixed games just aren't as popular. I'm not trying to argue about the merits of mixed games vs NLH or anything like that. I'm just saying the numbers haven't been there historically. Maybe that will change in the future. But in the meantime, there are lots of options this summer. If players show up, casinos will take notice. if they don't casinos will also take notice. Its really up to you. So there's no reason to complain or be disappointed by what the Wynn is able to offer. Don't give them the chance to disappoint by showing them they can make money in mixed games. Until that happens, all the complaining and disappointment in the world won't do any good.
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Old 03-23-2017, 09:13 PM   #88
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Re: Wynn Summer classic

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Its kind of a chicken and egg situation, but if more mixed game players showed up to whatever mixed game offerings there are throughout the year, then casinos would be justified in offering more options. But these players don't show up because mixed games just aren't as popular. I'm not trying to argue about the merits of mixed games vs NLH or anything like that. I'm just saying the numbers haven't been there historically. Maybe that will change in the future. But in the meantime, there are lots of options this summer. If players show up, casinos will take notice. if they don't casinos will also take notice. Its really up to you. So there's no reason to complain or be disappointed by what the Wynn is able to offer. Don't give them the chance to disappoint by showing them they can make money in mixed games. Until that happens, all the complaining and disappointment in the world won't do any good.
I love how you whine and complain about the way Chris at Planet Hollywood sets his schedule and act like you are the expert on everything on these boards. Just like you are entitled to voice your opinion about everything, everyone else has that same right. Why do you feel you need to comment on an area where you have no expertise? Please do us all a favor and stick to what you do best (whatever that is in your mind) and leave the mixed game crowd alone. Nobody cares about your opinion as to why there are fewer mixed games than NLHE games. We all know NLHE is more popular. You're not saying anything we already don't know. I knew you wouldn't be able to resist jumping into this conversation as you have done so repeatedly in years past. Just shut up already and stay out of the mixed game comments. Focus on working your own agenda as you consistently do on all of these threads.

You want to comment on the Wynn's schedule and how great it is for you and the NLHE crowd... Awesome. But there's zero need for you to put your two cents in on everything especially when it doesn't affect you.
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Old 03-23-2017, 10:01 PM   #89
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Re: Wynn Summer classic

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There are already a ton of non-NLH events being offered at other properties. Entering what is already a saturated and relatively small market wouldn't make a great deal of business sense.
I agree that this summer is unusually saturated with non-NLH events.
I also didn't think Wynn was known for having many non-NLH events, so I'm not really disappointed by their schedule.

Quote:
Now if you mixed game proponents actually showed up at these other events in the sort of numbers which justified the loudness with which you complain about the lack of options, I think these casinos would have no choice but to acquiesce to our demands. But historically, there just haven't been enough bodies in seats to justify offering more.
This is the part with which I don't really agree. Most events that are busts tend to have predictable reason(s) for that:

* feature a relatively unpopular game (relative to other non-NLH games)
* conflict with other similar event(s)
* held very early or very late in summer schedule
* wrong buy-in amount (less popular games tend to do much better with lower BIs... while the more popular games may do even better with a higher BI)

If you hold a 1k Badugi that conflicts with day 1 of the WSOP Badugi, then it's probably going to be a dud. If you hold a moderate BI, well-structured event for one of the more popular non-NLH games (PLO, PLO8, FLO8, HORSE...) that is the day before or on day 2-3 of WSOP during mid-late June and it doesn't conflict with another event of the same (or very similar) variant, then it should usually be a success.

I think the overall trend is pretty good for non-NLH events. We're seeing more variety (DC, Big Bet, Mixed PLO, Mixed O8, Big O, etc.), some bigger BIs, smarter scheduling (esp. DSE), and an increase in non-NLH MTTs offered (PH... Binions again, etc.). Most of the places seem to be on board with offering more/better non-NLH MTTs, but this summer will be a pretty good test as to how strong the non-NLH market is.
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Old 03-23-2017, 10:51 PM   #90
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Re: Wynn Summer classic

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Originally Posted by akashenk View Post
There are already a ton of non-NLH events being offered at other properties. Entering what is already a saturated and relatively small market wouldn't make a great deal of business sense. Now if you mixed game proponents actually showed up at these other events in the sort of numbers which justified the loudness with which you complain about the lack of options, I think these casinos would have no choice but to acquiesce to our demands. But historically, there just haven't been enough bodies in seats to justify offering more.
I quit traveling to a lot of the Circuit events when they turned into NLHE-fests. In the past, I went out of my way to clear my calendar for places like Council Bluffs when they had HORSE- that stopped when they made the decision to leave it off the schedule.

I actually ALSO am changing my travel plans for this year now that the other casinos posted their schedules and are offering mixed and stud games. I will wind up spending more at non-WSOP locations than I will at the WSOP...I would have been willing to spend some of that at the Wynn if they had any manner of non-NLHE scheduling.

It is difficult to show numbers when places won't offer the events...but I seem to recall the WSOP-C at Rio having substantially exceeded their expectations in the HORSE event.
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Old 03-23-2017, 10:57 PM   #91
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Re: Wynn Summer classic

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Most of the places seem to be on board with offering more/better non-NLH MTTs, but this summer will be a pretty good test as to how strong the non-NLH market is.
The concern will be with the overlaps that exist...when I made out my calendar, I noted multiple instances of O/8 events at two different properties on the same date, with the same situation existing for HORSE on the 6th and 7th and again on the 22nd.

Then there are the days like the 13th that has Razz at Binions and 2-7 triple draw at PHo.

It's great that the properties will host those events, but it thins the entries with the overlap...and unfortunately, that thinned turnout can be used next year to claim a lack of interest in BOTH.
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Old 03-23-2017, 11:40 PM   #92
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Re: Wynn Summer classic

I always struggle to understand how folks are disappointed when these schedules are announced. Anyone who has played or looked into Wynn's summer series (or any of their other series) the past few years knows they are almost exclusively NLH tourneys. Same goes for Aria. The buyins and dates for larger events may vary, but you kind of know what you're going to get.
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Old 03-24-2017, 02:30 AM   #93
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Re: Wynn Summer classic

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The concern will be with the overlaps that exist...when I made out my calendar, I noted multiple instances of O/8 events at two different properties on the same date, with the same situation existing for HORSE on the 6th and 7th and again on the 22nd.
Overall, I think they did a fantastic job in not overlapping O8 events very much, considering how many there are.

Quote:
Then there are the days like the 13th that has Razz at Binions and 2-7 triple draw at PHo.
That's unfortunate, but what is fortunate is being able to play events like Razz and esp. 27TD at all (outside of WSOP). The overlap may hurt attendance for each, but probably not more than having day 1s of WSOP 1k PLO and DSE 600 Big O on that day as well.

Quote:
It's great that the properties will host those events, but it thins the entries with the overlap...and unfortunately, that thinned turnout can be used next year to claim a lack of interest in BOTH.
I agree that's possible, but I'm not sure it makes that big of a difference for future years. I don't expect a dramatic surge of the less popular non-NLH events anytime soon, but they will likely be offered sporadically by PH, Binions, and/or GN. Don't get me wrong, I like games like Razz & 27TD, but I think they're offered as much or more for fun, courtesy, prestige, tradition, etc., than because they expect a large turnout. Who knows though? Razz has a lot of fans, in large part due to being part of HORSE, and 27TD is becoming more popular, so maybe those events will surprise us.
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Old 03-24-2017, 10:28 AM   #94
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Re: Wynn Summer classic

When it says 4% of prizepool is withheld for staff, does that mean 4% of buy in or 4% of the part that's going to the prizepool after fees?
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Old 03-24-2017, 11:17 AM   #95
akashenk
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Re: Wynn Summer classic

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I love how you whine and complain about the way Chris at Planet Hollywood sets his schedule and act like you are the expert on everything on these boards. Just like you are entitled to voice your opinion about everything, everyone else has that same right. Why do you feel you need to comment on an area where you have no expertise? Please do us all a favor and stick to what you do best (whatever that is in your mind) and leave the mixed game crowd alone. Nobody cares about your opinion as to why there are fewer mixed games than NLHE games. We all know NLHE is more popular. You're not saying anything we already don't know. I knew you wouldn't be able to resist jumping into this conversation as you have done so repeatedly in years past. Just shut up already and stay out of the mixed game comments. Focus on working your own agenda as you consistently do on all of these threads.

You want to comment on the Wynn's schedule and how great it is for you and the NLHE crowd... Awesome. But there's zero need for you to put your two cents in on everything especially when it doesn't affect you.
I'm happy to say the usual mixed game whiners haven't been out en-force this year, compared to years past (until you showed up in the Wynn thread, of course). I have to assume its because several venues have gone out of their way to provide some options. I hope the perennial whiners will actually attend these events. If they don't, I doubt we will see any sort of continued proliferation of these options. If that happens, will the incessant whining return? I suspect so.

As for my comments vis-Ó-vis mixed games in this thread, I will remind you (but of course you know this), that it was you who interjected your opinion on the matter when you posted...

"LOL. Shocking that there's only one non-NLHE event. At least I will have the satisfaction of knowing none of my cash will find its way into Steve Wynn's pockets this summer. " - Omaha8King

Apparently you just couldn't help yourself. Now, one might ask why anyone, never mind Steve Wynn, should really care where you, in particular, spend your money. But, of course, you have every right to voice your gripe on this message board. And I have every right to point out, as I seemingly have to each year, that your bitching and moaning on this topic is counter-productive and illogical.

BTW. I believe Chris is making bad business decisions, which for the most part will not effect me, but will effect him and PH in the future. I don't complain. I indicate where he is going wrong and I back up my statements with either facts, logic or his own statements/actions. That is completely different from what you often do, at least when it comes to mixed game advocacy.

Last edited by akashenk; 03-24-2017 at 11:23 AM.
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Old 03-24-2017, 11:39 AM   #96
akashenk
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Re: Wynn Summer classic

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The concern will be with the overlaps that exist...when I made out my calendar, I noted multiple instances of O/8 events at two different properties on the same date, with the same situation existing for HORSE on the 6th and 7th and again on the 22nd.

Then there are the days like the 13th that has Razz at Binions and 2-7 triple draw at PHo.

It's great that the properties will host those events, but it thins the entries with the overlap...and unfortunately, that thinned turnout can be used next year to claim a lack of interest in BOTH.
This is an excellent point, and the issue does not only pertain to non-NLH. The NLH tourneys are starting to overlap to a great degree and cannibalize each-other too. Of course, in NLH there is a much larger pool of players to draw from, so the effect may not be as great. However, when venues start putting out big guarantees for events, it puts them at greater risk if their events overlap. And given that most of the annual poker revenue at many of these venues is made during the WSOP, any sort of flop on a big guarantee can be disastrous. This is the issue I am trying to bring to Chris' attention at PH. Whether or not he listens is his own prerogative.

Regardless, and back on the mixed game topic, I will say this. A couple years ago a venue went out of its way to offer a large and varied set of options for mid-level mixed game buy-ins throughout the whole Summer WSOP series. That decision turned out to be largely a flop, leading the venue to drastically curtail its mixed game offerings in the subsequent years. Now, there may have been plenty of good reasons why it didn't succeed. There was certainly plenty of whining from the mixed game crowd about this or that. But what mixed game players, indeed all poker players, need to understand is poker is not a booming enterprise. In fact, when you look at the decrease in poker floor space in Vegas over the last few years, one could say it is a dying enterprise. That doesn't mean these rooms can't have great success during the summer. But it does mean their margin for error is less, leaving them unwilling to take risks. Offering more or better mixed game options is risky, at least at this point in the poker evolution. Players cannot change this with their voices. They can only do so with their wallets.
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Old 03-24-2017, 01:31 PM   #97
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Re: Wynn Summer classic

I can't curse moneymaker enough, he single handedly ruined poker.
Today, we have a whole new generation that makes up the bulk of the poker field with NLH being the only game they are interested in 😆
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Old 03-24-2017, 01:34 PM   #98
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Re: Wynn Summer classic

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But what mixed game players, indeed all poker players, need to understand is poker is not a booming enterprise. In fact, when you look at the decrease in poker floor space in Vegas over the last few years, one could say it is a dying enterprise. That doesn't mean these rooms can't have great success during the summer. But it does mean their margin for error is less, leaving them unwilling to take risks. Offering more or better mixed game options is risky, at least at this point in the poker evolution. Players cannot change this with their voices. They can only do so with their wallets.
can you provide some evidence for this?
i can provide one to the contrary
47th Annual World Series of Poker« Sets Attendance and Several Other Records; Awards $221+ Million in Prize Money
http://www.wsop.com/news/2016/Jul/78...R-RECORDS.html
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Old 03-24-2017, 01:38 PM   #99
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Re: Wynn Summer classic

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I can't curse moneymaker enough, he single handedly ruined poker.
Today, we have a whole new generation that makes up the bulk of the poker field with NLH being the only game they are interested in 😆
Completely disagree. Poker became a monster after moneymaker won. So what if nlh is the game of choice. NLHE is a great game and there's still plenty of non nlhe offerings.
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Old 03-24-2017, 02:10 PM   #100
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Re: Wynn Summer classic

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Completely disagree. Poker became a monster after moneymaker won. So what if nlh is the game of choice. NLHE is a great game and there's still plenty of non nlhe offerings.
It became more mainstream, but unfortunately, it also became the downfall of stud and draw poker in addition to the stud variants...and the few offerings became much more sparse following Black Friday.

Now it seems that it is only the raisins that have an interest in games that require thought processes to remember what cards have been exposed and to actually figure out the potentially five down cards held by an opponent...

I've made a chunk of money FROM no-limit games, but I will keep walking past them if there is a good mixed game or stud or draw game/event going.
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