Embarrassing. I have long been big fans of the guys that run these tournaments, but their conduct here sounds to be completely unprofessional at every turn, imo. It seems quite likely they made a big mistake on their points structure sheets, and to put this mistake off on a player by calling his pointing it out an "angle" is ludicrous. Hopefully their clamming up about things means they realize they've got to take a serious look at this and do the right thing.

Again...what bothers me most is the calling it an angle part. Whoever said that was so incredibly out of line...unless William said something ridic to him to tick him off.

Management came back and said: We have never given points to people who do not cash. Apologies for the misunderstanding.

A ton can still happen today in this last event. From the looks of things, there are still 20 people who can win the points race. If this issue ends up being the difference between William winning or not we will pursue our legal options.

Thanks

Did they give points to 9-16 who also did not cash?

They don't give out points to 27 spots if they don't pay 27 in the other events (even though they list point values to 27). Not sure why you expect them to alter this for the heads up.

I think there is a decent basis for saying it's obvious that those who don't cash don't get points. Generally, your finish in the tournament isn't recorded unless you cash, so you can't award points. That said, the HU event is obviously different.

Places 9-16 did cash

I spoke to the head guy who was polite and apologetic however they intend to stand by the unwritten rule rather than the written one i hae said that they need to watch their brand here because the poker community places a lot of emphasis on fairness the dealers here and the tournament.staff bar one are marvelous and on the whole it is well run

The difference is that the rules sheet clearly states for all other events that they aware 2 points and 1 point for a cash (regular and turbo events). In the heads up event, it mentions absolutely nothing about it.

That's gross, hope you guys get your money. Really interested to see how they handle this. Very often you will get the "its our policy" response from casinos even though everything you have seen or been told implies otherwise. Like Todd Terry said in the other thread, make sure you get a screenshot or printout of the original sheet that said he would get the points. Good luck

I think this thread underscores that it's a brave new world for TDs regarding their tournaments. If you do a good job (and by and large, these TDs did a good job), you will be commended. Most of the feedback about this series has been very good, and I agree with that positive feedback, by and large.

However, if you are a TD and you screw up or do something shady (and this omission seems much more like a screw up than something shady), there's a good chance now you're going to get called out on it by someone. See the thread on the Harrah's Chester tourney this past fall: http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/65...-13-a-1114522/ for an example.

This principle applies to players too -- we've got that same accountability now. If we do something shady in a tourney, there's a reasonable chance someone might post about it, and our rep takes a hit. See this extremely long thread: http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/65...cumbag-815445/

Or this one about Tmay...
http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/18...n-10k-1001130/

Hopefully this increased transparency leads to people doing the right thing more often...

It also lists point values for up to 27 places without specifying cash or no cash. So if they award your guy the 5 points why can't someone else claim to have bubbled a bunch of the other tournaments and claim those points?

They could reasonably try to claim that, if you ask me. Which furthers the point that not including something like "must cash in an event to receive points" on the sheet was a pretty big mistake, given their current stance.

Definitely understand your perspective, but it isn't universally held/clear to everyone, so they def should have clarified that non cashes don't count for points if that what their plan.

So I've mostly sided with op here, but I would like to know if William truly had thought he had had these extra 5 points from Wednesday on, or whether he suddenly realized last night he might have a valid, technical claim to these points. This is important to the claim of possibly having played more events because he thought he was closer to the points lead than he actually was.

Also, does anyone remember if they made an announcement before the HU that 17th to 32nd awarded no points? I have a friend telling me such an announcement was made...I wasn't really paying attention, room was pretty noisy.

I'm shocked that the Horseshoe's management and lawyers decided not to follow the published rules. It's flat out wrong. If this alteration causes him not to win the $50K, he should sue and I think he'll win quite easily.

Terrible! They have lost my business,unorganized place + terrible dealers & staff as well imo!

Pretty much business as usual for the Horse****. What a ****hole.

you will never win this argument. WSOPC always has this rule. They did the exact same thing to me in NOLA last year. I played in the 10k because 1-18 received 100 points. so a 1-18 finish would guarantee me a spot in the Free Roll at the end of the year. Only problem is that 76 players registered. They ended up only paying 9 places. Since 10-18 were not cashes we did not receive any points. I plaid the 10k because the sheet clearly stated that 1-18 got 100 points but the circumstances changed. and there was no recourse. Wouldn't have played if i knew only final table would get points.

We 100% thought he had the points up until last night. Fwiw I have the majority of the action in play here and we've been making joint decisions the entire series due to that. William only had 2 times to receive points, the win for 25 points and then the heads up. I had not even looked at the standings because I "knew" he had 30 points and was slightly behind the leaders. When he won the tournament last night I took a closer look at the standings to see where we stood exactly and to also compare the standings to anyone still left in the main event and that's the point we both realized they had not awarded him the 5 points.

William busted the $240 event today, so it's just a waiting game now to see if anyone will surpass his would have been 42.5 point total.

Man, I really like this group of TDs, but looking over that scoring sheet again, it looks like someone threw it together in 15 minutes with no thought of contingencies. I mean what the hell is OP supposed to do? Not fight for his legit claim on $50k? And if you are the guy who finishes 4 points ahead of OP (if he doesn't get the 5 from HU), are you supposed to turn down the money? You've won it according to the intended rules.

What a cluster. This is probably going to get really ugly.

This is ridiculous, especially the way they apparently talked to him. Can you please tell us who made the comments and who else is running the tournament. Bob Smith is the only name I got from this thread but I want to be aware of who is pulling this nonsense.

This seems pretty clear cut to me. If they published 17-32 HU gets 5 points then not awarding points for it amounts to a broken contract. End of argument. I don't see how you would lose if you sought legal action.

If they're going to take prize money out for the staff I think a 1 % tip is more than fair. I mean wtf. You have a 25 % rake on the turbos, 20 % on the event 1 and the same rake for re-entries, 17 % on event 2, etc.

Hey Shane you should Consider asking jose and Ryan for some kind of chop
Now that Jose is on dinner break. Isn't there one more event to be played as well?
Sorry to see them screw use over like this but best of luck

Today was the last event. I considered talking to Ryan and Jose about it but ultimately it's not their responsibility. It's the Chicago Poker Classic's responsibility to honor the rules they published themselves.

I took 34th in the first event and was shown the tip box 2 times and the women paying me out told me the dealers only get paid 4 dollars a hour so tips are appreciated..

Your only option if Caesars doesn't do the right thing is to take it to the Indiana Gaming Commission.