will this game be played using lol DM rules?

With the general DM layout, yes. What do you have a concern with?

n0 kills and no reveals are both suboptimal

also the use of video instead of just posting on a forum amirite?

no, video is cool

honestly n0 kills are manageable too but kinda a waste to make someone be around and then get killed before the game starts

no reveals is a little pointless though and I have never understood why DM is the only place I know of that doesn't do reveals. Whats the purpose of that rule?

Open setup/no flips/personal contact.

I'm not sure exactly why, you'd have to ask someone who's much better than me. I kinda justify it by saying that words on a screen are only that - what people have decided they want you to see them say. Playing on video is a little harder. Granted on this site since most of you (I'm assuming) enjoy poker, so it'll be easier for you to hide facial expressions and body language. I tend to think those being evident and available give people on video mafia a leg up on just forum threads, hencewhy no flips.

It makes sense to me, because it's the only thing that I can think of that explains why winrates of wolves/village are parallel between forum and video.

We can probably adjust it a bit. We've played day start kinda games but they're much more similar to mashes than they are to the standard setups.

i say we play by the standard rules of DM (N0 kills, no reveals, 2kp til 2, etc) since we would be playing on DM.


no need to **** around with the format.

standard DM format allows for hoya's face to be placed prominently on your computer screen. you sure you want that?

depends on the status of his moustache

I'm fine with no flips but n0 kills are ******ed and always will be ******ed

in?

I think n0 kills are especially bad in a format like this where its not a game running with whoever shows up (and thus whoever is completely free), but rather people who are making sure they're available at a certain time for what amounts to an invite game. If you want to have a n0 kill then I would suggest randing the game a day early and having the kill in 24 hours ahead of time so whoever is killed n0 isn't forced to show up for the game then not even get to play.

it's OK, the wolves will obviously just have to burn the n0 on yours truly

Lol at a n0 kill, remove that and we're good

instead of n0 kills, just start it with 2 less(assuming 15 man game)

n0 benneh v

Kk. Can do this.

Also, the game size isn't limited. We'll just adjust the setup to what it would be on day 1 (assuming no n0) and all will be well.

We have premade setups up to around 25-26 people so we should be all gouda.

Under appreciated comment, imo

Ive only seen a few DM games but I think the answer is that village gets power roles in amounts that would be broken with flips.

I thought I'd hate no flips but having seen a few games it works ok in a live format. n0 kills are the dumbest thing ever though and def need to get got.

I have argued for this before but there are some stupid and loud people that disagree for virtually no tenable reason.

To maintain the balance of the setup(s) we use I say roll the game with 2 fewer people (humans) but include two 'ghosts' that can rand the town PRs that 'die' n0 (forced kills of the slots) and then just day start with everybody who signed up to play alive (just with the possibility that town prs are not alive at game start).

Maintain uncertainty around town!claims and keeps mafia!claims viable. Everybody gets to play at least a day phase.

that seems like the best possible solution to keeping the setup the same

why not just randomly pick two roles not to include in the game? I guess ghosts are cool too.

regarding flips:

we have played 'werewolf' setups in certain contexts, not really on DM. generally they've been for smaller groups as well - like 11ish players. these games typically require fewer mislynches to make up for the fact that there are true flips. it can work but it's trickier to do right and not really well suited for this (probably 15+ player) game.

I agree with manasi in that the setups we play are well balanced around uncertainty regarding flips. I think part of it is definitely the additional behavioral/vocal/visual cues available to read but also just the way voting is done in video as opposed to forum. It isn't deadline lynch where mafia can better position and continuously gauge a game/wagon. Votes are majority on one person at a time and are mostly simultaneous so bussing is less viable (in the typical DM setups)

Well that's pretty much what that is tbh. The ghost slots can be two VTs and you could start with 3 alive PRs but you don't know it (massclaims are boring anyway and would be way too viable if you knew all 3 roles were alive at the start every game)

Or the ghosts could both be PRs and the game is on hardmode for town.

I think it's just a bit more clear when explaining the setup to people. With ghosts that get killed you can always claim the setup is 3 maf, 2kp till 2, parity cop, nerfed medic, vigi n0 as the game is being rolled and before the ghosts are killed. If you just don't rand certain roles in you've gotta explain why there was no vigi to confused viewers at the end of a game when the setup supposedly included one (in effect the setup would be closed without the ghosts and that's less practical on twitch to viewers unfamiliar with mafia/werewolf)

Kind of a silly technicality but it's easier in a roundabout way.