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NL500 Zoom I want to fold a set NL500 Zoom I want to fold a set

10-01-2012 , 02:00 AM
Poker Stars $500.00 No Limit Hold'em - 6 players
DeucesCracked Poker Videos Hand History Converter

BTN: $1393.94
SB: $423.25
Hero (BB): $544.76
UTG: $568.35
MP: $923.84
CO: $235.76

Pre Flop: ($7.50) Hero is BB with 6 6
3 folds, BTN raises to $15, SB calls $12.50, Hero calls $10

Flop: ($45.00) T 6 9 (3 players)
SB checks, Hero bets $32.50, BTN calls $32.50, SB folds

Turn: ($110.00) J (2 players)
Hero bets $100.00, BTN raises to $265, Hero raises to $497.26, BTN calls $232.26

River: ($1104.52) 2 (2 players)


Opponent is 20/12/5. He folds 80% to cbets in single raised pots. I know this is a 3way pot where I lead but in general the fold to cbet stat should be a good indication of how light he 's continuing here.

I seem to be getting crushed here big time. I suppose I cannot get away from 2nd set. Should I even include 2p in this guy's range? It seems unlikely that he would raise the Turn after not raising the Flop with a hand like T9s (Unless he has JTs or J9s) after the Turn brings even more coordination.


Conservative/Normal
Equity Win Tie
MP2 21.10% 21.10% 0.00% 66
MP3 78.90% 78.90% 0.00% TT-99, 87s, AcKc, AcQc, KsQs, KcQc

Very Optimistic
Equity Win Tie
MP2 40.19% 40.19% 0.00% 66
MP3 59.81% 59.81% 0.00% TT-99, JTs, T9s, 87s, AcKc, AcQc, KcQc, Ac8c, Ac7c
NL500 Zoom I want to fold a set Quote
10-01-2012 , 06:31 AM
KQcc and 78, in that order, seems as descriped opps most likely holdings
NL500 Zoom I want to fold a set Quote
10-01-2012 , 06:50 AM
Yeah when he raises turn, you're crushed. I don't even know why you bet the turn (especially so big), since you're usually crushed by his calling range as well.
NL500 Zoom I want to fold a set Quote
10-01-2012 , 07:07 AM
Yep, I agree you're in terrible shape.

I think you also have to include Q8s (which is a double gutshot on the flop) in his range. Or do you think he's never opening that hand on the button?

Also, with this information (20/12, i.e. passive preflop + you leading into two players + he is in position + board) I would pretty much exclude 2pair from his range, even JT, definitely T9.

Last edited by Merlinius; 10-01-2012 at 07:13 AM.
NL500 Zoom I want to fold a set Quote
10-01-2012 , 10:06 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by oldjude
Yeah when he raises turn, you're crushed
I think I agree with this, although he might just be overplaying JT, J9 often too, and might not slowplay that often on the flop with flopped straights/sets.

Quote:
Originally Posted by oldjude
I don't even know why you bet the turn (especially so big), since you're usually crushed by his calling range as well.
Don't agree with this though, I think a player who seems weak (based on stats) is definitely calling with a lot of worse hands
NL500 Zoom I want to fold a set Quote
10-01-2012 , 02:57 PM
I like the flop lead and betting turn is obv fine but your sizing is too big, $82.50, as played, easy fold once he raises.
NL500 Zoom I want to fold a set Quote
10-02-2012 , 07:33 PM
Turn is all sorts of bad to 3b. Yes you should fold even middle set and fold quickly. I don't see a 20/12 ever raise this turn w worse and sometimes we're drawing to 1 out.
NL500 Zoom I want to fold a set Quote
10-02-2012 , 10:43 PM
Fold turn. WP
NL500 Zoom I want to fold a set Quote
10-03-2012 , 12:10 AM
wait what. you guys are all saying fold turn. really?

agree that you should bet smaller on turn though. i guess i actually understand a fold more because you did in fact bet so big, but if you made a normal turn bet i would not fold to a raise. i just wouldn't!
NL500 Zoom I want to fold a set Quote
10-03-2012 , 02:04 PM
why are we folding turn? If we put him on a straight we have implied odds to call as he is committed.
NL500 Zoom I want to fold a set Quote
10-03-2012 , 05:34 PM
Agree turnbet too big.
NL500 Zoom I want to fold a set Quote
10-05-2012 , 11:42 PM
agree with everyone that the turn bet is too big, and as played u can fold turn to raise.
NL500 Zoom I want to fold a set Quote
10-06-2012 , 04:37 AM
if he would have bet 70-80 on turn, everyone would say BET BIGGER TURN!!!
NL500 Zoom I want to fold a set Quote
10-06-2012 , 08:21 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by alexuuus
if he would have bet 70-80 on turn, everyone would say BET BIGGER TURN!!!
um, no.
NL500 Zoom I want to fold a set Quote
10-06-2012 , 11:09 AM
This is a ******ed question..... and i know this isnt the right place to ask this but 20/12/5?

Does this represent- VPIP/PFR/3bet ?
NL500 Zoom I want to fold a set Quote
10-06-2012 , 11:31 PM
the 5 is AF "agression factor"
which means hes very aggressive postflop
NL500 Zoom I want to fold a set Quote
10-07-2012 , 01:28 AM
i meant 3bet, not AF
NL500 Zoom I want to fold a set Quote
10-08-2012 , 11:10 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by oldjude
I don't even know why you bet the turn (especially so big), since you're usually crushed by his calling range as well.
This player type will definitely call turn with worse. He's tight, but he's also passive/cally. We can just bet small on turn and river and he will call with zillions of worse hands.
NL500 Zoom I want to fold a set Quote
10-11-2012 , 05:50 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by jchaannngggg
why are we folding turn? If we put him on a straight we have implied odds to call as he is committed.
No we don't... we only have £240ish left if we call turn and are left pot commited.
NL500 Zoom I want to fold a set Quote
10-11-2012 , 08:49 PM
I don't think you can fold the turn.

Villain could easily have AKc, KJ, AJ, TJ etc. Villain could also have KKs or QQs.

Additionally, as of the turn you still have some amount of equity to make a full house, even if you are absolutely certain that he has a straight already. I think calling the extra $165 for the pot of $465 on the turn, especially since there would be $232 behind still for implied odds, is reasonable. Shoving is probably better though, because of the possible flush/combo draws, and if villain has TJ or T9 he's the one drawing for a boat and most of your FH outs are dead.

When you bet the turn and villain raises, there is $465 in the pot and you've got $400 in your stack, sitting with a set on the turn. You could be beaten, but I don't think you can just automatically put villain on a straight. Now, if you had bet twice as big on the flop and villain had called, then I think it is much clearer villain has an overpair. Likewise, if you checked the flop, and villain checked behind, and then you get all this action, then I think it is an easier fold.

As played, the J is the worst card in the deck (Jc would be worse) but that doesn't guarantee he has the straight, and if behind you have ten outs unless you are drawing dead. TJ is at least as probable as KQ in this scenario, and KJ, QQs, QJ, etc, are all right there too.
NL500 Zoom I want to fold a set Quote

      
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