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Old 03-15-2017, 01:40 AM   #1
OneznTwo
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5/5 NL QQ post flop play? Suggestions?

Backdrop: 5/5 NL very loose game playing at a must move table where a third of the players at the table are fish who are there to gamble away their 60 bb buy in and keep reloading over and over...the game is ideal! 4 hrs later at the table I effectively triple my stack to 300 bb's and my confidence/ego starts to get stroked by a few hands I played including a $700+ pot I called down with a pair of tens on a A high wet board...then my name gets called to move to the main table...

I sit down and immediately see 5 of the better regulars on my left and on top of that my stack size is now avg or even slightly below avg at the table. I played 2 big hands 1 where I 3-bet AKo preflop then got check raised all in on a J high board and 1 where I flopped 2 pair AT bet raised flop and turn called river and lost to a backdoor flush but I've won a few smaller pots so my stack is now somewhere around 220-230 bbs.

Now I'm in the UTG+1 and I get dealt QdQh. UTG limps I raise to $40 respectively since the game is very loose preflop and I don't want to let too many players in. Tight older Asian man calls in the HJ, I suspect he's calling with something along the lines of 88, 99, AQs maybe even TT... folds to the button and he's a regular but the degen kind...from the few times I've played with him I noticed that he calls more than he bets, chases draws at bad odds, and he happened to suck out on me in the AT hand above so I put him on a super wide calling range after he makes the call, bb sb and UTG fold and now there are 3 of us going to the flop: 10s2h6s - I lead out and bet $90 into $135, HJ folds and button calls Immediately. The turn is an Ad and I check. The button quickly throws out $125 and looks down at the community cards...I call because his range is wide and I believe I've spotted a tell on him. The river is an 8s which I don't like at all so I checked and he quickly throws out $300 into a $565 pot but this time looks down but not at the cards and I go into the tank...the only hand I'm worried about beating me is a flush which potentially got there on the river because he's the type of player who would call a 8bb raise preflop with suited connectors so I ask him if he has a flush and he actually answers back "No do you?" in a nervous tone so now I'm not putting him on a flush anymore. I think a few seconds then flip my hand over to try and get some more info...his reaction didn't change and he looked down again but away from the community cards again so I called....what would you do in this spot?
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Old 03-15-2017, 01:44 AM   #2
bigd23
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Re: 5/5 NL QQ post flop play? Suggestions?

I think he flopped top pair and turned 2 pair on you... I think I would have folded.
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Old 03-15-2017, 05:26 PM   #3
OneznTwo
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Re: 5/5 NL QQ post flop play? Suggestions?

Outcome: Villan shows 9c7c for a gut shot straight completed on the river

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Old 03-16-2017, 02:26 PM   #4
Gordan Bombay
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Re: 5/5 NL QQ post flop play? Suggestions?

As played, I lean towards folding river. The majority of his range consists of sets, two pair, flush draws and the occasional​ Axss.

The ace on the turn hits your range more often than his, so I'm betting turn. This accomplishes two things. 1) It balances the times when you're cbetting your AK/AQ hands on the flop. 2) Gives a bad price for draws while likely still having the best hand.

If he calls turn, I'm check evaluating river.

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Old 03-16-2017, 03:24 PM   #5
OneznTwo
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Re: 5/5 NL QQ post flop play? Suggestions?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gordan Bombay View Post
As played, I lean towards folding river. The majority of his range consists of sets, two pair, flush draws and the occasional​ Axss.

The ace on the turn hits your range more often than his, so I'm betting turn. This accomplishes two things. 1) It balances the times when you're cbetting your AK/AQ hands on the flop. 2) Gives a bad price for draws while likely still having the best hand.

If he calls turn, I'm check evaluating river.

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Agreed...I think even a turn check-raise to $300-350 would've priced him out of chasing the range I put him on. Either way my mistake in this hand was not betting/raising the turn...

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Old 03-16-2017, 04:07 PM   #6
Gordan Bombay
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Re: 5/5 NL QQ post flop play? Suggestions?

Quote:
Originally Posted by OneznTwo View Post
Agreed...I think even a turn check-raise to $300-350 would've priced him out of chasing the range I put him on. Either way my mistake in this hand was not betting/raising the turn...

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Check raising the turn is not optimal because what do you do on the river if he calls? Shove a non spade river praying he doesn't have an ace? (If stacks were deep, this play may work but he could be trapping with a set or two pair) And if the river comes a spade, do you check/fold which is pretty exploitable leak.


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Old 03-16-2017, 07:47 PM   #7
OneznTwo
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Re: 5/5 NL QQ post flop play? Suggestions?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gordan Bombay View Post
Check raising the turn is not optimal because what do you do on the river if he calls? Shove a non spade river praying he doesn't have an ace? (If stacks were deep, this play may work but he could be trapping with a set or two pair) And if the river comes a spade, do you check/fold which is pretty exploitable leak.


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I think the same could be said for betting/getting called on the turn...what do you do when the spade falls on the river? You have no idea whether you're up against an A or a flush...

I feel check raising the turn would give you a better idea of where you're at in the hand versus betting and getting called...

What do you think?

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Old 03-16-2017, 09:45 PM   #8
Gordan Bombay
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Re: 5/5 NL QQ post flop play? Suggestions?

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Originally Posted by OneznTwo View Post
I think the same could be said for betting/getting called on the turn...what do you do when the spade falls on the river? You have no idea whether you're up against an A or a flush...

I feel check raising the turn would give you a better idea of where you're at in the hand versus betting and getting called...

What do you think?

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Betting turn will likely fold out hands like 77-99 and put j10-k10 in a tough decision. And if they do call on the turn with these hands, a check back is more likely on the river. And if they raise the turn, it's more info for you in your decision making.

Checking turn opens you up to players turning their hands into bluffs on both streets.

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Old 03-16-2017, 10:23 PM   #9
Gordan Bombay
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Re: 5/5 NL QQ post flop play? Suggestions?

If he calls turn. I'm check/evaluating river.

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