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Old 07-28-2012, 01:13 AM   #31
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Re: QQ in BB: Value Bet

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Originally Posted by AlanBostick View Post
Oaks 15-30. Villain is a not-very-good LAG. We have lots of history.

Villain opens in CO; BTN and SB fold; I call with QQ. 4.4 small bets in pot.

Flop: A 9 9

I check; villain checks behind. 2.2 bets in pot.

Turn: A99 5

I bet; villain calls. 4.2 bets in pot.

River: A995 3

I bet.
I'd play it 100% the same. But the fact that you're posting it makes me believe that that's the incorrect way???

Sure he could be slowplaying otf. I think he calls ott not only becuase yah he could have an A/9/dd but he could also have a <JJ and he's just doing pot control because he respects you and he's thinking "wtf me haz pair and it's HU" just wants to get to showdown cheaply. I think because of this I feel like I want to bet otr like you did to get value from this situation. I would definitely b/f otr though (not ott though).
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Old 07-28-2012, 03:15 AM   #32
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Re: QQ in BB: Value Bet

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Originally Posted by nonsimplesimon View Post
I'd play it 100% the same. But the fact that you're posting it makes me believe that that's the incorrect way???
I'm not sure how to take this.

I posted the hand because <orientation=results>I was surprised by how the river turned out,</orientation> and I wanted a line check.

I'm particularly happy with the feedback I'm getting here. Captain R's response was the best of the lot (modulo the brainfart about 99; just imagine he wrote TT):

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Originally Posted by Captain R View Post
I think when he checks behind this flop, he either has a monster or an airball. I mean, some guys will check back 99 or something, but not a whole lot. When we check the turn, we get more value out of his airballs and lose less to his monsters. And with the , we don't even risk anything, he's basically drawing dead with his airballs.
This is just the sort of response I was looking for. Thanks.

And, specifically to pgcounty and the others who want me to 3-bet preflop: I won't do so unless either (a) I have a specific read that the villain will go off for multiple bets HU preflop with less than the very best hands, e.g. someone who will reraise my three-bet with hands like AJ or KQ; or (b) I have a specific read that the villain simply is not a hand reader, and plays only the strength of their own hand without imagining mine.
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Old 07-28-2012, 02:13 PM   #33
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Re: QQ in BB: Value Bet

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Originally Posted by AlanBostick View Post
And, specifically to pgcounty and the others who want me to 3-bet preflop: I won't do so unless either (a) I have a specific read that the villain will go off for multiple bets HU preflop with less than the very best hands, e.g. someone who will reraise my three-bet with hands like AJ or KQ; or (b) I have a specific read that the villain simply is not a hand reader, and plays only the strength of their own hand without imagining mine.
Exploitation, not game theory, is the key to winning in live limit poker against all but the best opponents.

If I'm against someone who sometimes checks back flops, I think that makes it all the more important to re-raise pre- when I am ahead and out of position. You are missing value in favor of fancy play syndrome.
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Old 07-28-2012, 02:39 PM   #34
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Re: QQ in BB: Value Bet

My comment was out of respect for you.
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Old 07-29-2012, 06:48 PM   #35
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Re: QQ in BB: Value Bet

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Originally Posted by Villaribo View Post
I think we have tiny value vs bad lag on the river and we can check/call vs unfinished flash draw.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fzLtF_PxbYw&t=20s
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