Open Side Menu Go to the Top
Register
Commerce 40: I River a Pair Commerce 40: I River a Pair

03-06-2016 , 08:06 PM
EP player limps, unknown Asian raises, white TAG 3bets, terrible Indian LAG calls 3 cold, SB calls 2.5 cold, I call BB with J9ss. Everyone else calls. 6 ways 3 bets.

Flop 8T2ss. Checked around.

Turn 3d. Checked around.

River 9h. BB checks I lead.
Commerce 40: I River a Pair Quote
03-06-2016 , 08:17 PM
I check call 1 bet..
Commerce 40: I River a Pair Quote
03-06-2016 , 09:09 PM
I think river is solid value bet as played.

I want to bet the turn. If everyone folds, that's obviously great. If everyone calls, our bet goes in good because we have our share of equity 4 ways or possibly even 3 ways if any pair outs are good. If we get one or two callers, we don't realize immediate equity on the bet, but I do think we set ourselves up for a profitable river bluff on some rivers that don't improve us.
Commerce 40: I River a Pair Quote
03-06-2016 , 09:16 PM
I bet the turn also, as played I bet the river.

Last edited by chillrob; 03-06-2016 at 09:16 PM. Reason: (I fold preflop though)
Commerce 40: I River a Pair Quote
03-06-2016 , 09:35 PM
you have four to the straight flush? i'd donk the flop

as played bet turn yes
Commerce 40: I River a Pair Quote
03-06-2016 , 10:33 PM
I like a flop donk as well. I don't think a TAG auto c bets this flop. This is too strong of a draw to potentially miss so much value.

I like a turn bet. In addition to what has been said, I think you can clean up some outs by betting.

It feels like this should be a river check to me. We are the most likely to have hit our hand if we bet this river,so I'm not sure we get called as lightly as we would like. On the other hand, if we check, I think it's very possible someone will bet for value lightly or bluff given the action so far. We can cheaply get away from our hand if it goes bet and raise.
Commerce 40: I River a Pair Quote
03-07-2016 , 04:59 AM
Fold preflop
Commerce 40: I River a Pair Quote
03-08-2016 , 08:06 PM
I fold pre too but I call JTs and T9s and I'd probably call J9s 7-way too.

I'd donk the flop with an OESFD but c/r OESD+FD; the number of outs is the same but the probability of someone else getting the second best hand goes down.

Lead turn as played.
Commerce 40: I River a Pair Quote
03-08-2016 , 08:12 PM
never folding pre
Commerce 40: I River a Pair Quote
03-08-2016 , 08:25 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by BigBadBabar
you have four to the straight flush? i'd donk the flop

as played bet turn yes
Interesting.
I wonder do we cap pf TT ?
If not it means we would donk all our set i suppose and never c/r strong hands ?
Commerce 40: I River a Pair Quote
03-08-2016 , 11:13 PM
I used to donk flop with OESD + FD, sets, etc to try and bet 3 bet flop.

However, I started to c/r flop like I used to in past because our equity is so great that we can c/r 4 bet based on action. It also doesn't hurt to make someone with a flush redraw, better Jx fold on this flop since it can potentially give us dirty outs.

On turn, I also used to donk bet turn but started to c/r 100% of the hands I'm not chk folding as a default and has had had good results in the past 3 months.

Small sample and different players but I'd probably do above based on OP's reads on villains.

I'd chk call river as played to induce a bet.

Probably not folding preflop unless I had reads or could tell someone will back cap or cap pre.
Commerce 40: I River a Pair Quote
03-08-2016 , 11:31 PM
Calling pre flop seems super standard. I would call with worse.
Commerce 40: I River a Pair Quote
03-09-2016 , 01:36 AM
I like b/c against a lag. B/f against loose passives.
Commerce 40: I River a Pair Quote
03-09-2016 , 05:45 AM
I'm sure there is a correlation between calling being super standard and those who claim its impossible to win more than 1 BB/hr at a live mid stakes game
Commerce 40: I River a Pair Quote
03-09-2016 , 12:49 PM
I think pre-flop is very very close and certainly not 'standard'.

In the games I play I'll call in a 20 game but fold in a 40 game. The reason being people are mostly at least decent multiway post flop in a 40 game which makes the payoff somewhat minimized... As oppose to a soft 20 game, where we usually get charge less to draw and they payoff big when we hit.
Commerce 40: I River a Pair Quote
03-09-2016 , 06:53 PM
You'd have to pry J9s out of my fingers here pf. C/r flop. Bet turn. Bet river
Commerce 40: I River a Pair Quote
03-10-2016 , 01:05 AM
Donk flop with intention of 3betting

As played, donk turn and consider 3 betting.

As played, bet river.

Don't even consider folding pre.
Commerce 40: I River a Pair Quote
03-10-2016 , 03:23 PM
I feel like checking flop with intention to raise is good. I mean it's a multi way pot at commerce, I think it is pretty unlikely that it will check around, even though it did this time.

I also call preflop.
Commerce 40: I River a Pair Quote
03-11-2016 , 05:00 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by CrazyLond
I feel like checking flop with intention to raise is good. I mean it's a multi way pot at commerce, I think it is pretty unlikely that it will check around, even though it did this time.

I also call preflop.
We have different definitions of 'unlikely'

The next two guys will often check to raiser as well. I doubt raiser barrels anywhere close to 100% in a 6 way pot. I wouldn't count on the last coldcaller to bet with high frequency either.
Commerce 40: I River a Pair Quote
03-11-2016 , 10:27 AM
Preflop three better will bet a lot after 4 people check even if not 100%. Button lag will bet a ton when everyone checks. And others will donk sometimes. I think when you combine the percentages it is probably 90%+ that someone is going to bet.

Also in LA it seems like people jam the flop for very little reason in the games I've played. I would not be at all surprised to see preflop 3 better cbet this flop with AQ and then 3 bet our check raise. I haven't played there a ton but when I have, it seems like many regs have had these kind of tendencies.
Commerce 40: I River a Pair Quote

      
m