20/40

BB...just sat down..I remember him being TAG.

I open Qs9s on the Button, BB calls.

8c8s5d...I bet he calls.

8c8s5d6d...he checks..what's the plan?

I'm probably done with the hand unless I improve on the river.

I check it back, and continue firing w/ hands like J9

How are Q9 and 'hands like J9' different here? Just because of the added showdown value Q hi has?

I routinely get turn folds from firing another barrel in this situation. He may well be floating because he knows the 88 did not hit you.

It's not like say A 9 4 r where if he continues, he has a pair.

He has worse drawing odds on turn and will give up stuff like JT.

Basically. I know I'd peel this flop v. a BTN open with a Q-hi + BD. Something like a Q4cc, for one.

Against a nittier side of TAG that has less history against me, I might consider three barreling this.

check.

Does anyone see the merit of checking back on the flop? The board is hella dry, and it is at least as likely to have improved a defending BB's hand as it is ours. Maybe Q9s is too much of a hand to do so, but I'm checking back the weaker part of my range here.

As played, definitely check turn.

I think it depends on what flavor of TAG we are dealing with here. If he likes to attack the flop then I agree we should be checking back some flops. If he tends to wait for the turn then betting 100% seems correct. If he is on the tighter side of TAG, I think betting the turn makes sense to get him to fold better over cards.

What's the correct adjustment if you are the villain and playing against someone with a check/back range? Do we start 3 betting pre? I don't like calling pre and donking flop since that gives the opponent more opportunity to play perfectly post. I kind of like checking again on the turn with my whole range with a sprinkle of all three options at my disposal. The opponent will be compelled to bet any hand he feels needs protection and will be bluffing as well.

if i did have a check back range, a paired board would never be one where i'd use it.

My understanding is that against a villain who checks back on the flop more than occasionally the right countermeasure is to have a donking range for those flop textures where the villain is more likely to check back. This donking range needs of course to be balanced between value bets and bluffs.

Bear in mind that this is going to be an issue chiefly in situations where the opener is in late position, so that both the opener and the defender have fairly wide ranges to begin with. A UTG opener's range is going to be strong enough that they should be c-betting 100% of their range on any flop.

Can you explain why not?

you're getting 4.5:1 to take it down, and people fold so much on paired boards. if it doesn't work, you can see 2 more cards for the price of a SB.

Everything you've said here is false.

You need to post what coast you play on. East vs West coast is basically 2 different games.

Doh I totally agreed with you until you gave your reasoning.

Run some equity calcs of a steal range vs bb defense range on like 944r vs 865 two tone.

yeah, i'd say overall a steal range should be an equity favorite, which should be reason 1. i was thinking that in this case, Q9 is still a slight hot/cold favorite (haven't run anything so might be wrong), but wouldn't be able to withstand a lot of pressure. but thinking about it, there's a few defendable draws present, and i would discount a's and k's when i'm c/r'd, so maybe c-bet/call down brick runouts.