Two Plus Two Publishing LLC Two Plus Two Publishing LLC
 

Go Back   Two Plus Two Poker Forums > Limit Texas Hold'em > Medium Stakes Limit

Notices

Medium Stakes Limit Discussions of medium stakes limit Texas Hold'em

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 02-20-2012, 02:54 PM   #1
stranger
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Posts: 9
20/40 postflop decision

Standard 20/40 game at bay 101. I have been fairly active and have showdown a couple of non premium hands and have a pretty loose image. Villian (Utg) is new to the table and this is maybe his 4th or 5th hand.

Utg Limps and everybody folds to me. I raise QQ in the CO. Sb calls. Utg Calls

972rainbow.

Sb leads. Utg calls. I raise. Sb 3 bets. Utg now Caps. Hero should??

With this line is Utg's range sets? 10's, J's or the occasional 97 suited?

I hate calling but I am not sure folding is correct either.

Any information is always appreciated.
low92 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-20-2012, 02:58 PM   #2
veteran
 
pgcounty's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: utg+1
Posts: 2,564
Re: 20/40 postflop decision

Not folding just yet.

Weird hand.
pgcounty is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-20-2012, 03:23 PM   #3
Pooh-Bah
 
Nchabazam's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 4,377
Re: 20/40 postflop decision

Against someone straightforward you're probably up against a set. You don't know anything about this villain though, so I'm calling down barring any big action/terrible turns and rivers.
Nchabazam is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-20-2012, 03:25 PM   #4
centurion
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Solana Beach
Posts: 108
Re: 20/40 postflop decision

This seems like a reluctant call and evaluate the turn card and action. You are getting a locked in 8.5:1 on your call I beleive (4 bet cap there, right?) and in the very worst of situations you have 2 outs to the nuts on the turn against someone else's set, with very poor odds to call now but huge implied odds if you hit and an opponent holds a set. If you knew for sure that one of the two villains holds a set then it would be ok to fold. However, if you are up against 2 pair and a draw, you have 5 outs on the turn and 8 on the river if the turn card does not complete the draw. You are probably not ahead at the moment, but it is not impossible either.

UTG seems horrendous based on what little we know about him (limp UTG and backraise). He could very well have limped 22, 77, 97 suited or not, A9 or K9, some other suited nines, or even 10-8. He is not aware of your image, so I'm guessing his play is based primarily on the strength of his holdings and would guess that he is weighted towards a stronger made hand but that 10-8 is also a possible holding. There is some small chance he is just a maniac too and capped without good reason.

If you call, the turn action becomes very important. Either SB will remain the aggressor and you can fold to a bet and raise by BB. If SB checks and BB checks, this smells fishy and I would actually value check almost any turn card, although I am not sure that would be the best play. Others might disagree? Toughest situation is if SB checks and BB bets, then I'd need more info on how the SB plays and what the turn card is.
dankrems is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-20-2012, 03:43 PM   #5
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
AlanBostick's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: We're all Lebowskis on this bus
Posts: 8,627
Re: 20/40 postflop decision

Board is really dry. Do we think SB called pf with T8 and is jamming with pretty much the only draw?

UTG acted passively and then aggressively when the action came around again. That, in LOLive games, can be a sign of a monster, e.g. a flopped set. Then again, they might have a smallish pocket pair or maybe T9 and are spite-capping. And SB might have a hand like JJ or A9 and is jamming because "They" (i.e. you) "never have it on the flop."

I think we have to call here, especially given that the action is capped, but we should watch out on the turn; I don't want to pay multiple bets there -- unless we spike a Q, in which case the sky's the limit.
AlanBostick is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-20-2012, 04:55 PM   #6
California Elephant
 
BigBadBabar's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: CHASE QP, PAYPAL, AMAZON = UNSAFE!
Posts: 19,904
Re: 20/40 postflop decision

don't fold
BigBadBabar is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-20-2012, 07:39 PM   #7
stranger
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Posts: 9
Re: 20/40 postflop decision

Thanks for all of the input so far. If we call the flop what do we do if we dont improve and a blank (say a 3) falls on the turn.

If sb leads and utg raises I think it is a fold but what do we do if sb checks and utg raises. I would hate to be caught in the middle if sb decides to check raise.

It feels like calling the flop to fold the turn is a waste of 2 little bets as there is little to no chance of the turn being checked through.

Or if only one bet goes in on the turn what are we doing on a safe river. Are we calling down against 2 villians?
low92 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-20-2012, 08:32 PM   #8
centurion
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Solana Beach
Posts: 108
Re: 20/40 postflop decision

SB check and BB bet is definitely the toughest spot and very likely. I would expect it reasonably often, because if SB checks, BB probably bets 100% of his range. Is it a raise or fold spot? I think so but am not sure. Both seem flawed, and calling does too. I think this is an interesting spot for sure. What do the 5000+ post folks think?
dankrems is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-20-2012, 08:34 PM   #9
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
Joe Tall's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: at JoeTall
Posts: 15,689
Re: 20/40 postflop decision

There are all sorts of gutter-over (JT, J8), and OESD combinations (T8, 86) that you are ahead and two pair combos you have outs against, so you cannot fold. Live limps UTG do contain pairs, but usually not as high as 99, all these hands will whip-saw, especially the combos that include three flushes.
Joe Tall is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-21-2012, 08:48 AM   #10
grinder
 
...one...'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: my own private hell
Posts: 435
Re: 20/40 postflop decision

i wouldnt fold here....
UTG prob has a pair under ur Qs
the sb is scary here as well tho,dont discount their 3bet??
sb range more likely to have hands that beat u now,while UTGs range
has more overpp that are under ur QQ and drawing hands...
...one... is offline   Reply With Quote

Reply
      

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off




All times are GMT -4. The time now is 06:25 AM.


Powered by vBulletin®
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO 3.6.0 ©2011, Crawlability, Inc.
Copyright 2008-2010, Two Plus Two Interactive