Thoughts?

Baby don't hurt me...don't hurt me no more

He's right. As long as you look for happiness/love in something outside of yourself then unless that person/thing does everything in the world that you want to make you happy(which obv isn't possible) there will be a need to control them. Many people are looking for a love that is more of an approval...someone to tell them how great they are as a confirmation to something they aren't actually sure of themselves.

It sounds cliche but to be able to love someone else you need to learn how to love yourself first which most people have a hard enough time with. As of now our current idea behind what "true love" is for most people is society's model which is....love through monogamous ownership. You find that person that will "make you happy forever" and you lock them down so you can attempt to keep them around and have them make you happy until one of you die. The problem with that is no one else other than you can ever make you truly happy. You are the only person that knows what goes through your head 24/7...even when you're married it's unlikely the other person even knows 50% of the things you think about in life...how can anyone expect this other person who doesn't even really know them to make them happy?

Then you have the other side of things....the other person. In attempting to use them to make you happy, are you making this other person unhappy? Codependency is not love. If the other person cheats on you do you still love them.....no.....well then it wasn't true unconditional love to begin with....it was controlling, do what pleases me and I'll love you until you stop kind of love.

Sartre wasn't into s&m. That means he was a silly person.

He also spelled his name weird.

love = a threshold for thinking a person would make an excellent parent to your offspring

Very narrow. Basis is then the whole procreation thingy. Love is much worse than that.

I am intrigued by old philosophies that talk about love as a sort of alternative to objective knowledge, or as the means of knowing not a "what" but a "who". Knowledge of the subject as a subject, and not as an object.

This is more RGT thread fodder, but this beer makes me bold :P

it's built upon situational outcomes and traits that have little relation to procreation, though. it's a complex, mostly unconscious process that gives little meaning to the definition of "love", but when examined bit-by-bit is an extremely thorough crash course on evolution.

The Greeks drank wine.


Symposium, By Plato, Written 360 B.C.E

Translated by Benjamin Jowett

Link to text: http://classics.mit.edu/Plato/symposium.html

Perhaps this is what you may have been referring too. In any case, it is an excellent read. And no, love is not just exclusive RGT thread fodder.

Love is a many splendored thing.

We need our poet laureate for this

(until the real poet comes - i only have 2 poems i ever wrote, but they were for their eyes only)





There are many kinds of love. Romantic love is only one of them, but it will remain forever the purest, comparing well only with the best of all other forms and often preparing you for them.


(brunette)
Love is when at age 9 you dont mind that she is hitting you, pulling your hair, exploring you with her nails and then later far with her girlfriends, playing in the distance, she doesnt even care you exist, yet as you finally give up, leaving to go home after school, you catch her turn her eyes at you, as if she was always there knowing everything...


(blonde)
Love is when you run for class president in the 1st year of high school, age 12, and you lose by one vote because you voted for her, since after all, what good is it to vote for yourself, the character of a man is revealed by what he does when nobody is watching...

(redhead)
Love is when at age 14 you walk with her and other male friends, the only girl in the company, and that wild flower in the unfinished home next door looks so pretty and inviting, destined for her, and as you jump the fence to get it, the last thing in the world in your mind is the muddy water puddle, workers left behind the bushes, waiting to embrace your clothes and make you look so ridiculous as you finally emerge with the present, immersed in misery...but victorious.

(brunette)
Love is when your best friends-classmates with their families randomly arrive at the graduation party, age 18, in your home, and you welcome them one by one, but suddenly you dont care anymore for any of this, because the ugly, shy, good family girl that has unsuccessfully, frustratingly chased you in grades for years, only to see you break one record after another, is finally there in the front door, 17 going for 18 and finally so beautiful, confidently winning that one last battle, the only one that ever counted, because your heart is pumping fast, accelerating as the nearness of her becomes the ultimate torturous gift.

(Blonde)
Love is when you unwillingly wake up at 6am, age 20, to catch the train and go to a university lecture on meteorology at 8.30am, 25 km away, and its all so terribly unmotivating until you remember she has the same class that day. And as you watch hours later the professor go over all the pressure, temperature equations and the Coriolis effect, all you can think is the seasons of her face. As you steal looks at her constantly you are fully aware that she knows everything and is so charmingly inviting, enigmatically confident and playful, in total control as she smiles at you, so infrequently, but often enough to torture you, give you hope and then take it away, daring you to finally make that first move.

(Brunette online, brave new world, meeting on the reverse, first brains, then in person)
Love is a wild colors sunrise crossing bay bridge on the way home, age 27, after having spent all night talking to her, at her home in Berkeley, where you finally met her, now tired and exhausted, sleepless for 24 hours and yet ready to conquer the world because the next date is later that night...as another 100km drive awaits you.

Real men do not confuse sex with romantic love. In the end the second is always the most satisfying experience because it has everything. Absolute confidence and adoration for the universe that makes it all possible is at the core of the experience, whispering you all is going to be great...

Love is when years later they are all so far away, now only memories, married women with kids, without you next to them, building the only real love most people search for, the one that grows with every day when lucky, the one you missed because you kept running all your life from one place to another, chasing another lover (Physics?), the only secure lover that will never betray you, the one that only you could betray. Love is still what you feel for each one of them, for they have made you who you are, as you can hope they have found what your hard selfish path couldn't afford...



---

Music industry tried often to describe it too. Then became part of our lives and sometimes those of our parents too.








Can true love really be gone?

I had a love poem published about 10 yrs ago.
Won the International Poet Of The Year Award for it... but it was from Poetry.com so I'm not sure it counts.
Might dig it out sometime and take your collective breath away

This is a hindu view on love vs attachment which most people mistake for love



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FmbwXpqlCII

I couldn't get through the self-important aggrandizing opening credits.

Did it eventually get to the bits about Kama and prema?

eventually youtube will create a way to FF and RW and skip around to whatever time in the video that you want, until then....

I have a fairly strict "I'm not watching youtube videos for any reason" policy most of the time, but I made myself get through most of it

It's almost certain that the idea I was talking about is one which I've run into in the context of hinduism and eastern philosophy, and while I'm also familiar with the idea of non-attachment or dispassion, I don't think it is directly related to what I was saying. Although of course I was vague. I haven't managed to go and find any useful references. Google wasn't very helpful and I don't remember anything.

I have those magical powers. At what point is there an actual discussion in the video about Kama and preva?

I get a general sense of what you're saying but you would have to be more specific then.

He is talking about love as a state of being rather than a thought in our head which is typically related to attachment, infatuation, attraction, etc... which sees the other person/thing as an object.

Love isn't something you give away, or take....it's a state of being and all your actions derive from that state of being. The concept of this is that when your state of being is love, that's what you are, it's an experience that you have.

So in saying that, 2 examples would be.

1) Bob only feels love for other people when they are nice to him and loving to him. If someone is nice to him he feels great and is loving back. If someone is nasty to him he gets bitter, angry, vengeful, etc and those feelings become his state of being and his actions derive from that.

2) Mike feels love for all other people and all things no matter what happens around him or what anyone does to him. He doesn't see the faults in other people or mistakes they make along the way bc he understands what being a human being is like and knows life is hard at times and the decisions people make are the ones they believe are best for them at the time given the information they have and their awareness of life around them. Sometimes they make decisions that hurt other people as well as themselves, Mike doesn't hate people or get angry with them for this, he sees them doing the same silly things he used to do and feels love and compassion for them on their journey through this life and often time tries to help them along the way. If someone he tries to help tells him to "**** off" he doesn't take it personally, he realizes that the other person has painful thoughts and emotions within himself that he lets control him, again he feels compassion. This is true unconditional love, the actions that arise from this aren't concerned w/ any benefit for oneself or the ego.


This is the idea/concept you're talking about or no?

You can find this in hinduism for sure, in many religions at their very core, the teachings of Jesus, ancient Toltec wisdom

After the self-important aggrandizing opening credits.

The title is Attachment(Kama) vs Love(Prema).

If the video states that Kama is attachment and prema is love then it has nothing to do with Hinduism at all.

It doesn't state these things, I am drawing a connection for you based on the title as to what the context of the video is. You have spent 3 posts talking about a video you claim to not be able to watch more than 20 seconds of. I know you enjoy trolling but if you aren't going to watch the video and just want to nitpick at using words to discuss the concept of ideas thats perfectly fine but you should start a new thread discussing the drawbacks of language as a means of communicating ideas.


Definitions straight from wiki:


Kāma (Sanskrit, Pali; Devanagari: काम) means desire, wish, longing in Indian literature.[3] Kāma often connotes sexual desire and longing in contemporary literature, but the concept more broadly refers to any desire, wish, passion, longing, pleasure of the senses, the aesthetic enjoyment of life, affection, or love, with or without sexual connotations.[4][5]

Kāma is one of the four goals of human life in Hindu traditions.[2] It is considered an essential and healthy goal of human life when pursued without sacrificing the other three goals: Dharma (virtuous, proper, moral life), Artha (material prosperity, income security, means of life) and Moksha (liberation, release, self-actualization).[6][7] Together, these four aims of life are called Puruṣārtha.[8]



In Hinduism, in contrast to kāma, which is selfish, or pleasurable love, prema – or prem – refers to elevated love. Karuna is compassion and mercy, which impels one to help reduce the suffering of others. Bhakti is a Sanskrit term, meaning "loving devotion to the supreme God". A person who practices bhakti is called a bhakta. Hindu writers, theologians, and philosophers have distinguished nine forms of bhakti, which can be found in the Bhagavata Purana and works by Tulsidas. The philosophical work Narada Bhakti Sutras, written by an unknown author (presumed to be Narada), distinguishes eleven forms of love.

Tell me start points and stop points to watch on the video.

This isn't complicated.

Would you like me to schedule the rest of your life for you as well? I posted a video that in it's entirety discusses the ideas behind Love/Life vs Attachment(mind generated desire). You couldn't seem to make it past a 20 second intro to get to the context of a 12 min video...you have now spent the last 30 mins asking questions about something that had you put more than 20 seconds into you would have saved 18 mins....if that isn't complicating the whole thing then idk what is. Seems like you are aiming to do things in either the least efficient way possible or are trolling.

Regardless, FF to 20 seconds in then watch the whole video

Zeno? Need a ruling here.

Sincerest apologies.