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Old 02-10-2017, 07:17 AM   #51
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Re: The politarding thread of SMP, for really really really sorting things out

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Originally Posted by plaaynde View Post
Apparently there's a lot to discuss. I'd wish it would be unnecessary, but it apparently isn't.

This may be the birth pain of real globalization. Giving birth shouldn't be that painful nowadays.
Sure. I would love to hear your view on why the world should be handled your way and not a different way.
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Old 02-10-2017, 07:23 AM   #52
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Re: The politarding thread of SMP, for really really really sorting things out

I just "know".

The civilized way. Not by demagogues that make you puke.
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Old 02-10-2017, 07:41 AM   #53
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Re: The politarding thread of SMP, for really really really sorting things out

There are two ways to win in modern politics:

- Be so corrupt that the whole political machinery of a particular party is behind you, as well as being favored by large numbers of donors/special interests such that you have the money to fund a campaign.
- Be a demagogue

Of the two, you find the second pukeworthy. I find that curious.

Isn't the whole idea of politics that you appeal to popular prejudices and emotions? Has an outsider ever won in the age of mass media, not doing that?
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Old 02-10-2017, 07:53 AM   #54
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Re: The politarding thread of SMP, for really really really sorting things out

I'd also add the modern view of what is and isn't ok is really quite weird. Many great people with big hearts are quite vicious. Pulitzer, a great man, was a mad Hungrian Jew who yelled and ranted at people and abused all manner of folk. He would be fired in no time in the modern age. But he made the world a better place by his angry passion shining a great light on injustice and corruption.

Angry inappropriate passions are not a bad thing. The "gotcha!!!!" media age has made them a liability, but Trump has put an end to that by beating them at their own game. They've gone hysterical in response at the loss of their own power and credibility, claiming he's Hitler - a claim which is just proving him right.

If you want your leaders to be sanitized on-message all-focus-grouped sound bites, then great, but you're creating a world where we have hopeless people in charge, with little energy, talent, intellectual depth, or ability for creative destruction. Clinton is a deeply incompetent person who doesn't understand people. She is nasty and arrogant and has a long history of failure at getting people to work together to achieve aims. Obama was a professor with no realpolitik grasp of the world. Both very bright, both suitable for all kinds of positions, but not CEO material and not material to deal with the dangerous self-interested actors in the world.

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Old 02-10-2017, 09:10 AM   #55
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Re: The politarding thread of SMP, for really really really sorting things out

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Donald, "The Mouth" Trump,
Lol, best comment I read all year, just like Ventura in a lot of respects.
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Old 02-10-2017, 10:09 AM   #56
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Re: The politarding thread of SMP, for really really really sorting things out

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Originally Posted by plaaynde View Post
I just "know".

The civilized way. Not by demagogues that make you puke.
By the way I wish you'd elaborate. My comments are merely to poke you to elaborate. I want to hear what intelligent people think and why.

One of the great things about have a LC politics here in SMP is that actually intelligent (and non insane) people can contribute.
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Old 02-10-2017, 10:24 AM   #57
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Re: The politarding thread of SMP, for really really really sorting things out

Thanks, hoping to meet the expectations. Maybe my smartest move is not visiting this thread too often

Feel I don't have that much to sort out on this front. I have tried to turn to science and a healthy life, waiting this hell out.

This is a disgrace for humanity, you need to protect yourself, will try to find my way. Luckily I had astronomical observation dormant, really getting into it now. It will not fail you, as long as you have eyes and a brain. Next time it's clear I WILL spot Uranus. And by that I DON'T mean Ur anus.

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Old 02-10-2017, 10:43 AM   #58
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Re: The politarding thread of SMP, for really really really sorting things out

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The system of checks and balances with the courts works, as long as the court follows the law. Which the Washington judge clearly did not do. Instead, he got all worked up over the President's motivation, which he disagreed with, whereas the law says it's at the President's discretion.

Is the POTUS narcissistic? Sure, but I don't care. We're not going to be best buds, he's not going to help me move, we're not hanging out watching the game on tv. All I care about is what he does, which so far has been stellar for the most part.
The problem with Trump is that's he's incompetent and its largely self defeating to support him, which is why you only see unintelligent people doing so. Lets say you think the travel ban is important for national security. Any other nominee of a major party in the last 50 years could have simply written the order properly and had it reviewed by the justice and state departments to make it a slam dunk wrt to constitutionality. Nobody really doubts that the President has the power to do what Trump is trying to do.

But Instead Trump signed something so broad and poorly written that even the administration didn't understand it. The Obama administration already did the something very similar on delaying visas from specific countries due to national security concerns, but just did it competently.

If you believe Trump at his word on the necessity of the travel ban you also have to believe that he is endangering American lives by being an idiot and not knowing the basics of how to do his job.

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Old 02-10-2017, 11:21 AM   #59
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Re: The politarding thread of SMP, for really really really sorting things out

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The system of checks and balances with the courts works, as long as the court follows the law. Which the Washington judge clearly did not do. Instead, he got all worked up over the President's motivation, which he disagreed with, whereas the law says it's at the President's discretion.
And fyi the motivation of a law/order is relevant to whether it is legal or not. North Carolina's voter ID law was overturned even though voter ID laws are constitutional largely because it was shown that the intent of the lawmakers was to decrease legitimate minority voter turnout and not to prevent voter fraud
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Old 02-10-2017, 11:42 AM   #60
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Re: The politarding thread of SMP, for really really really sorting things out

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The problem with Trump is that's he's incompetent and its largely self defeating to support him, which is why you only see unintelligent people doing so.
Let's start here. The bolded is a false statement. Can you acknowledge that?

Quote:
Lets say you think the travel ban is important for national security. Any other nominee of a major party in the last 50 years could have simply written the order properly and had it reviewed by the justice and state departments to make it a slam dunk wrt to constitutionality.
This is a false implication. It was reviewed by the justice department. In fact, they crafted it, then reviewed it for legality, and it was given the all-clear (I don't know the facts on the state department).

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Nobody really doubts that the President has the power to do what Trump is trying to do.
Right. The president has wide and clear powers here. So you agree that the court has overstepped its bounds here? In the ruling, they talk about the threat. But that is an executive call - not one of the courts. If the president wants to do something completely irrational like ban people with blue dyed hair because he thinks they're a threat to national security, he has that power. The constitution gives him that power. The courts have to respect the constitution. In this case, they haven't.

Even more ridiculous in the court's ruling is saying that states have standing to sue because it affects public universities and hence state revenue. That is frankly insane.
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The Obama administration already did the something very similar on delaying visas from specific countries due to national security concerns, but just did it competently.
The reason they had to do it in the first place is because the vetting was so incompetent that terrorists got in. Intelligence services - which are very talented and have massive surveillance abilities - discovered them well in the planning stages. So it was Obama's incompetence in the first place that almost got a bunch of Americans killed. They then tightened up vetting considerably.

If you think about it - if you actually use your brain and reason it out - Obama's travel ban from Iraq is as nasty as Trump's. It was a far safer time, before the rise of ISIS and the failure of most Middle Eastern state. And the trigger was 2 people out of 100,000. There is no logical or moral difference between the orders on this key point, when the very existence of Obama's order depended solely on the luck of two particular actors deciding they wanted to cause trouble.

There is this bizarre notion, common among politicians, that you don't do something until something terrible happens. That you don't proactively manage risk apart from what intelligence services do (illegally) behind the scenes. That is frankly insane. Trump is taking the opposite approach - cut of all the threat he can while procedures are reviewed and strengthened, and do it immediately and without forewarning to stall any bad actors coming at the last minute. That is within this decision making power to do. The courts are explicitly second guessing him here, which they don't have the constitutional power to do.

Quote:
If you believe Trump at his word on the necessity of the travel ban you also have to believe that he is endangering American lives by being an idiot and not knowing the basics of how to do his job.
Or perhaps he relied on the court, you know, doing their job and following the constitution? Similarly, he relied on the justice department experts who gave it the all clear. He's not a lawyer and received advice from his expert department. What else is he supposed to do?

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Old 02-10-2017, 12:12 PM   #61
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Re: The politarding thread of SMP, for really really really sorting things out

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Much of what you read about Trump is fake news. Quite a bit of leaked by Trump himself. The "experts" you quote are just people asked for their opinion on what the media presents as fact. Again, you have no clue whatsoever whether anything you're presenting here is true.

The media is broken. They sensationally report anything ridiculous they can about the president, because it plays to the hysterical, fact-free perception they created and gets ratings. There are hundreds of examples. I posted a list of a tiny fraction of pure fake news articles by the core of the mainstream media, who are recklessly irresponsible.

Let me give you another example. During the election there was much made of how Trump didn't have much of a political organization/ground game/data operation. He was presented by the media as a guy who thought rallies would fix everything up, who kind of bumbled along, while Clinton had a massive Big Data operation with the cutting edge in political science. The narrative of Trump as a bumbling idiot trying to do things the old way and not really having clue was widely played. It also fed the perception that Clinton would win.

That was all fake news. Trump actually encouraged this perception of himself through well placed leaks and manipulation and public statements. In reality, behind the scenes, this was happening:

Why Big Data Wasn't Trump's Achilles Heel After All



Trump actually had Hillary crushed on the use of analytics and big data, which is one reason he won.

Nothing you read about Trump in the media is real. It's all a fictional creation, much of it leaked by Trump himself. I assure you they're having a grand old time leaking stories about Trump in his bathrobes, watching "the shows", about Bannon controlling things, and so much more. The plebs and media eat it up and take it as reality, but it's just a nonsense sideshow. Trump's been doing it for years and it's how he got the presidency as an outsider with no political experience and far less money. Amazingly, people still haven't woken up to just how smart he is.

In my opinion, if you think Trump has nefarious aims, you should be terrified. He's not the bumbling idiot he's presenting himself as via well placed leaks.

I'm not worried at all because it's obvious he's a very good person, and highly competent.
Here's my problem with your thought process. You are using extremely motivated reasoning. We all do to some degree, but few seem to fight against their own confirmation biases. Is there fake news in the MSM, sure. Is it all or even mostly fake, there's no reason to believe that. Is Drudge, Breitbart etc all fake, no. There are no news sources completely free of bias, and there is good and bad journalism everywhere. We just have to be vigilant and try to think reasonably about politics. I accuse you of neither.
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Old 02-10-2017, 12:24 PM   #62
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Re: The politarding thread of SMP, for really really really sorting things out

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Here's my problem with your thought process. You are using extremely motivated reasoning.
Maybe I am, maybe I'm not. I don't think you've established that.
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We all do to some degree, but few seem to fight against their own confirmation biases....There are no news sources completely free of bias, and there is good and bad journalism everywhere. We just have to be vigilant and try to think reasonably about politics. I accuse you of neither.
What I'm doing is presenting a counterpoint to what I see as unhinged hysteria. Have a read of these:
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the guy is a narcissistic scam artist who looks ripe to become a real monster with power.
There is zero evidence of that. This is as insane and fearful and credible as the "Obama is a secret Muslim" fear of some conservatives. Possibly less.

He's been in business for 40+ years. Has tons of well regarded friends and a good family, including many strong women. This is the opposite of a monster.
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Originally Posted by FoldnDark View Post
This guy thinks they won't be strong enough, and that he can easily go around them: https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine...ocracy/513872/

He believes the "court of public opinion" is where Trump can be checked, or else he may build an authoritarian regime. If he can continue sewing discord within our society and widening the already large divide between the right an left wings, he can use that to increase his power and we might be Hungary soon.
This is more of the same. I contend that my view of Trump is more reasonable than yours, and more evidence based. You seem extremely irrationally fearful.
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Old 02-10-2017, 01:09 PM   #63
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Re: The politarding thread of SMP, for really really really sorting things out

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Maybe I am, maybe I'm not. I don't think you've established that.

What I'm doing is presenting a counterpoint to what I see as unhinged hysteria. Have a read of these:

There is zero evidence of that. This is as insane and fearful and credible as the "Obama is a secret Muslim" fear of some conservatives. Possibly less.

He's been in business for 40+ years. Has tons of well regarded friends and a good family, including many strong women. This is the opposite of a monster.

This is more of the same. I contend that my view of Trump is more reasonable than yours, and more evidence based. You seem extremely irrationally fearful.
You've acknowledged that he is a scam artist, and are somehow caiming that is a good thing! You think it's brilliant because he's on your side, but how can you possibly trust a scam artist not to lie to you?

He has also advocated "opening up libel laws" to go after the press, so he clearly has little respect for free speech. I can't tell if Zeno is doing roll play, but lying to the public and abusing free speech (free speech for me, but not for thee) are not good traits for a the leader of a liberal democracy. There are many more signs this guy is unqualified to run this country, those are only the highlights.

Btw, you know he was the leader of the birther movement, right? He's one of the main proponents of the "Obama is a secret Muslim" nonsense. Wtf man??
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Old 02-10-2017, 02:07 PM   #64
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Re: The politarding thread of SMP, for really really really sorting things out

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If the president wants to do something completely irrational like ban people with blue dyed hair because he thinks they're a threat to national security, he has that power. The constitution gives him that power. The courts have to respect the constitution. In this case, they haven't.
Totally wrong. There is a burden on the president to show a "rational basis" for national security concerns and execution in a manner consistent with the constitution. Amazing that people are ignorant/dumb enough NOT to know this and somehow still have an opinion on this court ruling. Its not fair to think all or even most Trump supporters think something this wrong, but its pretty illustrative to level they are on imo.

Quote:
Or perhaps he relied on the court, you know, doing their job and following the constitution? Similarly, he relied on the justice department experts who gave it the all clear. He's not a lawyer and received advice from his expert department. What else is he supposed to do?
I'd give him similar advice to what I would give you. Sit down and learn the basics, ask alot of questions etc because you don't have a clue what you're talking about/doing.

For Trump specifically, I'd say do what Alan Dershowitz and others have recommended and scrap this order and sign a much clearer version. The fact that white house council had to come out and say that legal permanent residents are allowed back in after they were initially not allowed proves the order sucks as written. Not even the people who wrote it understand what it is saying. Fire/demote the people that wrote the order and advised him to sign it. Trump isn't an expert, but he doesn't have to be a lawyer (or even all that bright) to ask "hey, what about green card holders?" before signing it, so he shares a ton of the blame for how poorly this was done.

Like I said, it isn't hard for the president to do exactly what Trump is trying to do, its just that he, and his top advisors are so incompetent they can't do it properly. Its not a coincidence that the people who agree with Trumps politics enough to work for him are too dumb to implement his policies. Could be the saving grace for the next 4 years.

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Old 02-10-2017, 02:43 PM   #65
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Re: The politarding thread of SMP, for really really really sorting things out

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Totally wrong. There is a burden on the president to show a "rational basis" for national security concerns and execution in a manner consistent with the constitution. Amazing that people are ignorant/dumb enough NOT to know this and somehow still have an opinion on this court ruling.
This is an immigration decision by the president, under which he has wide powers, not a national security one.

The plenary power that the President has here is a strong one. He is well within his rights - thanks to this:
Quote:
(f) Suspension of entry or imposition of restrictions by President

Whenever the President finds that the entry of any aliens or of any class of aliens into the United States would be detrimental to the interests of the United States, he may by proclamation, and for such period as he shall deem necessary, suspend the entry of all aliens or any class of aliens as immigrants or nonimmigrants, or impose on the entry of aliens any restrictions he may deem to be appropriate.
to do what he has - and much far beyond it. You will see this when the case goes to the Supreme Court. I'll wait for apology and admission of your own ignorance then.

The courts are defying the president, Congress (decades of them), and the Constitution here. This has been a worrying trend lately, the unconstitutional power grab of lower courts. The higher courts usually correct them. The ruling is absurd. As just one example, the rationale behind the standing of the state to sue - because they have students at state universities from which they get revenues - is absurd, a momentous overreach (it would make any state able to sue any president for nearly anything without standing), and will be reprimanded by a higher court.
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Originally Posted by ecriture d'adulte View Post
Amazing that people are ignorant/dumb enough NOT to know this and somehow still have an opinion on this court ruling.
Indeed. Physician, heal thyself.
Quote:
Its not fair to think all or even most Trump supporters think something this wrong, but its pretty illustrative to level they are on imo.
This comment is pretty illustrative of your bias and partisan bigotry. I noticed you ignore this:
Quote:
Quote:
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The problem with Trump is that's he's incompetent and its largely self defeating to support him, which is why you only see unintelligent people doing so.
Let's start here. The bolded is a false statement. Can you acknowledge that?
You made a false claim claim here, that only unintelligent people support Trump. I note that you have chosen to not back away from this false claim.

I'll throw this back at you: only unintelligent bigots would make a statement as wrong as you have made above, and stand by it when challenged.
Quote:
I'd give him similar advice to what I would give you. Sit down and learn the basics, ask alot of questions etc because you don't have a clue what you're talking about/doing.
Your arrogance is amusing, but out of place. People who do know have advised the president and said it is 100% legal.

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Old 02-10-2017, 05:19 PM   #66
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Re: The politarding thread of SMP, for really really really sorting things out

I am sorry to see ToothSayer that it appears you have a very simplistic understanding of the Syrian civil war or the situation in Libya. Of course this is precisely the problem with most Trump supporters. They look for quick fix "explanations" on things that of course should fit their agenda that is not anything other than insulting the other side typically. The problems is that precisely such quick simplistic thinking creates these problems.

First of all Obama didn't start the bs in the Middle East. That is predominantly Bush administration in combination with the people pro and against Saddam in Iraq and the way the Shia dominated government later pushed away the Sunnis for years and lets not forget the other local tyrants that have suppressed these people for decades who lead with terror their subjects and refused to adapt to changing times and offer more rights.

Obama didnt fund ISIS. It is very possible also that Assad himself helped it begin in order to appear as the moderate option, the less evil choice. And of course the origins of it are in Iraq and the way the post Saddam era was "designed".

By all means do not for a moment consider that we are in all this because of the eternal conflicts within Islam or that Assad could have provided some reasonably better governing or that the Iraqis could have formed a government for all the people or defended their country better a few years back instead of abandoning posts or asked for US help when it was necessary.

The bloody truth here is that the blame is with all the morons that do not think like Obama ie in a much more reasonable rational manner with longer term vision. That of course doesnt mean that Obama and others cant be improved also much further. But its day and night in difference.

The only problem i had with Obama regarding ISIS is the delay in acting strongly against it and the inability to frame this as a cultural war against barbarians with the civilized world united against them in a massive international alliance that would enter Syria and take out also Assad. But he didnt get us into this mess. People like Bush and Trump (in the way of thinking) and others supporting the war in Iraq and those that were not standing up against them (like also Clinton at that early point) took us here in combination of course with all the ahole actors in Middle East and their stupid way of handling conflicts.

At the end of the day when all the terror has taken place the people in Syria, Iraq and Libya will move on and create a better future and ISIS will be a memory. But we will not get there with a US that has simplistic thinking leadership that wishes to give the world the finger instead of a better example for their youth that is the only permanent way this will be won. A better example, a viable new paradigm in treating each other, a rational approach, the coming together of good people to address the needs of all sides will win this.
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Old 02-10-2017, 05:28 PM   #67
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Re: The politarding thread of SMP, for really really really sorting things out

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This is an immigration decision by the president, under which he has wide powers, not a national security one.

The plenary power that the President has here is a strong one. He is well within his rights - thanks to this:

to do what he has - and much far beyond it. You will see this when the case goes to the Supreme Court. I'll wait for apology and admission of your own ignorance then.
Man....you aren't even following the basics of the conversation, let alone the subject matter. If the supreme court upholds the ban, it will prove my point.

Quote:
The overwhelming weight of history and the law is on his side. The president does have the authority to ban the entry of foreigners, as long as he has what is called a “rational basis” to believe they pose a threat to the nation’s security.
http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2017/...ation-ban.html

You are claiming he doesn't even need a rational basis and that is what I said is totally wrong. I don't see any point in continuing if you don't accept pretty simple facts like that.
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Old 02-10-2017, 06:04 PM   #68
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Re: The politarding thread of SMP, for really really really sorting things out

Exactly why is it so difficult to make it harder for only certain individuals from these countries taking care of all the other easy to spot very close to innocent/neutral 100% people that do business regularly?

I mean filter anyone that comes in (as it is happening anyway) and be more vigilant in monitoring the foreigners in your country without doing unreasonably hostile things to them.

The ban was declaring in the most vivid manner the inability of the government to monitor who is coming in. Is that so difficult?

And is it so important down the road eventually to prevent a sporadic terrorist attack when we do far less to save thousands every year from car accidents, cancer due to commercial and industrial products or industrial pollution, poor nutritional habits, health etc. Why are we so much obsessed with terrorism and not all the other greater problems? Why cant we deal with it more rationally? Why do we need blanket xenophobic "solutions" that at the end of the day will make Muslims worldwide look like innocent victims too, weakening any blame the religion details and culture share for many of the problems.

This is why simplistically thinking people tea party style make the problem with radical Islam worse than it is. Because some macho bs isolationist solution is not the answer.

If someone wants to attack you they will do it from inside because they are already here (or have people that will sympathize with the others out and radicalize themselves) or they will find a way to enter from other countries under the most well designed methods. This is your real danger. Intelligent highly motivated people that can do it the "right" way. Your problem is not some isolated lunatic that will get in together with the countless innocent people and strike a few in some public place. Find a way to stop the suspicious new entries differently and monitor all foreigners to reduce even these cases. A real strong intelligence system can even let them in on purpose to learn more about their network. But recognize also that the vast majority of those attacks were done from people that were already inside or from other countries and who could have been better screened for years now because they all leave clues of intriguing behavior every now and then.


Your real risk basically is not some barbarian that will go out in a shooting spree. The real problem is a well thought plan that can take out thousands next time. That is not going to be stopped by such bs blanket decisions to ban entries but by much better intelligence and screening. However such stupid decisions will make it very easy for many people to be even more pissed at US, not cooperate and even decide to do the other well thought plan attack years from now.

Do you remotely recognize the rage that can build up in a person that is separated from their family, treated poorly like an inferior permanently suspicious person or that is not allowed to have their kid take a medical operation or the damage to all activists and good people that are trying to help actually and that you now put in the same category with extremists?

Executive actions like that do not prevent the real dangerous attack. They may stop by real luck some remote cases while boosting plans for a lot more done differently and show arrogance and lack of understanding of the real problems. They enhance the problem, they show weakness and nervousness and they are not part of a sensible approach.
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Old 02-10-2017, 06:06 PM   #69
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Re: The politarding thread of SMP, for really really really sorting things out

A president can't afford to get into quarrels like the one on immigration will develop into, and already has. His counterparts will use every means of squeezing out everything possible. He doesn't understand that, and doesn't understand to back off.

A quarrel with the legal institutions as the main agenda...is that what we expect from a statesman? It's called "using your political capital".

Every politician knows it. Appeal after appeal after appeal...how will that look?

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Old 02-10-2017, 09:10 PM   #70
ToothSayer
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Re: The politarding thread of SMP, for really really really sorting things out

Considering that this has been reasonably claimed by experts about everything Trump has done since he announced his run 18 months ago (he won't win this state, that state, this group, that group, can't get above 20%, 30% ceiling, can't win nomination, can't win without Latinos (he beat Romney), can't win presidency, is going to lose in a landslide), perhaps it's time to consider that maybe he understands the world better than you do. I mean, at what point does the penny drop for you, that Trump is smarter than you are, and most of the pundits?

Anyway, wow guys, a lot of Trump hate. Will get back to you. In the meantime, since this is SMP, a little thought experiment to put this court ruling into perspective:


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Old 02-10-2017, 09:44 PM   #71
adios
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Re: The politarding thread of SMP, for really really really sorting things out

Quote:
Originally Posted by plaaynde View Post
A president can't afford to get into quarrels like the one on immigration will develop into, and already has.
So TRUMP is through then right? Name a POTUS that hasn't had a "quarrel" with the legal system.

Quote:
His counterparts will use every means of squeezing out everything possible. He doesn't understand that, and doesn't understand to back off.
So why didn't Obama back off from the legal challenges he faced?

Quote:
A quarrel with the legal institutions as the main agenda...
It isn't.

Quote:
is that what we expect from a statesman? It's called "using your political capital".
Political capital? He basically had none after he was elected except with his base. For what they are worth, polls indicate he has gained politically since the election.


Quote:
Every politician knows it.
Knows what?

Quote:
Appeal after appeal after appeal...how will that look?
So whenever he faces a legal challenge back off. A huge LOL at this idea.
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Old 02-10-2017, 10:08 PM   #72
carlo
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Re: The politarding thread of SMP, for really really really sorting things out

FDR vs the supreme court ;

http://content.time.com/time/special...085399,00.html
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Old 02-10-2017, 10:17 PM   #73
ecriture d'adulte
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Re: The politarding thread of SMP, for really really really sorting things out

Quote:
Originally Posted by adios View Post
So whenever he faces a legal challenge back off. A huge LOL at this idea.
Looks like thats what he's going to do in this case.

http://www.cnn.com/2017/02/10/politi...use/index.html

He could have avoided all of this with just a little competence in writing it the first time instead of having to write another one that fixes all the problems with the first one.
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Old 02-11-2017, 12:49 AM   #74
plaaynde
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Re: The politarding thread of SMP, for really really really sorting things out

Quote:
Originally Posted by adios View Post
So TRUMP is through then right? Name a POTUS that hasn't had a "quarrel" with the legal system.



So why didn't Obama back off from the legal challenges he faced?



It isn't.



Political capital? He basically had none after he was elected except with his base. For what they are worth, polls indicate he has gained politically since the election.




Knows what?


So whenever he faces a legal challenge back off. A huge LOL at this idea.
It has to do with the scale of what Trump is doing. And the lack of sophistication.

It's obvious if you look at it.

But by all means, let this antithesis be around for some time, looks it's necessary for getting a new synthesis. Which will of course be increased tolerance, respect for individuals, and continued globalization, like the one we are pursuing just by communicating here on 2+2 over the borders.

Hope the EU will not have quite this kind of antithesis for getting forward though. Frankly it's a bit stupid, and contains unnecessary risks.

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Old 02-11-2017, 02:21 AM   #75
Zeno
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Re: The politarding thread of SMP, for really really really sorting things out

In other news, Albania will hold elections this year on June 18.

elections-and-judicial-reforms-await-albania

The President is elected by Parliament.

Elections_in_Albania


And of course this is a real screamer of an article on Albania getting into the EU, a bit old but still plush, and with lots of sex appeal. Enjoy.


Albania-looking-Britain-economic-salvation
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