have most of you guys just never seen tommie frazier?

Only one person mentioned this, but evaluating the GOAT in college football based on accomplishments is ridiculous. College football is a feeder league. Lots of players forego the chance to acquire a second Heisman trophy to play pro ball. The players who leave early are selected for quality. If Tebow was 2 inches taller and had a better throwing motion(i.e. if he was "greater"), he's be playing for Detroit right now and this thread wouldn't exist. If being greater takes you out of the GOAT discussion, you're doing something wrong.

Tebow has been the starting QB for a 3 years on team with an excellent defense and no running backs, and he isn't much of a pro prospect. He's the ideal player to acquire a lot of counting stats and team success.


Micheal Vick was the best college football player I've ever seen, for what it's worth.

I repeat, Barry Sanders. I think he had more total yards his junior year then Vick had passing yards in his career (including bowl games for each). He also had more TDs that season then Vick had in his career (rushing + passing).

Florida's defense was horrendous the year he won the Heisman.

And that team went like 9-4, right?

Yep, due to having one of the worst secondaries in the nation.

Currently, I would say it is Herschel Walker based on a mixture of accomplishments and skill/ability. Only considering those who have both a Heisman, a national championship, and freakish storybook qualities, Herschel stands out.

Accomplishments.

Top 3 Heisman all three years.
Consensus AA all three years
1 MNC
1 Heisman

Objectively the best freshman in NCAA history: Set freshman marks for total rushing, most 200+ rushing games, average rushing yards per game, all purpose yards, and touchdowns, despite not playing in 3 games.

Broke the SEC career rushing, TD and all purpose yards records in three years.

Set the SEC single season yardage and yards per game records.
Broke the NCAA records for most rushing yards in three seasons, most carries in three seasons, most all purpose yards in three years.

When he left after his junior year, was 3rd on the NCAA rushing list, and would have shattered that record as well.

---

Basically, he broke all of the SEC career records despite playing less than 3 total seasons. He shattered all of the three-season marks at the NCAA level and would have broken all of those records as well. Won a MNC and a Heisman, coming in the top three all three years for the Heisman. UGA lost 3 games while he was there, and was essentially in the MNC game every year (two of the losses were sugar bowl losses while UGA was top two in the country).

In addition to his accomplishments, he played like a man among boys. There are plays where he runs over a defensive tackle, and proceeds to outrun a safety who has an obscene angle on him to the corner. There are plays where he is flipped upside down after attempting to leap a defender and lands upright and keeps going. Stuff like that. He was Bo Jackson except even more of a freak athlete than Bo Jackson. Won the state title in the 100 meter dash and the Shot Put as a HS junior and senior. Never lifted weights until he got to the USFL, instead doing on pushup and pullup modifications, thousands a day. He weighed around 225 and had a vertical jump of like 43 inches. When measured at UGA, he weighed around 225 and did 24 repetitions of 225 in the bench press despite never having lifted weights seriously in his life. Dislocated his shoulder on the second play in the 1980 Sugar Bowl, and went on to rush for 140+ yards and win the game. After he retired from football, he randomly decided he wanted to compete in the Olympics and within two years was one of the two best bobsledders in the entire country.

All that said, if Tebow wins either the MNC or the Heisman, it's probably him. Having 4 combined Heismans+MNC is too much for anyone to overcome, even though there have been players more talented than him.

There is no doubt in my mind that Tebow is the best player I've ever watched

as to the pass completion pct thing earlier, that is the one thing that changes the least as QBs move from team to team

These stats off of wiki are ridiculous... this is playstation type numbers. Only, Tebow has done it irl against the toughest competition at his level.

Passing Rushing
Season Team GP Rating Att Comp Pct Yds TD INT Att Yds TD
2006 Florida Gators 14 201.7 33 22 66.7 358 5 1 89 469 8
2007 Florida Gators 13 172.5 350 234 66.9 3286 32 6 210 895 23
2008 Florida Gators 14 172.4 298 192 64.4 2747 30 4 176 673 12
2009 Florida Gators 5 165.9 84 55 65.5 777 7 2 72 309 5
Totals 46 180.6 765 503 65.8 7167 74 13 547 2346 48

It would be really awesome if you could actually distill this into readable form. Tebow is a beast no doubt.

nah... people gloss over stuff if you make it easy for them
if they have to work to read it, it will sink in more
those that will skip over it would skip over it otherwise

Or you could say, in his two complete years he passed for 62 TDs with 10 INTs, and ran for 35 more TDs. He also completed ~65% of his passes and ~6000 passing yards and ~1500 rushing yards.

And then people will say "Damn, thats really good."

i remember tommie frazier being beyond awesome.

vince young is the only player i thought may be even better. his rose bowl nc game was great but i think his best game was the year before against michigan.

maybe tebow is just as effective as those guys and a better player but he just doesnt "look" as good. hes not as fun to watch for some reason. maybe its just too easy for him. vy and tf (and vick and ward to a lesser extent) just absolutely himiliated defenders.

Mike Hass

/thread

Tim Tebow runs for 4 yard gains and throws a bunch of 7 yard passes.

Vince Young ran for 80 yard gains and threw a bunch of 7 yard passes.

If Tebow is the GOAT how the f did he go 9-4 his sophomore year?

Yup. And that is why it is one of the best ways to predict future pro success when looking at college QBs.

Vince Young
v
Tim Tebow

I don't see the argument for VY > TT
Besides Tebow contributing big his freshman year as well
those TD to INT ratios are ridiculous
75 passing TDs to 13 INTs for Tebow!!!!!!!!!!

Well, considering that his freshman year is beyond debating assuming you actually believe what you are saying, please give nominations for players that could have done it his junior year. Fk if bradford had been our QB last year we wouldnt have even made it TO the national championship game.

also, lol at the guy saying vy 80 yd runs and 7yd passes vs tebow 7 yd runs and 7 yd passes. guess you never heard of what stats mean.

uh? is this even a real question

Are the Tebow homers only talking about TDs for a reason? VY was a thousand yard rusher twice on top of his passing. Tebow average 3.8 YPC and, imo, is a glorified (yet still very good) bus driver.

your stat appears to be touchdowns?

Just direct them to Sagarin's Conference Ratings which look something like this:

1) Pac-10
2) SEC
3) ACC
4) Big Least
5) Big 11
6) Big 12

I get tired of people bagging on the ACC while pretending the Big 12 is so awesome. I'm not saying the ACC is a great conference or anything, but it's an underrated conference, and I'm not pretending it's some awesome conference either, like Big 12 supporters do with the Big 12.

well, if you want to just compare their rushing abilities, thats an obviously flawed way of looking at it. even if you did, i would argue that being able to convert a bunch of 3rd and 7s or 4th and 1s is more important, as is being able to run it in for a td. tebows rushing is so key for teams to defend against (and he still put up career numbers on the ground that just about any college rusher would love to have) that it allows his relatively sub-par throwing abilities to still get 30+ TDs in the air 2 seasons straight.

imo tebow is not the best rusher ever, nor the best thrower ever. but nobody has ever been able to come close to doing both as well. his "hybridness" if you will is why we are even having this conversation.

see above for why his statement was stupid.

Charlie Ward was a better thrower and about the same running, although he never even got much of a chance to display his rushing skills or would possibly be considered better than Tebow. Anyhow, to say noone has ever come close to Tebow in terms of both is way off.

uh there is a difference between being able to do both as well and actually DOING both as well.