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Old 11-16-2009, 09:09 PM   #1
Geddy Lee
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SE Boxing Thread (not waiting for PBF v. Pac II)

I can't hold it in anymore. Pretty Boy's said repeatedly that a good PPV fight takes at least 6 months to promote properly, so it's time we started discussing all things Pacman-PBF itt right now.

The Latest Updates:

- This link was posted in the Pacman-Cotto thread; apparently Ross Greenburg, president of HBO Sports, has already been contacted by Golden Boy Promotions CEO Richard Schaefer, who told him that Floyd has given them the green light to begin negotiations for a Pacquiao fight. This is just one link of many...numerous credible boxing print reporters and bloggers are also indicating Schaefer and Arum were expected to have been in contact as recently as today.

- Early reports indicate Pac-Cotto attracted approx. 1.5 million PPV buys, which means an estimated gross of $82 million. This is significant because Mayweather's camp said unless Pac-Cotto could surpass the Mayweather-Marquez PPV buys from earlier this year (~1 million), they would refuse to sign on for a fight unless the PPV share was heavily in favour of Floyd - thought to be around the 65-35 range. Not only is Pac-Cotto gonna surpass Mayweather-Marquez, it's gonna blow it out of the water. All signs point to an even chop making the most sense, imo.

- From the "LOL WUT" files, the Yankees have apparently expressed interest in hosting a Pacquiao-Mayweather fight at Yankee Stadium in the spring of 2010, rekindling the spirits of great world title fights of the past fought in the old Bronx shrine. Also, according to Arum, Yankee Stadium took out a full-page ad from the Pac-Cotto fight program that proclaimed "Yankee Stadium, Your Home For Boxing 2010." Haters gonna hate.

The Fighters:

Manny Pacquiao



WBO Welterweight World Champion
IBO and Ring Magazine Light Welterweight Champion
Ring Magazine #1 pound-for-pound fighter in the world


Hometown: General Santos City, Philippines
Nickname: Pac-Man
Age: 30
Record: 50-3-2, 38 KO's
Height: 5 ft. 6.5 in.
Stance: Southpaw
Current division: Welterweight (fought at catchweight of 145 lbs. vs. Cotto)
Notable wins: Miguel Cotto, Ricky Hatton, Oscar De La Hoya, Juan Manuel Marquez, Erik Morales (twice), Marco Antonio Barrera (twice)


Floyd Mayweather Jr.



Former WBC Welterweight World Champion (vacated upon retirement)
Former Ring Magazine #1 pound-for-pound fighter in the world, currently #2


Hometown: Grand Rapids, Michigan
Nicknames: Money, Pretty Boy
Age: 32
Record: 40-0, 25 KO's
Height: 5 ft. 7.5 in.
Stance: Orthodox
Current division: Welterweight (147 lbs.)
Notable wins: Juan Manuel Marquez, Ricky Hatton, Oscar De La Hoya, Zab Judah, Arturo Gatti, Jose Luis Castillo (twice), Diego Corrales

What makes this matchup so intriguing:

As the saying goes, styles make fights, and this axiom holds true when describing a potential Pacquiao-Mayweather fight. Pacquiao is arguably the most prodigious offensive talent in the modern era. Without a doubt, he's the fastest puncher on the planet today, but what might be more astounding is the fact that he's retained the same magnitude of power during his progression through 7 weight classes. When you combine blinding speed with the ability to inflict serious punishment, you get the most dangerous puncher in the world. His footwork, agility and technical skills are all world-class as well, allowing Manny to attack from a multitude of awkward angles; this often confuses his opponents and allows him to score seemingly at will. None of Pacquiao's last 4 fights have gone the distance. Although once regarded as a flat-out brawler, Pacquiao has shown a much more methodical approach to attacking his opponents over the last 2 years, resulting in some eye-opening victories over De La Hoya and Cotto most recently. Manny's stamina is truly remarkable; his engine simply doesn't stop.

However, Pacquiao has never fought a fighter as proficient defensively as Mayweather. Plenty of boxing fans rate Mayweather as the greatest defensive fighter of our era, and with good reason - in 40 professional fights, Mayweather has only been knocked down once, by Carlos Hernandez over 8 years ago. The shoulder roll technique taught to him by his father and uncle enables Mayweather to dodge punches from all angles and in all situations, by twisting away from punches in a rhythmic manner and presenting much smaller target areas compared to his contemporaries. While Floyd isn't necessarily known as a knockout threat - only 25 career KO's, 4 decisions in his last 5 fights - he does boast knockout victories over the late hard-nosed Arturo Gatti and formerly undefeated Ricky Hatton, a performance which earned Mayweather high praise and accolades from the boxing media for his systematic destruction of a highly-regarded challenger.

So the question remains: who breaks first? Will Pacquiao be able to solve Mayweather's seemingly impregnable defence? Will Mayweather be able to withstand the Pacquiao offensive tsunami? Something has to give...and in the process, fight fans might be treated to one of the greatest bouts in history.

Why this fight is so important for boxing:

Sadly, the reputation of boxing has been so tarnished over the last two decades, many fight fans feel they've been completely alienated by the sport. Due in large part to the absence of big fights, the questionable legitimacy of championships and the embarrassing greed of short-sighted promoters, mainstream interest in the sport has waned to a large degree. With the advent of big ticket MMA, boxing is fighting for its life like never before.

Hardcore boxing fans and casual sports fans alike deserve to see the very best fight each other. It's the only way boxing can remain relevant in a day and age where sports media is oversaturated with coverage of every sport imaginable. After years of wandering in the proverbial woods, boxing is finally taking steps towards regaining legitimacy - events like the Super Six World Boxing Classic tournament certainly help. However, even though the likes of Mikkel Kessler and Andre Ward make for fantastic entertainment, boxing needs a string of blockbuster fights to jumpstart the sport and reinvigorate mainstream interest once again. Pacquiao-Mayweather can provide the required spark.

A fight between Pacquiao and Mayweather, easily the sport's two biggest attractions, will draw the attention of the mainstream sports media unlike arguably any other fight of the last three decades. For boxing aficionados, this is easily the most significant fight since Pernell Whitaker fought Julio Cesar Chavez for the right to claim the undisputed pound-for-pound title in 1994...but more importantly, in terms of attracting worldwide mass interest, this might be the biggest fight since Muhammad Ali fought Joe Frazier in the Thrilla in Manila in 1975. Ironically, the final chapter of the Ali-Frazier trilogy took place in the Philippines, so it's only appropriate that 35 years later, a Filipino icon will make up one half of the most important and significant bout of his era.

One of the reasons boxing has become less relevant to the sports public is because of the decreasing American content at the highest levels of the sport. While this has made boxing more intriguing for non-Americans worldwide, the fact remains that the biggest title fights still take place in the United States, catering to boxing's biggest and most profitable market of over 300 million consumers. Therein lies another subplot all to itself: this fight would pit the biggest (and arguably last) American superstar left in the boxing against the sport's biggest draw in the Pacific Rim, which is a gigantic market itself - the Philippines is the 12th most populous country in the world with a population of 92 million, which doesn't include the estimated 11 million immigrant Filipinos living overseas. Unlike many predecessors, this fight has true worldwide appeal. The entire globe will be tuned in. This is the kind of fight that can rejuvenate an entire sport and inspire the next generation of superstars to lace up a pair of gloves.


***Disclaimer***

I understand that nothing's been signed yet and there's a whole lot of messy negotiations ahead. I also understand this fight might not even happen. It's not my intention to jinx it or anything like that. I just think this fight has to potential to be an era-defining moment for our generation of sports fans...therefore, I wanna start talking about it as soon as possible. Mayweather-Marquez was a small obstacle, Pacquiao-Cotto was a huge one, but now there's nothing standing in the way of these two little giants colliding (sorry Sugar Shane). This fight needs to happen. For so many reasons. I, for one, cannot wait. This is the real fight to save boxing, and I really hope all parties involved in the negotiations understand what kind of lasting effect - both economic and otherwise - this fight will have on the sport.

Gentlemen, discuss.
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Old 11-16-2009, 10:31 PM   #2
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re: SE Boxing Thread (still waiting for PBF v. Pac)

first

and holy **** what an OP. Absolutely cannot wait for the hype leading up to this, as well as the fight itself....gonna be a classic.
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Old 11-16-2009, 10:33 PM   #3
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re: SE Boxing Thread (still waiting for PBF v. Pac)

subscribed.

cannot wait. A+ OP
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Old 11-16-2009, 10:39 PM   #4
Geddy Lee
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re: SE Boxing Thread (still waiting for PBF v. Pac)

btw, ty to whichever mod changed the thread title.
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Old 11-16-2009, 10:43 PM   #5
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re: SE Boxing Thread (still waiting for PBF v. Pac)

Nice post bra. Geddy what do you think the line of the fight will be? PBF favored by a little?
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Old 11-16-2009, 10:48 PM   #6
Geddy Lee
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re: SE Boxing Thread (still waiting for PBF v. Pac)

Quote:
Originally Posted by EmpireMaker2 View Post
Nice post bra. Geddy what do you think the line of the fight will be? PBF favored by a little?
I honestly have no clue, but I think that's a reasonable prediction.

Although the Asian bettors drove Cotto into 3/1 dog territory Saturday which was pretty lol imo, so who knows?
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Old 11-16-2009, 10:49 PM   #7
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re: SE Boxing Thread (still waiting for PBF v. Pac)

Great work on the post, this should be your job. And yes, if this fight happens its going to be legendary.
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Old 11-16-2009, 10:51 PM   #8
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re: SE Boxing Thread (still waiting for PBF v. Pac)

Wow excellent OP
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Old 11-16-2009, 11:26 PM   #9
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re: SE Boxing Thread (still waiting for PBF v. Pac)

My totally unscientific guess has this opening with PBF at -135.
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Old 11-16-2009, 11:29 PM   #10
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re: SE Boxing Thread (still waiting for PBF v. Pac)

I for one cannot wait for this to happen (plz let it happen boxing gods) will be the first ppv ordered since lewis/tyson
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Old 11-16-2009, 11:31 PM   #11
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re: SE Boxing Thread (still waiting for PBF v. Pac)

I liked the analogy of inpenertrable shield + sword that cuts through all shields from the other thread.
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Old 11-16-2009, 11:32 PM   #12
Geddy Lee
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re: SE Boxing Thread (still waiting for PBF v. Pac)

Quote:
Originally Posted by thedeezy View Post
I for one cannot wait for this to happen (plz let it happen boxing gods) will be the first ppv ordered since lewis/tyson
You certainly won't be a unique case.

And it's people much like yourself that will make this the biggest PPV event in sports history.
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Old 11-16-2009, 11:34 PM   #13
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re: SE Boxing Thread (still waiting for PBF v. Pac)

Excellent OP. This will be a MONSTER fight, can't wait for it happen.
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Old 11-16-2009, 11:35 PM   #14
Wrane
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re: SE Boxing Thread (still waiting for PBF v. Pac)

Who's everyone cheering for?

Floyd has such sick sick defense.
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Old 11-16-2009, 11:38 PM   #15
Geddy Lee
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re: SE Boxing Thread (still waiting for PBF v. Pac)

Also, quick correction to make in the OP...

Pernell Whitaker fought Julio Cesar Chavez on September 10th, 1993 at the Alamodome...not 1994 as I wrote above. Too late to do a ninja edit. Sigh.
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Old 11-16-2009, 11:39 PM   #16
Geddy Lee
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re: SE Boxing Thread (still waiting for PBF v. Pac)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wrane View Post
Who's everyone cheering for?
Pacquiao ainec.

I really want to see Mayweather get spanked and lose his precious undefeated record.
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Old 11-16-2009, 11:41 PM   #17
Wrane
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re: SE Boxing Thread (still waiting for PBF v. Pac)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Geddy Lee View Post
Pacquiao ainec.

I really want to see Mayweather get spanked and lose his precious undefeated record.
Yeah, I have a feeling everyone is going to be cheering for Pac.

Thing is though, I have a inner gut hope that Floyd wins this to stfu everyone up. He really is so good. The bashing on him has gotten pretty ridiculous and almost at a point where "I hate him but now he's hated so much I like him".

That being said, PPPACCCCMAN!
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Old 11-16-2009, 11:44 PM   #18
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re: SE Boxing Thread (still waiting for PBF v. Pac)

Excellent post OP. I don't even follow boxing and you have me excited for the fight. Yankee Stadium? THAT would be epic.
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Old 11-16-2009, 11:45 PM   #19
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re: SE Boxing Thread (still waiting for PBF v. Pac)

Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeyPatriot View Post
My totally unscientific guess has this opening with PBF at -135.
I would guess it will open a little higher, Mayweather -170 and work its way down to around your level.
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Old 11-16-2009, 11:47 PM   #20
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re: SE Boxing Thread (still waiting for PBF v. Pac)

I'll be cheering for PBF, gotta stay with the Michigan man
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Old 11-16-2009, 11:55 PM   #21
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re: SE Boxing Thread (still waiting for PBF v. Pac)

OP sold me on the fight and I don't even watch boxing. In!
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Old 11-16-2009, 11:58 PM   #22
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re: SE Boxing Thread (still waiting for PBF v. Pac)

Filipinos are actually the 2nd biggest asian american group behind Chinese. There are more filipinos than vietnamese, koreans, japanese, indians, etc. They seem to be the forgotten group, but they are everywhere.

Pacman/Floyd would be the biggest PPV ever of any kind.

The winner of this fight, should it occur, will enter the Robinson/Armstrong/Leonard level of p4p greatness. I think there's been a little bit of hyperbole with some saying Pacman is already the greatest p4p of all time. I disagree, but either guy winning this fight would probably vault into that level (especially if Manny wins). If Manny wins, he is definitely on that level and can enter the GOAT discussion. If Floyd wins, he approaches that level.

A really exciting possibility if you are cheering for the sport of boxing as a whole is a very likely fight scenario (in my mind): Floyd wins a close controversial decision. The fight does nearly 3 million PPV buys, and there's an immediate rematch that does an additional 2 million or so PPV buys. This would be huge for boxing as a sport, massive massive massive.

The roadblock to this fight is that Bob Arum and Floyd Mayweather despise each other. Really, really despise. But the general consensus is that the deal will get done fairly quickly anyways. There's too much money to ignore. Floyd and Manny stand to sell more PPVs than any fight ever. Personal hate gets put aside for 9 digit numbers.
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Old 11-17-2009, 12:09 AM   #23
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re: SE Boxing Thread (still waiting for PBF v. Pac)

Wrane, I refuse to hate on Mayweather's skills, the dude is sick. I was (and still am to an extent) a big Hatton fan but some of the British fans got so annoying with their "omg Mayweather refused to fight our boy like a man" jibba jabba. Well, that was the whole point. Mayweather frustrated a much more aggressive fighter and wore him down to the point where PBF was able to score an easy KO. It was the perfect gameplan.

Having said that, I got really sick of Floyd calling himself one of the greatest of all time when he's ducked so many good fighters and instead sought out more predictable and favourable matchups. Fighting Baldomir instead of Margarito, fighting Marquez instead of Mosley...meh. It gets old.

Like, that's all well and good, it's his right to fight whomever he wants and he's a great businessman...but don't call yourself one of the GOAT's. You're not. Robinson, Armstrong, Leonard, they sought challenges, they tested themselves, they fought the best. Floyd hasn't yet.
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Old 11-17-2009, 12:14 AM   #24
Geddy Lee
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re: SE Boxing Thread (still waiting for PBF v. Pac)

btw, I'm really excited to see self-admitted non-followers of boxing posting itt about how stoked they are for this fight.
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Old 11-17-2009, 12:17 AM   #25
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re: SE Boxing Thread (still waiting for PBF v. Pac)

Hatton almost knocked down Mayweather in the first round of their fight. I think Manny is going to dominate him from the beginning and this will be nowhere as close as people predict.
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