my argument has a lot more to do with position scarcity than it does with goalies being the most important position the nhl fwiw

I'm basically doing this draft to improve my hockey knowledge and everything but I've been somewhat surprised by the goalies going so high. I figured when it got to me at 13 all the goalies would still be available and all the top forwards and defensemen would be off the board.

I guess we will see how it plays out, but I can think of a dozen goalies I would be happy with. Obviously I prefer some to others. I agree that the top three are head and shoulders above all other, but 4-12 are fairly similar.

i'm obv no hockey expert so i'm prob off on the 7-8 number and ur prob right that 4-12 are similar and I just forgot 4 or so along the way who are close to the other guys

here is my full writeup:

ROUND 1, PICK 2

MARIO LEMIEUX Center







Mario scores right off a Face Off

Would Usain Bolt have won the 100 meter dash with a 12.5 time? no, of course not, but Mario wouldve. Mario has the rare ability to make everyone around him move in slow motion. His instincts and Hockey IQ alone are on an untouchable level, that may as well never be touched.

Mario is the best and most talented player EVER. Period.

No offense to the Greatness that is Wayne...and the Greatness that are his numbers! But skill wise, Mario stands on top of the hill, all alone.

I dont know if comparing Mario to Wayne is the best way to go, since Wayne was more durable over his career and played with many many great players...but I think I have no choice.

Wayne played with a bunch of Hall of Fame 50 goal scorers who I cannot name, because they WILL be drafted. Mario on the otherhand played with Rob Brown and Kevin Stevens who could not do anything without the aid of Mario by their side. Mario elevated the play of his teammates like no other, and there is no denying that.

Rob Brown scored 24, 49 and 34 goals respectively with Mario by his side. he then followed that up with never touching the 20 goal plateau in a season, and would spend the next 10+ seasons going in and out of the NHL until finally finishihng his career in the AHL.

Kevin Stevens scored 29, 40, 54, 55, 41 before slowly fading to black...and showed no signs of his scoring prowess while on the Rangers.

Not only did Mario elevate the play of his teammates, but elevated his own play during the playoffs, like only big time players could...and there is no big time player like Mario himself. Scoring 76 goals and 172 points in 107 playoff games...not to mention Two Stanley Cups, and of course Two Conn Smythe Trophies (playoffs MVP). Players used to tell their agents they wanted to be traded to Pittsburgh, or they will sign for less just to go to Pittsburgh! No one wants to actually PLAY in Pittsburgh!?!?! They want to play with Mario. Undrafted potential Hof player said that was the only reason he didnt retire early, he couldnt miss his chance to play with the Marvelous One.

Mario entered the league after being selected first overall in the 1984 draft, and made his mark on the league instantly, notching 43 goals 57 assists for 100 points on the empty roster that was the Pittsburgh Penguins. He continued to build on his league dominance, never agaeraging less the 1.5 points per game!

Mario scored 199 points in 1988-89, had he played the full season I have no doubt he wouldve made a run at the single season record for points of 215, held by Wayne.

I recall watching the 1992-93 season intently. That year, Mario was crushing the league in points, and leading his team to a great overall season. here is a Wiki exerpt that best describes what happened next.

5 Goals in 5 Different Ways
(shorthanded, full strength, powerplay, penalty shot, and empty net)

Mario Fight Compilation

The Most Important Goal In Marios Career!

Here are some of Marios Records and Awards:

AWARDS
RECORDS
I just drafted the greatest player to ever lace on a pair of skates, and am sure he will only elevate the standard of play of everyone around him.

My Team so far:

C Mario Lemieux

i wanted to, it was my first intention given how important goaltending is.

then i realized. how on earth do you not pick wayne gretzky? He is so far ahead of every other player available that its just ludicrous. Having him as your top centre is worth an automatic 2 goals a game, no matter who is out there beside him. Lemieux is the most skilled, sure, maybe by a small amount. He also had certain players who were just as good and dominant without him while in other locales. He didn't have the mind gretzky had and that's what separated them.

The greatest who ever lived, I don't even think its close.

When I grew up, you were either a Gretzky guy or a Lemieux guy. I was firmly entrenched in the Lemieux camp, but that 5 year stretch where Gretzky averaged 200 pts/season is possibly the safest record in sports.*

* Assuming they don't install soccer nets or something.

Wayne vs Mario dabates usually go like this:

Wayne is the greatest player of all time. Numbers dont lie.

Mario is the greatest player of all time. Numbers dont lie, but they can fabricate the truth.

in other words, Waynes teammates were all great with or without Wayne. Marios not so much. Talent alone, Mario stands alone, and most importantly, for this draft, that is what counts most.

How did I miss this draft?

Would love to still get in, would be happy to be a co-owner as well.

Shark, would you really have considered Mario with the #1 pick?

Just woke up, reading through EPiPeN's PMs now....will have our pick announced soon

bonsaltron and Nootka have both asked me to join the draft as well, so they're both in.

We really need a spreedsheet. Or at least can someone post our current draft order with all of the late additions added in please? Thanks.

If the point of this is to say that 99 had better teammates, well that's true but he also had much more team success. And don't forget, when he was traded to LA which was a big LOL team at the time, that same LA team BEAT Edmonton in the playoffs next year which is pretty damn impressive.

99 also had an incredible first year in the NHL when he didn't have so much in the way of teammates. If memory serves, his team squeaked into the playoffs and upset a powerful Montreal team in the first round.

Anyhow, Wayne and Mario, both awesome, both in the top 4 players of all time IMO.

Assani needs to read the thread, imo

FYP

EDIT: Gordie & Bobby are 3 & 4, ldo

Someone already made a spreadsheet, Assani.

http://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?k...-73RFtluXaUoew

You're in as well then.

Awesome!

BTW, if someone wants to be a co-owner, I would be more than happy to do this, these drafts can be a lot of work. I would be happy to work with someone who has followed NHL closely for the last 10 years or so which I haven't, I followed it a LOT though from 1980 to 2000 though.

If no co-owner, I will be more than happy to do the best I can on my own.

ya shark come on, I can buy that mario might have been slightly better when he was on the ice but it's no where near enough to offset his huge durability issues

fwiw I think people don't factor in injuries/durability into any of these drafts as much as they should (nba/nfl/college bball and now nhl)

Its impossible to pass up on Wayne at the number 1 spot. His numbers make it waayyyyyy to easy an argument. But Mario (skill wise) trumps Wayne imo.

Zurvan stepped up and did a spreadsheet.

Thoguh, we could use some assistance in fixing it up a bit, if anyone knows how to make it like the previous spreadsheets.

NHL Draft Spreadsheet

turn it into this:

NFL Draft Spreadsheet


Also, the reverse snake needs to be implemented.


WHERES DUDD WHEN WE NEED HIM!!!?????

We're taking Marttin Brodeur.

Golden Rhino is on the clock.

nice pick with Brodeur. Now comes the interesting part to see who the next goalie to be taken will be.

i don't think brodeur is a good pick this high. his career has a large valley in the middle where he was merely league average.

Observation: All fantasy hockey drafts have goalies in clusters