I didn't think Simmons was the BPA comin out of the draft. I think his lack of shooting makes him hugely exploitable vs good teams and he also seemed to have character issues. Given his form & the role they have stated they forsee him in, I'm not sure how much his shot will improve. Granted I probably overrate floor spacing & shooting. Simmons definitely has the higher ceiling given his playmaking ability and physical tools, but I think Ingram has the much higher floor and is much more likely to hit his median. If I'm the Sixers I just would want the safer pick+fit.

Basically I see Simmons as a LeBron type player who becomes a worse Lebron very infrequently, whereas I see Ingram as a Durant type with a much much better shot at becoming a worse Durant.

I was on the Ingram > Simmons train too but obv understand why sixers took simmons. Ingram gonna be legit.

At what point do you start drafting need and not BPA? Is there any scenario where that happens?

I'm torn. When you're horrible and years away from contention, common sense says draft BPA in basically every situation. Then again, the Sixers have spent all five of their high draft picks on the same two PF/C spots - Simmons/Embiid/Okafaor/Saric/Noel. ALL FIVE. If BPA this year is a big man, how on earth can they possibly justify drafting another PF/C? It'd be asburd.

I thought Ingram vs Simmons was very close, but that Ingram would be a much better fit for the sixers. He can play 3 and maybe even 2 down the road (depending on how his defense comes along). Frankly, a lineup with Sergio/Ingram/Saric/Embiid isn't half bad, and Okafor could come off the bench to be a post version of Jamal Crawford - a really good scoring option while the starters rest. Whatever warts Okafor has, he's a legit post up machine and can get a ~50% shot basically whenever he wants. Trade noel for any kind of serviceable 2 guard and you're in business.

Naw, he was asking Katie why he didn't do this in the playoffs.

Lol Durant

Meh I don't even think I agree that Ingram has the higher floor although I definitely haven't watched much of him. Actually I think Simmons athleticism and playmaking pretty much guarantee his usefulness in the NBA with his shot potentially blocking his access to elite level but it doesn't really have to day or night as in either he develops a shot and becomes elite or he doesn't and he's an unplayable scrub. There's still room for him to develop a somewhat acceptable jumpshot and I see a lot of middle scenarios where he ends up being pretty damn good but just not super elite because of his lack of range. It's probably impossible in this league to become a superstar without good range but I also don't think it prevents you from being a solid producer if you have the attributes Simmons has. There are definitely some very good 4's who don't have a prolific jumpshot

Not that I think any of them will bust but I'd actually give Ingram the higher bust %. Also believe Ingram's reputation is being helped by Durant's comparisons. He's not as tall, doesn't have as large of a wingspan and certainly hasn't proven to shoot as well as his Durant. His shot is still somewhat of a question mark and 68% from the line in college is just not enough to justify KD's comparisons. (For the anecdote, Simmons shot 67%)

Agree with fit though obviously

Simmons will be sweet, have we already forgotten his preseason? His vision and IQ is amazing, just an unlucky injury guys.

Ingram has chicken legs which can be a bit concerning for a basketball player

Dallas 0-5 and Dirk hurt, anyone think they unload some bodies pretty soon if it keeps going bad for them?

Bogut and Wes could really help some teams.

Although not sure how much people are willing to give to contend in a Warriors/Cavs world.

PSA: Clippers vs. Spurs on NBA TV tonight at 830pm

Word is they're trying to get Corey Joseph and a 1st from Toronto for Nerlens. I don't really get it, especially with Bayless coming back soonish, would rather they targeted a 2 or 3 so I never have to see Stauskas play again especially considering this draft is so PG heavy at the top end.

Also, I don't think the Simmons v Ingram debate will be much of one once we see Ben running pnr's with Embiid. The character issue stuff imo is blown wayyyy out of proportion, the guy just didn't gaf about College and only wanted to be the NBA, his documentary on for Showtime was released yesterday and is worth a watch if for nothing else then just to see his disdain for the NCAA system.

There is no way I do that if I'm Toronto. Nerlens sucks and isn't going to be cheap starting next year.

Joseph is a key part of the Raptors. Who else is gonna pickup the slack when Lowry WIMs it up in the playoffs?

I assume Ingram has looked quite a bit better than his stats indicate?

Nah, he's pretty good

Thanks for the reminder.

I have Simmons > Ingram in terms of ceiling, but floor is Ingram > Simmons.

I'd take Noel on the Bucks for all our bigs, but obviously Philly can't have an entire roster of them. Lol.

Poor Mavs. I hate seeing this. Poor Dirk as well.

ya someone like Norman Powell might be a better fit in a trade like that than Joseph, who is basically their 6th man, and ~only backup PG (unless they secretly love this Delon Wright kid or something). they play with him and Lowry a lot too. also, he's from Canadia, so kind of a difficult guy to move all in all, unless maybe they're getting a PG back too.

Powell seems pretty good, and is cheap.

It's hilarious how the opinion in this thread drastically changes game to game. Simmons was the right pick. Still bummed that we ended up with Okafor and not Russell or Porzingis.

He's gone against some of the best wing defenders in the NBA during this stretch too. What happens when he doesn't have KCP, Winslow, Lebron/JR Smith, Otto Porter on him?

Also, if he keeps up a similar level of play the Curry/Durant vote split could put him ahead of one of them. Davis could be injured/ team could win <30 games which puts him out of the running.

DDR would need to average like 35ppg to seriously have any shot at MVP.

that said, from the little i've seen this year he's getting lots of open "contested" (defender within 2-4 feet) shots. like he's added some weird herky jerky thing where they're off balance and don't know when he's going up, so when he does + good vert, it's a nice easy open jumpshot that he's smoothly burying. different from the garbage Kobe-esque hero shots i've seen him brick in the past. closer too. but i've watched relatively little thus far.

yes he's going to regress, but i think he might have actually improved once again.

Lol, c'mon guys. DDR is not winning mvp. He may not even make first or second all team.

Idk what kind of odds to set it at, but I'd bet against him winning it. Real nice start to the season though.

I never brought up odds that he finished #1.

I said top 10 after 2 or 3 games and then when he had more great games I moved it to top 5

He's gonna regress back down to typical lol long 2 pt shooter, lol raps.

So LeBron cracked the top ten in points scored in NBA history tonight. I was looking at ESPN's projection of when he could possibly break Kareem's record and was really surprised to see who some of the all-time leaders were.

When LeBron broke into the top 100, he passed Andre Miller. Miller is now 106th all-time, but wow. I know it's a longevity thing, but did not expect him. Also, Jamal Crawford is 92nd.

So Embiid is already an All Star. I think?

Averaging 18.5 points, 6 rebounds, 3 blocks per game... in only 22 minutes per game. And his game just looks excellent, passes the eye test with flying colors. He has a strong low post game and can get his own baskets in isolation. He's shooting 6-9 from three - obviously a very small sample but he looks to have legitimate range. He's efficient thus far from a TS% perspective. He's hitting his FTs. He has a real defensive presence, and blocks/alters a ton of shots. He already appears to be a top five center in the NBA from what I can tell.

Damn man. Embiid is the real deal. Just needs to stay healthy.

Yea Embiid is legit. Still has a lot to improve on but he's a ridiculous talent