NBA Modern Day Dynasty "Draft"(different than usual) - Page 9 - Sporting Events and Fantasy Sports

mcb33f · 07-30-2012, 08:04 PM

kyrie has 8 years on cp3. 8 PRIME years. basically double the years of playing at an elite level, i think he have to project kyrie to improve only marginally to take paul, and if he ends up a 25per type guy i think kyrie is the choice even if we subtract like 2 years for injury worries. iyam the downside risk on taking paul is significant too, his knee injury is serious has has lingered for like 3 years now. don't see it going away, and it will probably continue to make his d suck more and more, limit his minutes etc

Quote:

Originally Posted by aejones

except it's a injury that takes a long time to recover, right while he's coming into his prime, and knee injuries are not good for athleticism-- which rose relies on pretty heavily at this point in his career

well yeah but the discussion is worth having imo. with modern sports medicine i would be pretty surprised if rose doesn't play a a good chunk of his prime without the knee injury being much of a factor. an acl injury shouldn't really hurt his longevity too much since it's not a structural problem

if we assume everything goes right for rose i'd take him over rwb, but given the downside risk i'd prob take rwb too

**iggymcfly** · 07-30-2012, 08:05 PM

Can you set vote counter to accept Kyrie as well as Kyrie Irving? Probably not a huge deal, but we are missing a vote from it at the moment.

**sethypooh21** · 07-30-2012, 08:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mcb33f

if rwb is being brought up i think rose should be too. i mean they're the same age and rose is better. it's only the recent injury that has everyone cold on him

Understandably - a violently explosive player just had an ACL injury. Regardless of the time he misses this year, it's unavoidable he loses a little of the top end, at least for 18 months or so.

mjw0586 · 07-30-2012, 08:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by iggymcfly

Can you set vote counter to accept Kyrie as well as Kyrie Irving? Probably not a huge deal, but we are missing a vote from it at the moment.

got it, i have to input voters manually for now, so I just missed mcbeef's post

Votes as of post 123
Night is more than 24 hours away

---

Votes	Lynch	Voters
6	Chris Paul	aejones (9), GeoffRas22 (3), mjw0586 (2), Scherer716 (3), sethypooh21 (4), TheDean1 (8)
2	Kyrie Irving	iggymcfly (13), mcb33f (2)

**iggymcfly** · 07-30-2012, 08:09 PM

I think comparing all the stats with the previous best 19-year old rookie who was also a #1 pick drives home the point a little better than the sort-by-PER thing:

http://www.basketball-reference.com/...esle01&y2=2004

mcb33f · 07-30-2012, 08:13 PM

i'm most surprised by the fact that kyrie rebounded almost as well as labron

Scherer716 · 07-30-2012, 08:15 PM

maybe the injury will have rose trying to learn how to shoot jumpers (mostly talking about midrange here) without having to jump so high. similar to nash and cp3 who master the ft line jumper. having an effective midrange jumper could transform his game. when he gets inside the 3pt line he'll either attack the rim or throw up a floater (which is nice) but being able to stop and pop from the ft line is a nice way to save your body from a lot of extra hits, and guys are already backing off expecting him to attack, so he'd be taking what theyre giving him more often than not.

i think rwb has a very similar problem in that he needs to jump real high to get off his midrange j, and it doesnt have great touch on it.

eta: if rose didn't have the injury, i wouldve take him before cp3, and def. before rwb.

mcb33f · 07-30-2012, 08:20 PM

i think both should continue to improve their jumpers, they're both good ft shooters which is always a good sign

Scherer716 · 07-30-2012, 08:29 PM

ya they could both find someone to work with them on it (actually they train together in offseason with kevin love) and work on keeping their bodies more grounded, taking more of a set-shot.

rwb is particular is very unique looking when he shoots from ~15-17ft. he dosnt really shoot on the way up, he shoots after he's already reached his peak, and sometimes on the way down when he overthinks it by trying to add touch.

charder30 · 07-30-2012, 08:30 PM

Chris Paul

Victor · 07-30-2012, 08:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheDean1

my one problem with this whole kyrie vs cp3 debate is that it seems to boil down to cp3 = known quantity and kyrie = unknown, ergo edge goes to cp

but kyrie isn't *that* unknown, like he just had a sample size of 51 games where he started and averaged 30.5 mpg. if he played at precisely the same level for his entire 20's, he's still an easy 1st round pick, except he did it at age 19 and is a heavy fave to get lots better.

forgetting possible increased susceptibility to injuries for a moment, what do we exactly anticipate as prime kyrie's range? for starters he can shave quite a bit off his TOV% and likely will given his handles + smarts and the fact that young PG's often improve quite a bit on this. and his usg/TS are similar to that of durant's sophomore year, which is really sort of ridic- is anybody surprised if he becomes like a 33ish usage 60ish TS kinda player? also you figure his assist rate prob has a few upticks in it, he's really on pace to become an ungodly weapon.

so what are the odds that he rekes up the joint and doesn't really get better (or gets worse?)
what are the odds that he becomes a 30+ PER monster?
what are the odds that his 26-28 seasons are more valuable than cp's past season + next 2?

kyrie's question marks are health and how his defense progresses. his assist rate is going to skyrocket once he gets surrounded by some competence. i dont see his usage getting up into the 30s tho. i see a nash type stat line with a bit better scoring and worse assists.

Victor · 07-30-2012, 08:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aejones

i mean we're just splitting hairs at this point but 80% of a lockout shortened rookie season where he probably didn't play a single meaningful game and everyone thrashed the cavs still leaves a lot to be desired for me, especially after he missed 3/4 of his only college season

bolded is ultra lol. the cavs were in a playoff race for much of the season. ya ya, it was obv to anyone with a clue they would fade but lol at u if you think the guys playing the game werent fired up and playing hard about being the 8th seed 20 games in.

Ray Horton · 07-30-2012, 08:41 PM

Man, I think everyone is jumping the gun on Kyrie. 51 game sample in a unique year. Started fast as all the vets weren't as ready. I think we need another year on him to put him in the 4-7 group. CP3 is old, injury-prone, and doesn't have the VORP he used to. Love is better than Kyrie today and only 23. Kevin Love although he is quite Kevin Love has a Dirk career trajectory, is a better rebounder, and gets to the FT line more.

**iggymcfly** · 07-30-2012, 08:42 PM

Kyrie's USG this year was 28.7%. Really not much of a stretch for it to get into the 30s. Nash's career high is 24.4%

Victor · 07-30-2012, 08:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mcb33f

i'm most surprised by the fact that kyrie rebounded almost as well as labron

ya thats wat happens when you play alongside jamison and hollins and varejao misses half the yr.

anyway, didnt realize the age difference so ima go

kyrie irving