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Kyle Shanahan don't need to know no stinking OT rules. Mario CRYSTALBALL is still unreal dumb Kyle Shanahan don't need to know no stinking OT rules. Mario CRYSTALBALL is still unreal dumb

09-11-2017 , 10:47 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dudd
Guys, he can't come out and say we're tanking
He also could go for it and if they miraculously convert, just pull an Andy Reid and pace the rest of the drive so they score a TD with like :03 left. Looks better on the scoreboard at least, and maybe if Bowles loses 14 games but they're all by one score, there's at least a tiny chance he gets brought back. (Better for his sake anyway, probably not Jets fans' sake, lol.)

Last edited by GMan42; 09-11-2017 at 10:53 AM.
Kyle Shanahan don't need to know no stinking OT rules. Mario CRYSTALBALL is still unreal dumb Quote
09-11-2017 , 10:52 AM
eagles score to go up 11 with 1:30 left and go for 2? ~never matters, but so random
Kyle Shanahan don't need to know no stinking OT rules. Mario CRYSTALBALL is still unreal dumb Quote
09-11-2017 , 10:55 AM
May as well practice those 2 point tries in a game situation I guess.
Kyle Shanahan don't need to know no stinking OT rules. Mario CRYSTALBALL is still unreal dumb Quote
09-11-2017 , 10:59 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by joejoe1337
May as well practice those 2 point tries in a game situation I guess.
...while also not showing their hand on any of their "good" 2pc plays, so I dunno if it's worth it.
Kyle Shanahan don't need to know no stinking OT rules. Mario CRYSTALBALL is still unreal dumb Quote
09-11-2017 , 11:17 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by BossmanJR
eagles score to go up 11 with 1:30 left and go for 2? ~never matters, but so random
Quote:
TD 10:34
William Fuller 11 Yd pass from Everett Golson (Two-Point Pass Conversion Failed)
3 plays, 13 yards, 0:49
29 40

TD 4:10
Trevor Siemian 6 Yd Run (Warren Long Run for Two-Point Conversion)
9 plays, 73 yards, 1:58
37 40

FG 0:19
Jack Mitchell 45 Yd Field Goal
9 plays, 44 yards, 1:09
40 40
ERRONEOUS

Last edited by Dudd; 09-11-2017 at 11:18 AM. Reason: and obviously I know the time matter, but **** you Brian Kelly
Kyle Shanahan don't need to know no stinking OT rules. Mario CRYSTALBALL is still unreal dumb Quote
09-11-2017 , 12:00 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Ames
Isn't that the type of response you would expect to justify the decision?
I would prefer he said that they gave up. That is what I assumed was going through his head at the time of the decision. It seems much worse if he actually thinks punting gives them the best chance to win.
Kyle Shanahan don't need to know no stinking OT rules. Mario CRYSTALBALL is still unreal dumb Quote
09-11-2017 , 01:29 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by BossmanJR
eagles score to go up 11 with 1:30 left and go for 2? ~never matters, but so random
https://www.bleedinggreennation.com/...t-nfl-redskins
Quote:
Philadelphia Eagles kicker Caleb Sturgis suffered a quad strain in his plant leg (though Les Bowen reports it’s hip flexor) and is expected to be out for “several” weeks, per NFL insider Ian Rapoport. Rapoport notes that the Eagles will try out free agent kickers this week.

The injury occurred during the Eagles’ Week 1 game against the Washington Redskins. Doug Pederson opted to go for a two-point conversion late in the game because he didn’t feel comfortable with Sturgis trying to attempt the kick.
Quote:
Originally Posted by abrahamovic
zydr zW xs xs xs zed s-5×5 ×se tu 6gz csc@-=4
can't argue with that
Kyle Shanahan don't need to know no stinking OT rules. Mario CRYSTALBALL is still unreal dumb Quote
09-11-2017 , 01:42 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by abrahamovic
zydr zW xs xs xs zed s-5×5 ×se tu 6gz csc@-=4
Quote:
SHY TO FCUK WITH UR SHORT GUN? L0NGER 3" INSTANTLY antisemitic

oatmeal automate father colonial writhe.
cyclic deviant winery lithograph scapular. expedition finance physik?
wash implore carborundum myrtle. kinesthesis mug back. too return lunchtime?
lefty quartermaster paint carriage honda pliers? swirly stout tragic upstair mythology contest. bedbug cottonwood churchyard helicopter analeptic,
agreeable stillwater stereoscopy. osgood appropriate biconnected clarendon aries

winifred,
.
Kyle Shanahan don't need to know no stinking OT rules. Mario CRYSTALBALL is still unreal dumb Quote
09-11-2017 , 04:37 PM
I got another one from the Bills/Jests I was sure of until I read a bunch online saying I was wrong...

Jets score TD to make it a 2-point game right around the beginning of the 4th. Bowles elects to go for two, they fail. Bills score a TD and go up by 11.

Message borders were saying Bowles should've kicked the PAT, and then when the Bills scored again, the Jets would only be down 10 instead of 11.

I argued that you have to go for two there...but I got shouted down by everybody lol.
Kyle Shanahan don't need to know no stinking OT rules. Mario CRYSTALBALL is still unreal dumb Quote
09-11-2017 , 04:42 PM
Well the Jets were down 9 after the Bills last TD + PAT, not 11. I think when you score a TD to go down 2, kicking vs. going for it is probably close at the start of the 4th quarter. In a defensive game like that one, I'd be more inclined to go for 2 because scoring possessions are less frequent. In a game where it's reasonably likely that the opponent could get 2 FG's in the rest of the game I think a PAT is reasonable.
Kyle Shanahan don't need to know no stinking OT rules. Mario CRYSTALBALL is still unreal dumb Quote
09-11-2017 , 04:57 PM
Dom, http://fivethirtyeight.com/features/...or-2-for-real/

According to that, you should always go for 2 when down 2 (except in the first half if you're really, really bad at 2-point conversions), ainec in the second half. Of all of the possibilities, being down by 2 is the clearest time you should go for 2.
Quote:
When a team is down 2, it should go for 2 — pretty much any time, but especially in the third quarter and beyond.

Last edited by gregorio; 09-11-2017 at 05:19 PM.
Kyle Shanahan don't need to know no stinking OT rules. Mario CRYSTALBALL is still unreal dumb Quote
09-11-2017 , 05:08 PM
Yeah, that's what I thought...and yes, I meant 9, not 11.
Kyle Shanahan don't need to know no stinking OT rules. Mario CRYSTALBALL is still unreal dumb Quote
09-11-2017 , 05:10 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dominic
Yeah, that's what I thought...and yes, I meant 9, not 11.
#neverforget
Kyle Shanahan don't need to know no stinking OT rules. Mario CRYSTALBALL is still unreal dumb Quote
09-11-2017 , 05:26 PM
Quote:
SHY TO FCUK WITH UR SHORT GUN? L0NGER 3" INSTANTLY antisemitic

oatmeal automate father colonial writhe.
cyclic deviant winery lithograph scapular. expedition finance physik?
wash implore carborundum myrtle. kinesthesis mug back. too return lunchtime?
lefty quartermaster paint carriage honda pliers? swirly stout tragic upstair mythology contest. bedbug cottonwood churchyard helicopter analeptic,
agreeable stillwater stereoscopy. osgood appropriate biconnected clarendon aries

winifred,
Quote:
Originally Posted by suzzer99
.


My favorite thread ever on 2+2!
Kyle Shanahan don't need to know no stinking OT rules. Mario CRYSTALBALL is still unreal dumb Quote
09-11-2017 , 06:53 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by gregorio
this is awesome
totally bookmarked for future in-game lols
god it also has charts with a time axis and expectation ranges, kinda aroused ngl

Quote:
The most common and significant mistakes by far are failing to go for 2 when down 4, 8 or 11 late in the game: Of 81 such clear-cut decisions, coaches got it right a combined zero times. They also kicked the extra point down 2 in the third quarter five times, when they clearly shouldn’t have, and once in the fourth(!) for good measure.
lol
Kyle Shanahan don't need to know no stinking OT rules. Mario CRYSTALBALL is still unreal dumb Quote
09-11-2017 , 07:08 PM
Wait, what? Go for two when down 4?
Kyle Shanahan don't need to know no stinking OT rules. Mario CRYSTALBALL is still unreal dumb Quote
09-11-2017 , 07:27 PM
Quote:
We’re going to go a lot further with this, but even this first cut of analysis reveals a couple of important cases where the conventional wisdom is wrong. In particular:

If you’re down 8 points after scoring a touchdown (with 10 minutes left), you should go for 2, because the difference between being down 7 points (if you make the extra point) and being down 6 points (if you convert the 2) is greater than the difference between being down 7 points and being down 8 points (if you miss the 2-point conversion). Note that this is backed up by the numbers but should also be apparent intuitively.

If you’re down 4 points after scoring a touchdown (with 10 minutes left), you should go for 2, because being down 2 points instead of 3 helps you more than being down 4 points instead of 3 hurts you. This one is a bit more counterintuitive, but if you think ahead, the second point means a future field goal could win the game (and if you don’t convert, you just have to adjust to go for winning touchdowns instead of tying field goals).

Failing to go for 2 in these situations turns out to be two of the most common, costly and clear-cut mistakes that even the best coaches make virtually every time.
.
Kyle Shanahan don't need to know no stinking OT rules. Mario CRYSTALBALL is still unreal dumb Quote
09-11-2017 , 07:44 PM
I can buy the 8 point one, what's the math on being down 3 vs 4? That seems like a pretty massive difference late in the game.

Does it also say if you score at the very end of the game down 1 you should go for 2 every time?
Kyle Shanahan don't need to know no stinking OT rules. Mario CRYSTALBALL is still unreal dumb Quote
09-11-2017 , 07:49 PM
I believe those are correct but hardly the most costly mistakes coaches regularly make
Kyle Shanahan don't need to know no stinking OT rules. Mario CRYSTALBALL is still unreal dumb Quote
09-11-2017 , 08:14 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by yeotaJMU
I can buy the 8 point one, what's the math on being down 3 vs 4? That seems like a pretty massive difference late in the game.

Does it also say if you score at the very end of the game down 1 you should go for 2 every time?
For 4 vs 3 vs 2, I think you have to factor in that coaches play like idiots when down 3 (i.e. being happy to take the FG and go into overtime rather than trying for TD) which the win probability stats take into account. If you have a coach that played smart, I think it would make sense to take the XP.
Kyle Shanahan don't need to know no stinking OT rules. Mario CRYSTALBALL is still unreal dumb Quote
09-11-2017 , 08:41 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by yeotaJMU
Does it also say if you score at the very end of the game down 1 you should go for 2 every time?
For most of the game, when down 1, go for 2 if you're > 50% converting; go for 1 if you're < 50% converting. In the last 25-30% of 4th quarter, always go for 1 when down 1.
Kyle Shanahan don't need to know no stinking OT rules. Mario CRYSTALBALL is still unreal dumb Quote
09-11-2017 , 09:17 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by gregorio
For most of the game, when down 1, go for 2 if you're > 50% converting; go for 1 if you're < 50% converting. In the last 25-30% of 4th quarter, always go for 1 when down 1.
Break-even is actually 47.5%, assuming league average kicker who makes 95% of XPs.

Also, need to account for how likely you are to win in overtime (i.e. is your team better or worse). The worse your team, the more you should go for 2.
Kyle Shanahan don't need to know no stinking OT rules. Mario CRYSTALBALL is still unreal dumb Quote
09-11-2017 , 09:25 PM
I'm just reading that off their graph. It seems pretty unambiguous about whether or not to go for 2 at the end of the game down by 1.

x-axis is minutes left in game 60 - 0; y-axis is purple/kick to orange/go for 2 (width of line is 40% 2-pt conversion rate at the bottom edge to 55% rate at top edge):



Quote:
One special case: when a team scores a touchdown late to narrow the score to 1 point and then a coach has to decide whether to go for an extra point and the tie or 2 points and the win. Amazingly, this is the one situation in which coaches have broken with orthodoxy and gone for 2 occasionally — even though the chart suggests that it often isn’t justified.

Whether to “go for the win” or not in this situation is intrinsically a pretty even decision — the difference between being up 1 and tied is the same as the difference between being down 1 and tied — and depends largely on how good your 2-point conversion unit is (note the tall lines in the -1 box). But toward the end of the game, remaining time becomes an extremely important factor. In particular, when your opponent is likely to get another possession and your team is not, going for 2 becomes something a coach probably shouldn’t do. This is because if the other team goes down 1, it may end up driving for a game-winning field goal with nothing to lose. Because the opponent is likely to take a lot of risks, go for it on fourth down, etc., those drives have a disproportionately high success rate. In this case, playing for the tie to get into overtime becomes the far better strategy.

Last edited by gregorio; 09-11-2017 at 09:30 PM.
Kyle Shanahan don't need to know no stinking OT rules. Mario CRYSTALBALL is still unreal dumb Quote
09-11-2017 , 11:55 PM
Chargers punted from Denver's 39 on 4th and 5 late in the first half down 14-7
Kyle Shanahan don't need to know no stinking OT rules. Mario CRYSTALBALL is still unreal dumb Quote
09-12-2017 , 02:37 PM
Hugh Jackson deserves some love for correctly going 4th&2 down 11. I wonder how many of the other 31 idiots would've kicked. O/U 29.5 with 100% Announcer approval rating imo.
Kyle Shanahan don't need to know no stinking OT rules. Mario CRYSTALBALL is still unreal dumb Quote

      
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