The new Stars VPP system got released today. I was figuring out how my own VPP/hand rates would be affected, and thought I might as well post the results.

My old Stars VPP hand is found in HEM. I assume its accurate. My understanding is that the 'New VPP per hand' as found in HEM is based on the 5x VPP system. As of 2010, FR will get 6x VPPs, and 6 max will get 5.5x.

All I have done is looked at the 'New Stars VPP per hand' column, (which is based on 5x), and multiplied by 1.2 for FR (to get to 6x), and 1.1 for 6 max (to get to 5.5x).

For 0.10/0.25

FR PL 1120 hands. Old rate 0.16. New rate 0.17
FR NL 192 hands. Old rate 0.27. New rate 0.23
6 max PL 609 hands. Old rate 0.25. New rate 0.28

For 0.25/0.50

FR PL 17161 hands: Old rate 0.32. New rate 0.32
FR NL 26176 hands. Old rate 0.29. New rate 0.29
6 max PL 32647 hands. Old rate 0.34. New rate 0.4

For 0.5/1

FR PL 39290 hands. Old rate 0.61. New rate 0.59
FR NL 29191 hands. Old rate 0.47. New rate 0.47
6 max PL 46313 hands. Old rate 0.54. New rate 0.64

For 1/2

FR PL 7424 hands. Old rate 0.85. New rate 0.84
FR NL 16154 hands. Old rate 0.74. New rate 0.73
6 max PL 9830 hands. Old rate 0.76. New rate 0.9

For 2/4

6 max PL 1366 hands. Old rate 0.86. New rate 1.24

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Quite possible I've made an error somewhere but I dont think so, as its a relatively easy calculation. If I've made an error, it'll affect everything, as they were all calculated the same way. Can anyone confirm HEMs 'New Stars VPP per hand' column is based on 5x VPPs?

Overall, pretty good changes I think. Fairly minor decreases for FR, and decent increases for 6 max.

Edit: I've screwed up the title. Buzz or T24, can you please make it read 'New and old PokerStars VPP/hand rates for PLO8 and NL08. Thanks

How can it be decreasing if they are giving more?

Can anybody post vpp rate comparisons for L08?

More overall. FR gets a small cut overall. The increase in 6m is bigger than the cut to FR.

..

Your post was right I think T24, except that 6 max will now gets 5.5 VPP per $1 of rake. FR wil get 6 VPP per $1. Even though 6 max actually gets a lower RB %age, it will be much easier to rack up VPPs quicker with it.

As an example
$1 rake - 9 players. 6 VPPs total = 0.66 per player
$1 rake - 6 players. 5.5 VPPs total = 0.92 per player

Thanks for changing the title.

Hmm, so if I were giving an average amount of play -- not SN -- this is what I would expect to receive if I bought

$215 Step 4 ticket/tournament entry = 13500 pts

which I find to be the optimal purchase at my pay grade. You could also get a $285 bonus for 25000 points or $650 bonus for 50000 points. But if you're willing to play a $215 anyway then this seems like the best value.

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$1125 in rake paid * 6 pts/$1 = 6750 pts * 2 (GOLD multiplier) = 13500 pts

$215/$1125 = 19.1% RB at GOLD

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$900 in rake paid * 6 pts/$1 = 5400 pts * 2.5 (PLATINUM mulitplier) = 13500 pts

$215/$900 = 23.8% RB at PLATINUM

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Plus you can take advantage of the weekly freerolls if you like.

Please correct the maths as you see fit.

Any word on whether it will take more points to buy stuff in the future? Usually when a company give more *points they devalue the points in an inflationary spiral. I'm thinking of frequent flyer miles but there are many examples.

I also noticed that Stars is lowering the requirements to get the multipliers. For example, you'll only need 750 points to get Silver starting in January, etc.

It looks like 1000FPP ~= $15 is the conversion rate that Stars banks on, e.g. the Step tickets are priced around about that. Btw depending on how many free tables you want to play, parlaying up from 500FPP=$7.50 to a Step4 ticket is also an option!

Another option at this rate is satellites to the daily $11 - where one seat (or T$11) is given for each 700FPP in the prizepool. That would take too long if you want to convert 13500FPP though!

The VIP bonus credits seem to be not worth it , as you say, unless you manage to get to Supernova for the 100000FPP = $1500 credit. I guess people would take the 50000FPP=$650 credit if they already maxed out the number of tables they were comfortable with on cash games, and did not want to have to play tournaments to get another $100 of value.

I was going to post something about the VPP change. Along the same lines...how do you think the play is going to change for each site? I'm sure it's safe to assume full tilt will be losing a little volume??? However, I was wondering... since I'm guessing the more knowledgeable players (almost always the better ones) will be moving over to poker stars in pursuit of supernova, and supernova elite, as it's quite obvious Poker Stars is aiming at the low-mid stakes mid volume grinders to choose them over the rakeback from other sites. That being said, do you guys feel the games could become softer on tilt and other sites next year, with them losing said decent players, or do you think no noticeable change in skill level will take place? Just a random conversation piece, not trying to be over analytical here...

i am playing mainly omaha8 limit.and i hope my calculations are wrong
but at the moment i think i would lose almost 30% in rakeback playing 1/2 fr.
has any of you guys figured allready out how the new system would effect limit omaha8.my guess would be that limit 6max would stay the same

ich bin - could you give a quick how to on how to pull these stats outta HEM?

No issue for me.. sites other than FT don't have enough selection at O8, and FT doesn't give rakeback since I created my account before I knew what rakeback was.. case closed, I would assume a lot of other people are in the same boat

That sounds about right, with regards to your RB %ages. I think its fairly well known that for anything under SN, Full Tilt's flat 27% is better. Once you make SN, its becomes fairly superior. Around 33% I think. I can see why this is an unappealing prospect to most people: if you worked all year and ended up only getting to say 90k VPP, you would have probabably worked a little harder than you wanted getting that far, and still fallen short. When Full Tilt, will give you 27% flat, its simply not worth the gamble for people who might not make it. This is because you lose so much value by missing the 100k VPP milestone.

However, you can still get good value for your FPPs.

That ticket you mention gives you $215/13500 = 0.0159 cents per FPP
The best item in the store is the $4000 bonus: $4000/250k = 0.016 cents per FPP. (The concierge service is actually marginally better, but its pretty negligible.

So although you will miss big milestone value, your FPPs are worth almost exactly the same.

No word on whether the value of FPPs will change. I would strongly think not; there would be a big backlash. I find it hard to belive they would promote the changes, let everyone work out what they were worth, then completely rewrite that by changing their value elsewhere.

I dont know what would happen to 6 max, but your calculations about FR are probabaly right. It gets massacred by the new system. Someone who made SN under the old system at 1/2 and 2/4 FR limit was getting ~60% rackback. It just happened to sit in a sweet spot where it really took advantage of the old system. Now its much more in line with the other games.