I've played LO8 on Stars at the micros and in HORSE in the good old days but never sat at a ring game live before last night.

After I went busto in the Friday night tourney at the local casino (KK loses to AQs), I sat at a $2-$6 spread LO8 game. I did fine, but I was curious how to deal with some of the play I witnessed.

By the time I sat down, many folks had a number of free drinks under their belt and would do things that I consider -EV play such as reraise or rereraise with nut low (yeah, they got 6th'd). I'm no expert but to me that seemed odd. Raising and reraising the flop ($6 ea time) with hands like KK42 single suited. Even AA79 rainbow was a reraise in this game.

So how should I play against this sort of situation? To be honest, I nitted up and tried to play suited aces w/low cards, rundowns, etc. I had good results, but mostly because my draws came in. Doubled up in 1.5 hours (+$100). I'm not sure if this was just variance or if I did the right thing. Felt right, but being new I'm open to hear what you all say.

Thanks!

Solid and with courage.

Buzz

Ramming and jamming with the nut low and hands like KK24 and AA79 (..you didn't say what the flop was?) doesn't jump out as wild play to me.

But just going with the idea that it was a loose and reckless game: you want to give yourself a chance to make big hands in a game like that. You should want to get involved with hands that play well multiway and maybe not so much with AQT5os type of hands.

You probably don't want to be nitty. It's not the worst thing in the world, but you'll miss value. And if the game is loose/careless you won't really get any chances to take advantage of a tight image.

haha, yup

Thanks for the advice, all.


That was pre-flop ramming and jamming.

I had two big hands, one Ac3c3s5s where I hit a wheel and scooped. The other was Ad4d6s7h. Spiked another wheel and the 2-6 straight for a 3/4 win. Both hands were limped multiway pots pre. After I left the table one of the regs at the NLHE tourney who was at the table said I had to be more careful, especially with the A335 type hands. He was folded in that hand, so I don't think it was sour grapes.

So am I speculating with these hands or are they worth a look at a min bet pre?

Thinking of heading back tomorrow for another shot.

Thanks again for the advice.

Both hands lack high card strength, but both are playable - but you still need to find the right cards on the board and the wrong cards in the hands of your opponents, and you need opponents who will continue even though they have the wrong cards to do so.

As starting hands go, Ac3c3s5s is quite a bit better than Ad4d6s7h, especially for a full game. The latter has those two middle cards, the six and the seven, neither of which fits well with the strongest card in your hand (the ace).

As it turns out, you did better with Ad4d6s7h than with Ac3c3s5s, but over the long haul you should expect to do better with Ac3c3s5s.

They would both be playable hands for me in the game you have described.

It's the particular mix of players that make a game good or bad. The mix will likely have changed when you return. Good luck.

Buzz

TY Buzz. The other table was full of regulars, some who I was told were pretty strong players. I will eventually run into them.

Other than TJ Cloutier's book, what others are worth a read? I know I have a ton to learn but I enjoy the challenge of this game more than NLHE.

You're welcome

Here's a link to our book containment thread:

http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/44...thread-737104/

There's a lot to learn. I'm still learning.

Buzz

OP,

You mentioned rundowns -
they are not very good, especially not the middling ones, which are terrible.
even relatively high rundowns like QJT9 will probably lose you money in a game with lots of preflop raising.

Try to see the flop for cheap with these hands. otherwise, don't play them.
bigger cards, especially with a suited A or a pair of kings, are more powerful.

Best hands to have in this game are the A2's with a suited A, accompanied by a face card (K is best) or another wheel card (3 is best). having both make possibly the best starter (AK32) except hands with AA. AA2-any is obviously a monster. you should be pushing the action really hard on low boards, trying to give your aces a chance to win you the high. the nut low/low draw serves as insurance.

As for your expectations -
you're playing a low stakes game. it's possible that no player in the game will be winning long term due to high rake. don't be disappointed if you break even after a couple of months. it actually means you'd be a solid winner had there been no rake taken.

TY Buzz and str8. Appreciate the linky and the advice. I really appreciate it.

I recently bought two books which I recommend.

1. Mastering Omaha Poker by Mark Tenner and Lou Krieger.

2. Pot-Limit Omah Poker, The Big Play Strategy by Jeff Hwang.

The second book offers sections on PLO, PLO8 and FLO8 and is a very good book.

Any information "Buzz" or "Str8 or better" (among others) give you is worth listening to.

Middle card run downs are just BAD in o8 and should be avoided at all costs.. I might complete in the sb if no raise but besides that they should be tossed..

If you are in late position with a suited A2 or A3 with good kickers you should raise for value.. If you have a two way hand you should raise for value and to gin the high..

You should bet your two way nut draws on the flop very very aggressively .. mainly for value but sometimes to fold out better behind you.. You do this because you want to build a big pot when you have the highest equity regardless of if you hit.. You cant control that..

Many bad players only bet aggressively when they have hit a big hand regardless of their equity and are passive when they have the best equity. Remember that top set against a wrap in omaha is a dog..

So you've seen me play...

Thanks for the tips. They are very helpful and will definitely improve my play.

I have Ray Zee's book on the way. That should help too.

I plan on playing Friday afternoon before the Friday night tourney. If I busto the tourney I'll play some more. The Suncoast spreads O8 on Tues/Fri/Sun and it is a couple of miles from the house.

Thought I'd update my status since you've been kind enough to help my play.

I have played a grand total of six sessions. Not sure of the hours, but it is around 16 or so. So I'm still in a ridiculously small sample size.

I'm up over 50 big bets in the $2-$6 spread limit game I play in. Worst downswing was a -9bb session. Today's session was +25bb (it was a good day).

I have Ray Zee's book and the Tenner/Krieger book and have read them both. I have to reread sections after sessions to make sure I played ok, but they have been helpful.

I still make some mistakes, mostly not raising when I should. I have trouble raising preflop, even w/A,3,4,5 rainbow in position. I sure need to fix that problem...