Not really a tough spot or anything, just curious as to how we should be isolating bad players and short stacks. I've been trying to be more aggressive preflop because its so easy to fall into the bad habit of a lot of limping or limp calling in big o and basically just playing bingo at that point.

V1 (utg) - 30s reg. Haven't played many times with him before. Seems OK the times I have. Has been getting a pretty bad run of cards and only has ~$300 in front. Has been somewhat aggro.

V2 (utg +1) - 50s reg. Not very good. Certainly not the worst, but bad none the less. Over values A2 a lot. Plays extremely slow. Every decision takes 30 sec +. In general, pretty annoying to play with. Has been on a roller coaster ride with his stack. But currently has around $250 after donking off quite a bit.

V3 (SB) - older reg. Very nice guy, but not very good. Also over plays A2. Plays pretty passive almost all the time. Sitting on $500

We are 6 handed.

Hero (bu) covers.
AJT84

V1 limps, v2 pots to $25. 1 call. Hero 3-bets to $75. V3 calls unexpectedly. V1 calls. V2 ships. Hero pots. Others fold.

Thoughts?

Isn't it easier to just outplay them post-flop with your skill and position advantage and knowing their range is pretty much "overplaying A2"?


Are you 3-betting to build the pot because they will fold too easily on any flop that isn't 3 low cards? This should be at least a little less likely if they're shortstacked. Anyway, if super-tanker V2 is all of a sudden shoving, almost has to be AA. That leaves one ace for the rest of the table so I guess potting is ok given all the dead money but not really liking my chances heads-up.

Certainly a more optimal play than calling off 1/4 of your stack and then folding getting 4:1 on a call like v1 did.

maybe this is a mistake on my part, but coming from a nlhe background, it is much easier to play against and range 1 or 2 villains than against 4 or 5.

i am 3 betting to thin the field. although open raises get very little pre flop respect in this game, 3 bets get quite a bit more. i also 3-bet to $75 to give myself a good price... basically getting a little more fold equity than i actually deserved a less than pot bet. honestly, i think in most spots, i could have raised even less and gotten the same result.

I think 3-betting pre is a clear mistake considering hero's hand, position and alleged skill advantage. Everything supports flatting.

3-betting something like AK3xx without a nut suit is a completely different matter.

Care to elaborate?

Not a mistake but sometimes the more the merrier in O8 - especially when you have nutted hands and position and fish. I just think you have a pretty good read on your opponents in this game so, combined with position, you don't need to give all that up and battle it out pre-flop.


To me, that supports what amok said about 3-betting with non-nutted hands. Do it with hands that have less equity multi-way (not to the extent that you're completely unbalanced, but that seems like less of a concern here). You want spades to stick around in the 1st hand, but not the 2nd.

A hand that plays better HU and plays better with shallow stacks.

This is the wrong stack size for an ISO, you're creating a jam or fold spot on flop. v1 should never be calling 75 folding for 225 more lol.

I do think there are situations where 3b ISO is useful, say you are deep and in position on someone who opens way too often or is spewy post. You should 3b smaller, it has the same effect on anyone cold calling and keeps the spr higher.

It's probably never wrong to just limp/call pre with your entire playing range so that there are more streets for fish to make mistakes, so the blinds have to play a bad hand oop, so the nit doesn't get to fold a marginal hand pre, etc

I only use 3b in situations where I'm really deep and ip, maybe take a shot at isolating a total drooler at 100bb

Haven't played much big O, but is this a strong enough hand to iso with anyways? wouldn't it be better suited with more counterfeit protection, what if the flop comes low and you have the hi end with a weak low. Don't you run the risk of getting quartered since they overplay A-2 and may have the same hi as you?