Playing the other night on a crazy table. Took a couple bad beats and ran into this gem while on tilt:

Poker Stars $0.02/$0.05 Pot Limit Omaha Hi/Lo - 6 players
The Official 2+2 Hand Converter Powered By DeucesCracked.com

Hero (BTN): $3.88
SB: $9.95
BB: $1.26
UTG: $13.10
MP: $3.16
CO: $10.74

Pre Flop: ($0.07) Hero is BTN with J Q Q 9
UTG calls $0.05, MP calls $0.05, 1 fold, Hero calls $0.05, 1 fold, BB raises to $0.27, UTG calls $0.22, MP calls $0.22, Hero calls $0.22

Flop: ($1.10) Q J 6 (4 players)
BB checks, UTG checks, MP checks, Hero bets $1.05, BB folds, UTG folds, MP calls $1.05

Turn: ($3.20) 8 (2 players)
MP checks, Hero bets $2.56 all in, MP calls $1.84 all in

River: ($6.88) 5 (2 players - 2 are all in)

Final Pot: $6.88
Hero mucks J Q Q 9
MP shows 7 A 7 8 (HI: a flush, Ace high; LO: 8,7,6,5,A)
MP wins $3.29
MP wins $3.29
(Rake: $0.30)

I know I have no business playing this hand to a pre-flop raise, but how terrible is villains play? Can he justify his play? His play seems plain crazy to me, but I seem to run into this stuff a lot......just not sure if I am missing something or of its just the micro stakes play.

its microstakes man you cant expect anything more from these people. if someone said hey ill bet you 2.50 that your flush wont hit id be like ok whatever its 2$

lol

you basically got it right. u know u know u should fold preflop but you are tempted cos it looks pretty. i feel that too sometimes. then after the flop the wild man sucks out on you 4ROLLZ. u got the guy to put all his money in as a pretty big underdog and thats all u can ask for.

Thanks man.

I guess a better question would have been where can I get an Omaha 8b odds calculator?

I find these to be a tremendous help for Holdem. With Omaha I can never define my exact odds when I take a beat that seems bad.

http://www.propokertools.com/simulator is a good one

http://twodimes.net/poker/?g=o&b=&d=...%0A3s+5s+6h+9h or http://www.texasholdem-poker.com/odd...tor/omaha-hilo

choose the format u prefer

Hi,

As for an odds calculator here is an online one:

http://www.propokertools.com/simulat...tionEditor.jsp

It covers Holdem, Omaha, OHL, and Razz

As for calling with those pockets, I really don't have a problem with it as you have position and a clue about poker.

Yes, MP is a spazz. IMO, your hand is better than his actually. Unfortunately in this case, he got a piece of the flop.

I like the pot bet on flop to get out the lows, value and the information. Unfortunately, someone called and “hit” the flop somehow. But after you are called you have to put him on a flush draw of some sort – as for it’s strength who knows.

How does this guy play normally? Expect other’s to bet his hands, “trapping”? Or the general calling station Bingo player? I noticed a lot in PLO8 5c, they often “think” themselves “clever” by not betting their hands and “trapping”. Often ending up with no pot or outdrawn.

The main thing at this level is that a lot of players are learning the game still. This is what you have to always keep in mind.

I may sound like the tinfoil hat wearing type but this is Riverstars you're playing on and the flushes hit way too often at this site.

When the low card hits on turn, I'm slowing down. You don't have low and he's not going to fold. Normally, I would tend to pot too but not in this scenario with the newbie.

I would check right behind. Your flop bet got it HU and the pot is big enough.

If you had A2, A3, A4 as well, I would continue to pot.

As LV said, you got your money in good but the spazz got lucky.

My two cents.

It's hard to know what people at this level are playing. (There's less logic involved than at higher levels). If we give one opponent a hand in the top quarter, a second opponent a hand in the top half, and a third opponent a hand in the top three quarters: http://www.propokertools.com/simulat...5&h4=25%25&h5=
Hero with J Q Q 9 has roughly the same pot equity as any of the three opponents. To me, that looks very much like a fair gamble. Hero, with about 25% equity, has about a 25% chance of ending up with the winning hand. Meanwhile, because of the money already in the pot Hero is getting slightly better than the required 3 to 1 pot odds. (However, those pot odds are very deceptive since the betting is not over). Although I'd prefer to see the flop as cheaply as possible with this starting hand, it would honestly be difficult for me not to call the raise.
Then against these same opponents, before there is any action on the flop, it looks like Hero has lept to a huge advantage.
http://www.propokertools.com/simulat...5&h4=25%25&h5=
And so, after three checks, Hero bets. Seems right to me. I'd only bet about 60% of the pot, because that is consistent with how I'd bet various other hands here, and I think it should be enough to get rid of anyone who really doesn't belong here, but who might luck out and end up outdrawing Hero, or who might end up with a low for half the pot. (Other knowledgeable posters here disagree with betting anything less than the maximum in this situation).

Hero surely has the best hand (the nuts) if the game were to stop at this point - but the jack on the flop decreases Hero's chances of winning with a full house, the two hearts make it tempting for an opponent with a flush draw, and the QJ combo makes if tempting for an opponent to draw for various straights. Hero has to bet here, in my opinion, to protect his vulnerable hand.

Hero gets one caller, who presumably has a flush draw plus maybe a straight draw plus maybe a back-door low draw. (But at this level, who knows for sure what range of cards MP holds).
If Hero had only bet 60% of the pot after the flop, then, considering MP's stack size, Hero could put MP all in for 9 to 4 pot odds rather than the more favorable 11 to 4 pot odds MP is actually getting for calling here. I don't know if that makes enough of a difference to induce MP to fold here or not. From what we can see if we double dummy the hands, MP has 6 scoop outs, 12 half pot outs (but MP doesn't know that) and 22 bricks.

By calling here, considering the actual amounts involved, Villain figures to
win
6*504+12*320/2-22*184=3024+1920-4048=+896.

By calling here, if Hero had only bet 60% of the pot after the flop, Villain
figures to win
6*465+12*242/2-22*223=2790+1452-4906=-664.

Is Villain sharp enough to know that the call on the turn is absolutely correct the way things are? Would Villain be sharp enough to know that the call on the turn would have a negative expectation if the flop bet (2nd round) had only been 60% of the flop? I don't know. I don't know how logical the players are at this level. But I can guarantee some opponents at higher levels are sharp enough to know the difference.
And then it turns out Villain catches one of his six scoop outs. Tough luck.
I initially thought that, but after running a number of simulations (only two of which have urls listed here) I'm not so sure. After careful consideration, it looks to me like Hero should call the pre-flop raise.
It's not terrible at all.
I don't know what his considerations were on the earlier betting rounds. He was absolutely correct to call the turn bet.
I think some of both.

Just my opinion.

Buzz

Was curious about the odds on the flop.


Ran it on ProPokerTools

Your hand had 62.2% equity opposed to his 37.8% equity.

On the turn:

Your hand was 70% to 30% for his.

Can't resist but so typical Jokerstars.

Thanks to everyone who posted and sent links....I will be sure to check them out. Big thanks to Buzz.......never expected an analysis that detailed!