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Old 03-07-2012, 06:24 PM   #51
Fear Itself
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Re: Why Legalizing Drugs Is A Bad Idea

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Originally Posted by DblBarrelJ View Post
This is untrue.

Narcotics divisions do not make up close to 50% of police officers in any jurisdiction I've seen, and even if they did they have skills such as undercover experience and surveillance skills that could be converted to numerous other types of investigations.

Child Predator stings come to mind, as they are blown sometimes by officers inexperienced with UC work.
Yeah but if drugs are legalized I would assume violence would decrease significantly. A significant decrease in violence would naturally cause a significant decrease in the need for law enforcement.
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Old 03-07-2012, 06:31 PM   #52
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Re: Why Legalizing Drugs Is A Bad Idea

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if all drugs are legalized like 50% of cops would be focusing their expertise on more important things.
fyp
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Old 03-07-2012, 06:41 PM   #53
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Re: Why Legalizing Drugs Is A Bad Idea

Your assumption is likely wrong.

In my experience, drug dealers are inherently violent individuals. While I don't agree with the article that illegal drug dealing will occur on any level to raise concern, I also think its dumb to think that these people are just going to go away.

If anything I think drug dealing actually reduces violence, because these otherwise violent criminals have a relatively non violent way to make money. I think it's a fallacy to assume they're going to go get real jobs.

They're going to take up more violent property crimes etc.
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Old 03-07-2012, 06:51 PM   #54
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Re: Why Legalizing Drugs Is A Bad Idea

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If anything I think drug dealing actually reduces violence, because these otherwise violent criminals have a relatively non violent way to make money. I think it's a fallacy to assume they're going to go get real jobs.

They're going to take up more violent property crimes etc.
What kind of drugs are you talking about? What kind of dealing level are you talking about?

The high profit margins attract people in the drug trade. Because missing contract protection (because it is illegal) most of them turn violent to establish credentials and a reputation. ("Do not **** with me")
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Old 03-07-2012, 07:10 PM   #55
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Re: Why Legalizing Drugs Is A Bad Idea

I definitely disagree with dealers being violent. I've known quite a few, as a lot of my family has at one time or another sold drugs as their sole source of income. None of them are violent, a few buddies of mine have too, and they're not violent. That said, they don't deal with the ridiculous stuff, usually just weed, coke, crack and prescription pills, which is probably what the majority deal in.

I think though, as a profession people involved in drugs are generally more violent than legal professions, if we're talking about really serious dealers making big money, but I think that's the nature of being involved in that stuff at that level. Everyone is scamming everyone, theft is common, and the law can't handle disputes so the only option is violence. I think violence is a symptom of the real problem which is forcing an industry under ground and outside the scope of the law. Much like shadiness in poker.

I also believe that most dealers do it because it's easy money, not because they're bad people. I don't think dealers would automatically start stealing because they couldn't deal any more. Maybe the bigger time ones, but most people know that stealing is a **** ton of hassle and just not worth it. I think when the law forces you to be a "criminal" in its eyes, it's a lot easier to do things that are "criminal."

Last edited by Malefiicus; 03-07-2012 at 07:19 PM.
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Old 03-07-2012, 07:13 PM   #56
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Re: Why Legalizing Drugs Is A Bad Idea

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Originally Posted by DblBarrelJ View Post
Your assumption is likely wrong.

In my experience, drug dealers are inherently violent individuals. While I don't agree with the article that illegal drug dealing will occur on any level to raise concern, I also think its dumb to think that these people are just going to go away.

If anything I think drug dealing actually reduces violence, because these otherwise violent criminals have a relatively non violent way to make money. I think it's a fallacy to assume they're going to go get real jobs.

They're going to take up more violent property crimes etc.
This is just plain silly.
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Old 03-07-2012, 07:13 PM   #57
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Re: Why Legalizing Drugs Is A Bad Idea

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Originally Posted by DblBarrelJ View Post
Your assumption is likely wrong.

In my experience, drug dealers are inherently violent individuals. While I don't agree with the article that illegal drug dealing will occur on any level to raise concern, I also think its dumb to think that these people are just going to go away.

If anything I think drug dealing actually reduces violence, because these otherwise violent criminals have a relatively non violent way to make money. I think it's a fallacy to assume they're going to go get real jobs.

They're going to take up more violent property crimes etc.
wat...that's absurd.

during the prohibiton of alcohol were crime rates lower or higher than after the prohibition of alchohol?
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Old 03-07-2012, 07:18 PM   #58
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Re: Why Legalizing Drugs Is A Bad Idea

ummm yeah this article is... ummm... well rets gonna tard IMO
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Old 03-07-2012, 07:20 PM   #59
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Re: Why Legalizing Drugs Is A Bad Idea

anyone that doesn't understand that marijuana should be legalized is either woefully misinformed or is a complete and utter idiot.

i know of no intelligent person that cannot be converted to supporting the decriminalization of marijuana after being presented with the facts and having a proper discussion and being led down a path of rational thought.

and yet here we are, with politicians failing to address this issue with our society while more and more minorities are locked up into private prisons for non-violent drug charges.

i wonder why? hmmm...

OBAMA 2012!!! immoral, brainwashed morons.
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Old 03-07-2012, 07:22 PM   #60
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Re: Why Legalizing Drugs Is A Bad Idea

The drug dealers I've known have all been pretty chill.
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Old 03-07-2012, 07:26 PM   #61
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Re: Why Legalizing Drugs Is A Bad Idea

The drug dealers I've known have all been pretty violent.

Sample size?
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Old 03-07-2012, 07:27 PM   #62
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Re: Why Legalizing Drugs Is A Bad Idea

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anyone that doesn't understand that marijuana should be legalized is either woefully misinformed or is a complete and utter idiot.
Absolutely.
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Old 03-07-2012, 07:30 PM   #63
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Re: Why Legalizing Drugs Is A Bad Idea

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The drug dealers I've known have all been pretty hostile.
... towards you.

And you know why?
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Old 03-07-2012, 07:33 PM   #64
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Re: Why Legalizing Drugs Is A Bad Idea

LMAO calling punches, kicks, stabbing and gun pulling "hostility"
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Old 03-07-2012, 07:39 PM   #65
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Re: Why Legalizing Drugs Is A Bad Idea

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LMAO calling punches, kicks, stabbing and gun pulling "hostility"
I call it reciprocity.

Although there might be some violent criminals involved in the drug trade, the street level is certainly not inherently violent. Others and me have pointed out where the violence is coming from.

From your enforcement perspective that does not phase you though, am I right?
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Old 03-07-2012, 07:40 PM   #66
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Re: Why Legalizing Drugs Is A Bad Idea

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wat...that's absurd.

during the prohibiton of alcohol were crime rates lower or higher than after the prohibition of alchohol?
So there should be a huge spike in violent crime since the start of the War on Drugs, right? Well, the opposite happened.

DBJ hasn't sold me on his theory yet, but crime rates during prohibition aren't a refutation of it either.
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Old 03-07-2012, 07:44 PM   #67
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Re: Why Legalizing Drugs Is A Bad Idea

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So there should be a huge spike in violent crime since the start of the War on Drugs, right? Well, the opposite happened.
OMG

just type in Narco Violencia into Google.

NSFW

Spoiler:


There is alot more gruesome stuff.
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Old 03-07-2012, 07:44 PM   #68
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Re: Why Legalizing Drugs Is A Bad Idea

My basic point is that there is a legit moral argument for drug legalization.

However I do believe America has a drug problem. I just think evidence has shown that the War on Drugs isn't an effective way of dealing with what amounts to a public health concern.

That being said, I refuse to participate in this charade that drug dealers are merely businessmen, oppressed by a government.

They are opportunistic criminals. Remove the opportunity to profit from the drug trade, they'll merely find another easy money trade to engage in, which is likely much more violent than dealing.
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Old 03-07-2012, 07:46 PM   #69
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Re: Why Legalizing Drugs Is A Bad Idea

I like how he portrays the drug dealer as some evil person. I smoke weed occasionally the dealer is a good friend of mine AKA my roommate. He doesn't force anything on me. It is really simple and cheap to get my weed.

Also legalizing drugs won't change who does what. People who seek out things like shrooms or acid will do so. Legalizing acid isn't going to create a huge increase in users. I will still be hesitant to do shrooms or heroine regardless of its legality because it doesn't change the actual substance.

Edit: also people are already on lots of drugs. It isn't fair that people can legally abuse things like adderall but can't do weed if they want. I know so many people who do things like xanax or adderall. It's not like legalizing the drugs will even change much.
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Old 03-07-2012, 07:46 PM   #70
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Re: Why Legalizing Drugs Is A Bad Idea

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I call it reciprocity.
Of course you do lol

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Old 03-07-2012, 07:46 PM   #71
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Re: Why Legalizing Drugs Is A Bad Idea

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So there should be a huge spike in violent crime since the start of the War on Drugs, right? Well, the opposite happened.

DBJ hasn't sold me on his theory yet, but crime rates during prohibition aren't a refutation of it either.
You're going to have to look south of Texas. During prohibition, the major players were located in the US, I believe. They vied for power and control right here in our streets.

These days, most of the major players are located outside of the United States, in Mexico and South/Central America. I haven't even looked at the historical violence levels for those areas, but I'd imagine that's where you'll find your spike.

Last edited by Ineedaride2; 03-07-2012 at 07:50 PM. Reason: tl;dr: we outsourced our violence.
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Old 03-07-2012, 07:47 PM   #72
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Re: Why Legalizing Drugs Is A Bad Idea

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Originally Posted by DblBarrelJ View Post

That being said, I refuse to participate in this charade that drug dealers are merely businessmen, oppressed by a government.

They are opportunistic criminals. Remove the opportunity to profit from the drug trade, they'll merely find another easy money trade to engage in, which is likely much more violent than dealing.
Sure you are. You still need motivation for your job.
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Old 03-07-2012, 07:49 PM   #73
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Re: Why Legalizing Drugs Is A Bad Idea

I don't think I have ever met a violent drug dealer.
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Old 03-07-2012, 07:49 PM   #74
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Re: Why Legalizing Drugs Is A Bad Idea

They're businesspeople but they're not being oppressed by big government, government is handing them an easy way to make money as long as they are willing to take a few risks like jail time and dealing with violence.

Drugs become legalized, all those drug dealers all over the country are gonna be out of work, that profit is going to go to Wal-Mart and big Pharma.
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Old 03-07-2012, 07:50 PM   #75
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Re: Why Legalizing Drugs Is A Bad Idea

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NSFW

Spoiler:
non violent pharmaceutical retailers IMHO
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