You had double the money and your opponent was Donald Trump. Nothing short of actual vote rigging makes this anything short of gross incompetence. Please stop trying to make the **** in our mouths taste like bubble gum. We don't appreciate it.

So either provide proof of wide spread vote rigging (which didn't happen sorry!) or accept that we need a major rethink of our tactics as a party. Wishing for the era of Democratic dominance in the legislature when everyone was collegial isn't a strategy for the current political metagame. This is a war and we need to grow up and start treating it like one.

We need to get a lot more realistic about how we see the world in a hurry. It's not enough to just call your opponent a racist/sexist/monster and just wait for everyone to vote against that. You have to destroy his entire political party. The only way to do that is to start at the bottom and contest EVERYTHING. Spend money on ****ty local races, POUR money into state level races, and start asking the left leaning marketing gods out there what they think our messaging should look like.

And the next time some hapless Democrat tries to stop us from having a public option in our Health Plan that person needs to be investigated by the FBI and the IRS in an almost definitely illegal way. They need to be facing the full force and power of the party, the offices that party controls, and every activist that can be turned on with an email blast. There is tolerable disloyalty and there is being a traitor. We need to rediscover how to play this game. That persons kids should need bodyguards like Megyn Kelly's did.

EDIT: Next time if we can't find a likeable governor let's just run one of the smarter celebrities. Not sure which one, but charisma is the one non negotiable thing a nominee for a major political party has to have.

BoredSocial, I kind of agree with you, but you're under arrest... for extremely bad poasting.

I sorta draw the line at threatening Megyn Kelly's kids, but I'm on board for the rest of it.

sure

whining

The whole array of excuses all in one post, with a bonus appeal to the popular vote moral victory

more whining

We've seen these two excuses before, and a popular vote victory!

yep

So what's your point again?

Seems like a dubious hypothesis to claim due to it's absoluteness. Supporting evidence?

good day

I'm down for threatening people's kids if it gets our healthcare system un****ed. I'm down for KILLING their kids if it will get healthcare un****ed. We're talking about 6% of US GDP here. I get that 'you can't put a price on human life blah blah blah...' but it's a LOT of money. Oh and people are dying right now because of how crappy our healthcare system is.

At a certain point the ends really do justify the means.

I thought dems wouldn't go so low as to threaten the lives of republicans' children, let alone following through and KILLING them. I don't understand how killing children = getting healthcare un****ed.

You're saying they're willing to go very low to achieve their ends, and so must we. But we can't. Dems are unable, and incapable, of doing what the right does without becoming them in the process, I believe.

Democrats who are not willing to filibuster appointees or murder their opponents' children are part of the problem.

Democrats who aren't primarily concerned with winning are the problem. You gave up your right to go to heaven when you got into politics.

Wil and BoredSocial by TKO. Max Cut just call it a day man. Also nice to see others recognizing DVaut's apologist nonsense correctly recognized as a terrible take mostly devoid of reality and critical thinking.

Another post devoid of substance. Thanks, but I'll just keep posting if and when I feel like it. Feel free to report. This thread is defacto troll containment.

I think the Democrats can and should be tougher without rising to the level of "the ends justify the means" and doing crazy stuff like threatening kids. We can start filibustering more appointees and rejecting more Trump's craziness and be less polite for sure, but we don't want to go full Macchiavellian. That's when you become fascists too, and then you've actually justified the fascism of your opponents and legitimized it. That's not the right path.

We can start by attacking voting mechanisms that don't favor one person one vote, pushing hard to get rid of Electoral College, get independent commissions instead of gerrymandering, and a new Voting Rights Act since the old one was gutted by the courts.

We've been doing all of that and have been getting our ass kicked for it. I'm cool with pushing back on voter disenfranchisement. I'm happy to continue to lobby states to join the popular vote compact. However, we should be doing that while gerrymandering the hell out of our strongholds. Republicans play by the rules as they exist and constantly try to push to make the rules more advantageous to them. Democrats simply try to play fair, it ain't working out very well.

I agree Dems have been too weak in dealing with Rep tactics. I wont pretend to know what's needed, but seems like part of the failing is not getting the message out effectively enough (for whatever reasons) to raise concern to a critical level (SCOTUS nom as prime example, even though there was plenty of ineffective screaming about it).

Then there's the local politics failure. I assume it's the local party in control that is able to decides gerrymandering and other election issues.

I do feel pretty strongly that ridiculously lambasting Clinton as the worst candidate of all history isn't going to help much. If anything, it provides an excuse for losing to Trump without recognizing fully what happened, in terms of campaigning (practices and abuses) and in terms of our culture. Nor is killing children. I'm guessing the track record is pretty grim for governments that devolve to that extent.

Let's not pretend like we haven't killed children to 'protect our nation' in the last couple of weeks with a drone strike somewhere. That's politics too. Wouldn't it be nice if we had blood on our hands for an actual tangible reason for a change?

I'm sick of killing brown people, maybe we should at least threaten some rich white people who think that there are no consequences in life. I'm tired of 'civilized' meaning being weak.

In 2008-2009 we watched the whole economy burn and we didn't punish anyone. I'm not going to just calmly accept it this time. HRC's campaign is that kind of cosmic **** up. Someone needs to be impaled on a stake in the public square so that people know that you can't **** up like this and be OK. Obviously I'm speaking figuratively here, but if we let the Democratic establishment get away with this they won't learn from it.

Just look at the posts in this very thread. They are already trying to pretend like it got stolen from them when they got beat three dozen or so different ways. HRC's collapse to Trump made the Super Bowl on Sunday look like nothing by comparison. Trump becoming president is a Leicester wins premiere league level upset and that was for good reason. This is not ok and I want everyone else to realize that this happened instead of rationalizing it.

What you want to happen, is not going to happen. Why don't you **** off?

So speak literally.

Thinking you could take Dvaut down a peg: priceless.

I can't open your eyes for you. I can however point at you and laugh. This kind of hostile aversion to reality is one of the 30 something reasons we lost. Just because something is unpleasant doesn't mean you don't have to face it to improve. Democrats need to improve dramatically or they will continue to lose every small contest, which will further erode their ability to execute their agenda.

The most obnoxious thing about this losing is that it's all self inflicted. We have more people than they do, and on 90%+ of the issues we are clearly in the right. If we played the game half as well as they did we'd have both the senate and the house of reps, we'd have blown up the filibuster, Merrick Garland would be on the Supreme Court and we'd be getting ready to replace Kennedy and RBG.

The fact that this isn't where we are comes down to one thing: political incompetence. It's time we called it what it is and demanded better. I demand better execution if I'm going to remain part of this party.

Yeah nobody thinks they took Dvaut1 down a peg. I wrote some stuff that Dvaut probably at least partially agrees with and he tried to tie Dvaut to the other side of the argument. Dude's a legit legend in this subforum and a very good poster. Wanting to read his posts is one of the only reasons I bother posting here.

yet more generic low-content posting

Says the guy who hasn't posted any content in this thread at all. This is the last post of yours I'll ever have to read. Peace out homey.

EDIT: I think I've been very specific about what I want done. That's content. The people who have responded to me have mostly either gone straw man, 'nah it's fine as is we got robbed it'll be better next time', and 'nanananananananana I have my fingers in my ears I can't hear you nananananananananana'. I officially declare victory over this thread. You've all had plenty of opportunities to refute a single point I've made and none of you have. Not even close. GG boys.

16 republicans had to race 16 other republicans.she had to race him heads up. she's a bigger name than any of those 16 republicans.they also didn't take trump seriously at first (nobody did) but she got to see him win the republican nomination (and unlike her he didn't rig the primary he won) so by that point he shouldn't have even had the advantage of her not taking him seriously. instead she was lazy and complacent as though it was a forgone conclusion she was going to win despite the fact most of the country hates her also.he completely outcampaigned her in time and effort by a landslide. and i'm not even convinced he was trying to win. it was a total fail on her part and it will eat away at her every day for the rest of her life.despite all her backing,connections and notoriety she had to cheat to beat a socialist jew almost nobody had ever heard of before. she's a joke of a candidate.

If most of the country hates her, how did she get 2,900,000 more votes?