Yeah except generally schools are non-profit enterprises. I mean, there CURRENTLY EXIST private schools that specifically look for kids with learning disabilities, etc.

You realize that the "private schooling" boogeyman isn't like this one big monolithic entity that would be tasked with "educating all children," right?

I know that it is not one entity. However, I believe in universal education, and I think that society is better off when everyone receives a basic education... So, I've asked op (and, I suppose other who support vouchers) to clarify for me (a) will public schools still exist to provide a safety net for students who are not accepted by private schools or (b) will private entities be forced to accept any student who applies?

Because if you are eliminating public schools while not requiring private schools to take all applicants, then I think there will be a lot of students who receive no education because private actors won't want to deal with the "hard" students. If, otoh, public schools will still remain for the kids who don't get cherry picked by the private schools, then you still have the bad public schools, right?

So, what's your fix?

So why do "private actors" currently exist that deal with special-needs students?

I mean, if you "believe in universal education" (nice appeal to emotion btw, implying the other guy thinks some people are below some threshold and are unworthy of being educated) nobody would stop YOU from stepping up, taking the voucher money, and educating such students that nobody else wants. You realize that, yes?

[QUOTE=Ashington;33073847]Under your voucher plan, would you be giving parents a voucher equal to the amount they paid in (for example) the previous year in property taxes?

What if the family pays very little in property taxes because they live in a **** hole house in a **** hole neighborhood? Do you think that will cover a year's tuition at a private school? Or do we pay them enough to cover all the tuition at a private school?

There would be different levels of private schools just like there are different levels of private colleges. Parents would have to start thinking about the cost of education before they decided to have a kid.


Family A has one child and pays $3000 a year in property tax.
Family B has one child and pays $800 a year in property tax.

They attend the same school and receive the same quality of education. Are you telling me that family A isn't subsidizing family B? It doesn't matter if it is food, housing, or education. Its welfare.

But cost of education for those kids is 12000$/year so they're both on welfare!

If you feel that way about other people's education then by all means feel free to donate money for scholarships for kids who can't afford an education.

Let businesses create scholarship programs for kids and then give them internships as they get older.

There are plenty of ways that education for "poor" people would still exist even if the school system was completely private.

Taking money from someone else at gunpoint (taxes) is still stealing even if the money goes to a "good cause".

There would be schools targeted at all kinds of students. "Gifted" students, students with disabilities, trade oriented.

Not every restaurant is a 5 star place to eat. If there is a market demand for a "cheaper" school it will exist.

[QUOTE=buzz12586;33076285]Basically what you are saying is that rich people everywhere are subsidizing poor people everywhere. It may be OMGZ SOCIALISM or whatever but that isn't what welfare is.

Don't get me wrong I have no problem with charity. Its a good thing to help out those that are less fortunate. What I have a problem with is when the government comes along, sticks a gun in my ribs and demands my money to give to other people. I don't get to choose who the money goes to based on who I think most deserves it.

Some do it for charitable reasons, and some do it to make money I suppose, but I don't think there are enough of these groups to pick up all of the slack for the entire government.

1) Assume that every student gets a voucher equal to the cost of educating an average student... If a student costs more than that because they have special needs and require more personalized attention, then a for profit entity will not be able to make money off of that student, so they won't take them on "as a customer"

2) Some of the private entities that exist today only do so because governments at the state level have chosen to outsource the education of certain populations to private entities. If the governments were no longer required to provide universal education, they would presumably no longer pay the full cost of sending severely challenged children to residential boarding schools, for example. They would simply cut the check and if that check wasn't enough to pay for the boarding school, then the parent is out of luck I guess?

And wrt why I don't start my own schools, I think that the profit motive doesn't really align itself that well with basic education. I'm sure I could convince plenty of yuppie parents to send their kids to my school by building a gorgeous athletic complex and serving organic food in my cafeteria, but that doesn't mean the kids are getting a great fundamental education...

I am not appealing to emotion, I am simply pointing out that I think any modern education system should provide a basic education to everyone. If you do not believe in this principle, please explain why. If you do agree with this principle, please explain how the free market can ensure an education for everyone if schools are not required to accept every student who applies.

Since you are so worried about special needs students, should they be separate from the general student body already? 1/4 of all students already fail. Wouldn't putting an emphasis(or less of one) on the 3/4 that will pass make education in this country better? It's safe to say that the smarter a student is, the less time they need from teachers, which means smarter kids are cheaper for schools. What is the constant force that makes teachers treat all students the same?

I also think it is funny that you think every child should be given a basic education by the government. When is that starting exactly?

It's called "the law." (I know, total pita)