Ron Paul 2012 Containment Thread

[Max Raker]

Originally Posted by TomCollins

It should be fairly obvious. There is a difference between understanding something and having different opinions, vs. not even having a clue other than a few keywords.

Krugman is Krugtard, but he understands economics. Soccer mom voters do not.

I was obv talking about Paul himself. Don't you think it is likely Paul and suzzer (or me or Fly etc) have close to same level of understanding but just have different opinions?

[prana]

Also the flow chart idea is right on. Saw it with like pretty much every topic and now with the FDIC.

RP FAN: RP didn't vote against MLK day

Anyone else: Uh yeah he did.

RP FAN: (after doing a google <topic> Ron Paul) well he did actually vote against MLK day but says blah blah blah

Anyone else: lol

RP Fan: Weed man, the weed laws are racist man. Why don't you want to talk about the issues?

[Brons]

I don't think having an official language is racist at all. But I don't understand how this fits into RP's 'perfect' (attempted) legislative history. Unless I look at it from his being racist/pretending to be racist side.

[MrWookie]

Originally Posted by plzd0nate

are u enjoying trolling me? i had already stated that i think it could help unite people being an american and identifies as an american IN THE LONG RUN. then i used a somewhat poor example of how if you ask someone what nationality they are how many would say american?

so countries today that have an official language where not all people speak it in the country are racist for having it?

OK, unity. So, you would force other people to adopt your ideal of what it means to be an American under the threat of not letting them take full advantage of all the rights and privileges of citizenship (they may already be citizens), or even just residency. Or, hey, you know, those recent immigrants had better know English or learn it pretty damn fast, because no ****in' way are we translating one syllable of our laws or regulations to help them out in their new country. America, **** yeah!

And you still haven't stated why this unity is such a good thing. You assert that it's good per se, and I don't buy it.

[MrWookie]

Originally Posted by krmont22

I don't know. Seems fine to me. I think having the laws in other languages so other citizens who don't know english can read them is good, but to have congressman speaking other languages during a procession seems bad.

Does that happen? If it were to, are interpreters and translators such horrible people to employ?

Like, if the son of German immigrants gets elected to congress in a district that contains a large number of German immigrants and their children, and he goes back home during recess and, at a town hall, speaks German with them, is America going to break apart?

[krmont22]

Originally Posted by steelhouse

I think you should look into full reserve checking accounts. Irving Fisher probably the most well known economist of the 20th century behind Keynes devoted his whole last book to it, "100% Money".

Yes, we don't need FDIC insurance but we definitely don't need free banking. We need full reserve banking and close to balanced budgets.

Thanks! Reading about all of it now. What do you mean by "free banking"?

[suzzer99]

Originally Posted by tannenj

everything you've posted is of course correct. suzzer tends not to think things through. in all seriousness, he thinks that taking into consideration the implications of a law or a statement leads to reductio ad absurdum arguments and that it's bad to approach things this way.

people like suzzer see that many banks are unreliable these days and assume that this will always be the case. they can't wrap their heads around the idea that under a system in which everyone wasn't responsible for everyone else's mistakes, accountability would lead to trustworthiness. they can't wrap their heads around the premises of capitalism, basically.

You mean like how banks were unreliable during the depression? And in all the panics up until then? And how we haven't had a run on the banks since?

[[Phill]]

Originally Posted by plzd0nate

are u enjoying trolling me? i had already stated that i think it could help unite people being an american and identifies as an american IN THE LONG RUN. then i used a somewhat poor example of how if you ask someone what nationality they are how many would say american?

so countries today that have an official language where not all people speak it in the country are racist for having it?

I think its quite a bold assumption you are making that everyone who has ever migrated to America in the past all spoke English. That is what you are assuming, right? That the current Spanish speaking Latino migration to America is some entirely new phenomenon that has no historic parallels to learn from?

[suzzer99]

Originally Posted by krmont22

Thanks! Reading about all of it now. What do you mean by "free banking"?

Dude, it's steelhouse, if you are looking for logically thought-out answers and stuff you should probably look elsewhere. steelhouse is pretty Zen with the facts and logic.

[[Phill]]

Advocating for full reserve banking is like saying people should just buy horses instead of cars because it worked so awesomely until people engineered a completely superior vehicle. Incidentally fractional reserve banking has existed longer than the car and has been tested by time, science and the free market, yet for some reason full reserve has become fashionable amongst some people around here who i can only assume have started reading about the history of money but are still stuck a few centuries behind modern times in the early chapters.

[plzd0nate]

Originally Posted by MrWookie

OK, unity. So, you would force other people to adopt your ideal of what it means to be an American under the threat of not letting them take full advantage of all the rights and privileges of citizenship (they may already be citizens), or even just residency. Or, hey, you know, those recent immigrants had better know English or learn it pretty damn fast, because no ****in' way are we translating one syllable of our laws or regulations to help them out in their new country. America, **** yeah!

And you still haven't stated why this unity is such a good thing. You assert that it's good per se, and I don't buy it.

JUST BECAUSE MITT ROMNEY AND WHOEVER THE F ELSE want to do certain things with an official language DOES NOT mean i want those exact same things done. please stop being so ignorant. all i think is that english should be on paper our official language. whether or not that actually does anything positive is irrelevant because i dont think it does anything bad. im not saying that anyone should be forced to learn a language and im not saying they have to ever even speak it. i also could care less if it ever happens. i think you are a fool tho if you think someone would not feel more american knowing english than if they continued to speak another language the rest of their life. and if they want to speak another language thats cool too and its their right.

[krmont22]

Originally Posted by suzzer99

Dude, it's steelhouse, if you are looking for logically thought-out answers and stuff you should probably look elsewhere. steelhouse is pretty Zen with the facts and logic.

Seems like he did provide reasons and sources I still am interested in why you are afraid of repealing the CRA...

[MrWookie]

Also, asserting that because tons of other countries do something, it can't really be racist is pretty bad. Most countries are pretty damn racist. Look at, say, Japan's immigration policy, or immigration policy for most of Europe. Look at how difficult and racist it is to even try to attain citizenship in those countries. America is quite good in this regard compared to most of the world, even if it could be better.

[MrWookie]

Originally Posted by plzd0nate

JUST BECAUSE MITT ROMNEY AND WHOEVER THE F ELSE want to do certain things with an official language DOES NOT mean i want those exact same things done. please stop being so ignorant. all i think is that english should be on paper our official language. whether or not that actually does anything positive is irrelevant because i dont think it does anything bad. im not saying that anyone should be forced to learn a language and im not saying they have to ever even speak it. i also could care less if it ever happens. i think you are a fool tho if you think someone would not feel more american knowing english than if they continued to speak another language the rest of their life. and if they want to speak another language thats cool too and its their right.

You asked me what was so racist about mandating English as the only language of government. Well, I listed some consequences. If you don't like those, then maybe you don't actually need to have English as the official language.

[plzd0nate]

Originally Posted by [Phill]

I think its quite a bold assumption you are making that everyone who has ever migrated to America in the past all spoke English. That is what you are assuming, right? That the current Spanish speaking Latino migration to America is some entirely new phenomenon that has no historic parallels to learn from?

what? no not even close. never did i say that or did i ever think that. we have immigrants come from all over the world still to this day and i think is that if we have an official language (just on paper, no racist policies forcing ppl to learn english) it will unite ppl more. thats i i believe.